Brussels Airlines in 2023

[crew1990]

In the meantime, OO-SNO has just got a 2 days retrofit and became the first one to get the new Geven Essenza seat, instead of the Recaro one, to allign with the Lufthansa group. This is a major improvement for PAX comfort and will allow in the futur the possibility to get USB port.

[convair]

Although the group is still in the reds, the improvement over Q1 of last year is remarkable, especially for Swiss that is the only airline to report a positive EBIT. And the forecast for the full year 2023 is encouraging for the whole group.

Don’t forget EBIT is before interest and tax! SN has a negative equity and has a consolidated loss of about 175 mio euro, the interests they have to pay must be considerable. Lets wait to see the net profit/loss before drawing conclusions.

I'm not drawing conclusions; I'm just seeing encouraging signs. Their debt is still high, although a big step was the re-imbursement of the big state loan of 290 millon € last December. But there's still a long way to go for sure.

[luchtzak]

In the meantime, OO-SNO has just got a 2 days retrofit and became the first one to get the new Geven Essenza seat, instead of the Recaro one, to allign with the Lufthansa group. This is a major improvement for PAX comfort and will allow in the futur the possibility to get USB port.

Indeed, the seats (with USB-ready space) have been installed, but the USB-ports are not yet active. Do you have a timeframe when they will be ready ? Do they still need approval by the Belgian aviation authorities ?

[PopUp]

Although the group is still in the reds, the improvement over Q1 of last year is remarkable, especially for Swiss that is the only airline to report a positive EBIT. And the forecast for the full year 2023 is encouraging for the whole group.

Don’t forget EBIT is before interest and tax! SN has a negative equity and has a consolidated loss of about 175 mio euro, the interests they have to pay must be considerable. Lets wait to see the net profit/loss before drawing conclusions.

I'm not drawing conclusions; I'm just seeing encouraging signs. Their debt is still high, although a big step was the re-imbursement of the big state loan of 290 millon € last December. But there's still a long way to go for sure.

[PopUp]

Imho, the only question to be answered is, why, inside a major group like LH, SN remains in the red ? Given the apparently low wages and working conditions, why is SN is still in the red ? I don't think
It is due to a lack if commitment of their Belgian employées at all levels.

[RoMax]

Imho, the only question to be answered is, why, inside a major group like LH, SN remains in the red ? Given the apparently low wages and working conditions, why is SN is still in the red ? I don't think
It is due to a lack if commitment of their Belgian employées at all levels.

Or you could look at it from a slightly more positive angle:
- After a traditional loss in Q1 (in line with expectations-budget) SN booked a record profit for a Q2 (after Q3 in 2022 was also a record Q3 performance already - after which LH also provided SN with the funds to do the advance re-payment of the Belgian state loan/guarantee prior end 2022)
- Q3 and Q4 outlook is looking good and without unforeseen major events SN should close 2023 with quite solid black numbers (basically the first time for SN, earlier profits have been either thanks to 'luck' or with still poor margins - a 'positive break-even')
- For the first time SN has view on (so far) 5 confirmed factory new aircraft
- LH sent 2 additional A320's to SN this summer in an initially unforeseen opportunistic growth effort in BRU (aircraft that came from EW and could have easily went elsewhere in the group - but rather they saw the best use of those in BRU)
- A 9th A330 (and as already mentioned by others here...more seems to be coming) wasn't yet foreseen at this stage at time of the Covid re-organisation, but recovery is strong and LH Group wants to grow in the high-potential Africa market through SN
- SN is again after years of crisis management doing tangible investments in the product such the complete renovation of the Sunrise lounge, the new short-haul catering offer (which - in view of a lacklustre reaction on this topic already here - of course depends of flight length and time of the day, but at least in terms of concept re-alligns SN to other competitors with fresh food, real cutlery, ... instead of a packed Foodmaker salad with wood cutlery), re-introducing the highly missed 'service details' that were cut some years ago due to savings such as ice-cream on long haul and the Neuhaus gift box in long haul Business Class, etc. (and more to come) --> we are talking a cost of millions in product investments
- An easily forgotten/ignored or mis-intrepreted event: in the last 1.5 year SN (re)launched flights to FRA, MUC and ZRH. A cost-optimisation effort in the group to reduce unnecessary nightstops in each others' hubs. But while those flights might not sound sexy for the average aviation geek, they are 'not unimportant' financially wise... And before the complaint 'of course, they 'steal' all the BRU market to the other hubs' - please have some realistic views on how airline networks works, SN can't serve the world by itself and can never become a second KLM (Sabena could have seized that strategic hub opportunity in the -70/80's but it's KLM that ran away with it before anyone else even realised what was happening)

Not sure what sort of miracles some people expect from an airline (taking with it its Sabena legacy) that was basically NEVER structurally profitable yet.
Not sure what people expect from a semi-premium network carrier based and headquartered in Belgium (with which comes the cost of all those words I used there) that gets a multi-million bottom line impact every year due to the distorted competitive landscape in Belgium where one of Ryanairs' largest continental bases (!!) is still subsidised en masse as if it's a regional remote airport reliant on the few flight activities it can get. It might be another one of Ryanair's core activities to go to court against everyone and everything, but it says something about the severety of the situation that SN files a formal complaint to the European Commission about this situation (fully supported by LH Group).

The pessimism on this forum is a bit depressing. I've been following this forum for quite a number of years now and have become very inactive posting in last years for various reasons....
Over the years plenty of people here predicted SN to go bankrupt countless times, like Ryanair (in the media) saying SN would end-up being a marginal airline that would 'if surviving' not transport more than a few million pax per year, etc. etc. Well, at the time of the rebranding in 2021 the message of SN was 'we are here to stay!' and considering all the above and with a so far for SN record financial performance in the last quarters I wouldn't say that was a statement out of ignorance or stupidity.

[A321Lufthansa]

In the meantime, OO-SNO has just got a 2 days retrofit and became the first one to get the new Geven Essenza seat, instead of the Recaro one, to allign with the Lufthansa group. This is a major improvement for PAX comfort and will allow in the futur the possibility to get USB port.

Do you have a photo of them?

[crew1990]

We do have some picture internally but I hope you understand I can't share it before SN release it. But this is a totally new cabin, new seat, new colour, much more stylish, dark grey with a red line, new head rest cover dark grey as well with the new SN logo, no more navy blue, the carpet on the floor is different as well. It looks really nice. Since SNO is back in like, it will not take long to have some picture of the inside.

For the USB port, I have no date about it, it's subject to budget approval but it will definely gonna come.

[Stij]

Or you could look at it from a slightly more positive angle:
- After a traditional loss in Q1 (in line with expectations-budget) SN booked a record profit for a Q2 (after Q3 in 2022 was also a record Q3 performance already - after which LH also provided SN with the funds to do the advance re-payment of the Belgian state loan/guarantee prior end 2022)
- Q3 and Q4 outlook is looking good and without unforeseen major events SN should close 2023 with quite solid black numbers (basically the first time for SN, earlier profits have been either thanks to 'luck' or with still poor margins - a 'positive break-even')
- For the first time SN has view on (so far) 5 confirmed factory new aircraft
- LH sent 2 additional A320's to SN this summer in an initially unforeseen opportunistic growth effort in BRU (aircraft that came from EW and could have easily went elsewhere in the group - but rather they saw the best use of those in BRU)
- A 9th A330 (and as already mentioned by others here...more seems to be coming) wasn't yet foreseen at this stage at time of the Covid re-organisation, but recovery is strong and LH Group wants to grow in the high-potential Africa market through SN
- SN is again after years of crisis management doing tangible investments in the product such the complete renovation of the Sunrise lounge, the new short-haul catering offer (which - in view of a lacklustre reaction on this topic already here - of course depends of flight length and time of the day, but at least in terms of concept re-alligns SN to other competitors with fresh food, real cutlery, ... instead of a packed Foodmaker salad with wood cutlery), re-introducing the highly missed 'service details' that were cut some years ago due to savings such as ice-cream on long haul and the Neuhaus gift box in long haul Business Class, etc. (and more to come) --> we are talking a cost of millions in product investments
- An easily forgotten/ignored or mis-intrepreted event: in the last 1.5 year SN (re)launched flights to FRA, MUC and ZRH. A cost-optimisation effort in the group to reduce unnecessary nightstops in each others' hubs. But while those flights might not sound sexy for the average aviation geek, they are 'not unimportant' financially wise... And before the complaint 'of course, they 'steal' all the BRU market to the other hubs' - please have some realistic views on how airline networks works, SN can't serve the world by itself and can never become a second KLM (Sabena could have seized that strategic hub opportunity in the -70/80's but it's KLM that ran away with it before anyone else even realised what was happening)

Not sure what sort of miracles some people expect from an airline (taking with it its Sabena legacy) that was basically NEVER structurally profitable yet.
Not sure what people expect from a semi-premium network carrier based and headquartered in Belgium (with which comes the cost of all those words I used there) that gets a multi-million bottom line impact every year due to the distorted competitive landscape in Belgium where one of Ryanairs' largest continental bases (!!) is still subsidised en masse as if it's a regional remote airport reliant on the few flight activities it can get. It might be another one of Ryanair's core activities to go to court against everyone and everything, but it says something about the severety of the situation that SN files a formal complaint to the European Commission about this situation (fully supported by LH Group).

The pessimism on this forum is a bit depressing. I've been following this forum for quite a number of years now and have become very inactive posting in last years for various reasons....
Over the years plenty of people here predicted SN to go bankrupt countless times, like Ryanair (in the media) saying SN would end-up being a marginal airline that would 'if surviving' not transport more than a few million pax per year, etc. etc. Well, at the time of the rebranding in 2021 the message of SN was 'we are here to stay!' and considering all the above and with a so far for SN record financial performance in the last quarters I wouldn't say that was a statement out of ignorance or stupidity.

Thank-you very much for your very informative, positive but realistic post.

[oldblueeyes]

Imho, the only question to be answered is, why, inside a major group like LH, SN remains in the red ? Given the apparently low wages and working conditions, why is SN is still in the red ? I don't think It is due to a lack if commitment of their Belgian employées at all levels.

Well, there might be a multitude of causes here as the world is not black/white and all of them are causing some pressure.

I would just mention few of them:

1. Infrastructure
- you like it or not, you have 50km away Charleroi with different cost structure for LCC and from a non Belgian prospective driven by regional/ethnical pride

2. Competitive landscape
- we like it or not, the routes of todays's company is not the SAbena legacy but the merged mix of a regional company (SN) and a LCC
- the strong market shares of Ryanair , Wizz and co are playing also a role, as Belgium does not have a very large hub environment
- taking all this into account, the yield generally expected by the market is overall lower than somewhere else

3. Company set up, fleet, size etc
- we speak about a Belgian company with a Belgian base paying local wages and associated costs - competing with LCC's which are either just flying in or employing pseudo self emplyed people via service contracts with a wherever based company etc etc etc.
- all in one, the company itself is still relatively small and as a recent or not so old acquisition might still have had some local redundancies in the group
- the fleet is not ideal - there was a challenge around 2010 to make the move from the AVRO's to a higher capacity subfleet - the those days local management has choosen A319 which is on todays world not the best choice anymore and thus a clear plan to move to an all 320 fleet are in place (alternative was an all C-300 / A-223 fleet, the 30 options of the LH group were initially targeted for such a scenario)

4. Changing focus
- with all the turmoil with respect to the brands positioning, there was no clear picture in the past how to position the brand and maximize it's revenues - in a pragmatic approach , not driven by local pride or bankrupt legacy memories - eg for Austrian the premium economy cabin is the most attractive product with high demand and best profitabilty per sold space, thus they were increasing the portion of this product against others, Edelweiss is having a touristic type economy plus cabin with slightly more legroom only as their poit of difference and upgraded prifitability driver on long haul;

But on the other side the current strategy seems to adress exactly these points.

And last but not least - you never look at a quarter, only - you look towards a whole business year and closed quarters and outlook on coming months ( bookings in advance give internally clear trends) are showing you the whole picture.

[Homo Aeroportus]

Possible price increase on flights to Ouaga?

Air France had decided on Monday to cancel all flights 07AUG to 11AUG with destinations NIM, BKO, and OUA.

Below is the letter sent today by ANAC, the Civil Aviation Authority in Burkina Faso.

ANAC expresses their "preoccupations" and informs Air France that
... "therefore the resumption of your activities will require the prior approval of a new flight program for the rest of the summer 2023 season"

H.A.

[Darjeeling]

No LBV (difficult to tag it on with another destination), WDH (EW territory, VFR and leisure) ou Southern destinations (EK and QR are too powerful).

If extra flights to AFI are being considered it will only be Nigeria destinations (LOS/ABV even Kano). Lufthansa board has recently expressed there is room for two actors of the LH Group.

[rwandan-flyer]

30 pax per flight to Luanda. it's very very low. I hope it's not the average load factor during the year, because i wonder how the airline can be profitable on this route (excluding the tag with Kinshasa) ? Huge demand in biz class and for cargo ?

The airline aims to minimise fuel consumption and crew flight time. The cancellation affects a small portion of passengers, around 30 per flight, with alternatives offered through Frankfurt or Lisbon. Flights to other African destinations, excluding Burkina Faso and neighbouring Niger, are expected to continue.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... two-weeks/

[PopUp]

If, in general, there are few pax to Luanda, would it not be worthwhile considering the A321XLR to fly this route nonstop ?
As you will see in the link below, it is possible to offer wide-body business class, Premium econony and standard economy.
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft ... e-ambience
If cargo makes the current flights profitable or at least make them break even, then the A321XLR can probably not be considered.

[PopUp]

No LBV (difficult to tag it on with another destination), WDH (EW territory, VFR and leisure) ou Southern destinations (EK and QR are too powerful).

If extra flights to AFI are being considered it will only be Nigeria destinations (LOS/ABV even Kano). Lufthansa board has recently expressed there is room for two actors of the LH Group.

For once, I would say leave all of Nigeria to LH. Difficult and very dangerous country. Kano is too much up north and prone to serious instability like Mali, imho. LOS is a nightmare. I don't know about Abuja. You might be tempted to tell me that SN has been used to "difficult" situations in Africa and you would be right. But do not add to the current problems. Leave most of English-speaking Africa to the other members of the Group (I said "most", not all).

I admit I have not followed to expansion or re-organisation of SN's West and Central Africa network, so correct me if I am wrong.
I seem to remember that SN flew or is still flying a triangular BRU-DLA-NSI-BRU.

What about (just a suggestion or a question) BRU-NSI-LBV ? And could DLA (if it is not yet) just be served alone ? Or with a tag-on to, for instance, Point-Noire or Brazzaville (traffic rights permitting).

If there is room for a second player in the Group to an African destination, I would go for SN to WDH which is still underserved. Or am I wrong ?

[rwandan-flyer]

If, in general, there are few pax to Luanda, would it not be worthwhile considering the A321XLR to fly this route nonstop ?
As you will see in the link below, it is possible to offer wide-body business class, Premium econony and standard economy.
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft ... e-ambience
If cargo makes the current flights profitable or at least make them break even, then the A321XLR can probably not be considered.

But if cargo demande is high, it will be complicated for A321XLR. There not many airlines that can "play" with capacities in Africa.

Even KLM is not really interested: The A321XLR is expected to be delivered to the first customers next year, in 2024. Transavia and KLM, which will fly with the 'regular' A321neo, have no plans to include the XLR version in their fleet. At KLM, long-haul flights remain the domain of wide-body aircraft. https://luchtvaartnieuws-nl.translate.g ... r_pto=wapp

KLM had huge network so they can easly fill their widebodies aircraft to Africa

Royal Air Maroc and Turkish Airlines operates lots of narrowbodies but with daily flights anf can easly with capacities. But in some days, Turkish Airlines uses A330s on many routes, in Africa (exluding long haul routes to South Africa, Angola, Mauritius or Madagascar)

AF has also a huge network but also a huge point to point demand. However they didn't yet find the aircraft that will replace the A330-200.

Currently only TAP is happy to use A321Neo family in Africa. In 2017 Swiss considered to add A321LR on Africa routes (i guess new routes) where the A330 is too big. But no infos since https://aviationweek.com/air-transport/ ... ica-routes

No LBV (difficult to tag it on with another destination), WDH (EW territory, VFR and leisure) ou Southern destinations (EK and QR are too powerful).

If extra flights to AFI are being considered it will only be Nigeria destinations (LOS/ABV even Kano). Lufthansa board has recently expressed there is room for two actors of the LH Group.

If there is room for a second player in the Group to an African destination, I would go for SN to WDH which is still underserved. Or am I wrong ?

Yes and no. QR will temporarily suspend flights to WDH (https://travelnews.africa/news-single.h ... um=twitter), however KLM will resume flights while Edelweiss will start flights to WDH in the next 12 months. https://thebrief.com.na/index.php/compa ... ek-flights

[lumumba]

30 pax per flight to Luanda. it's very very low. I hope it's not the average load factor during the year, because i wonder how the airline can be profitable on this route (excluding the tag with Kinshasa) ? Huge demand in biz class and for cargo ?

The airline aims to minimise fuel consumption and crew flight time. The cancellation affects a small portion of passengers, around 30 per flight, with alternatives offered through Frankfurt or Lisbon. Flights to other African destinations, excluding Burkina Faso and neighbouring Niger, are expected to continue.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... two-weeks/

That's not correct the average passengers per flight to Luanda is 60...with high yield this because FIH without FIH they could do better.
They have to re-examine there strategy on this flight maybe with an A321XLR they are one of the first one that where flying to LAD and they didn't grow why in the mean time others did!

[crew1990]

30 pax per flight to Luanda. it's very very low. I hope it's not the average load factor during the year, because i wonder how the airline can be profitable on this route (excluding the tag with Kinshasa) ? Huge demand in biz class and for cargo ?

The airline aims to minimise fuel consumption and crew flight time. The cancellation affects a small portion of passengers, around 30 per flight, with alternatives offered through Frankfurt or Lisbon. Flights to other African destinations, excluding Burkina Faso and neighbouring Niger, are expected to continue.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... two-weeks/

That's not correct the average passengers per flight to Luanda is 60...with high yield this because FIH without FIH they could do better.
They have to re-examine there strategy on this flight maybe with an A321XLR they are one of the first one that where flying to LAD and they didn't grow why in the mean time others did!

Wrong, SN growed in LAD there where in the past 2 weekly flight BRU-LAD-FIH-BRU then SN got a 3rd right to to fly to LAD, so they added a 3rd BRU-LAD-FIH-BRU flight. This is the traffic right wich are a limitant factor. Flying just BRU-LAD-BRU would mean that the crew would need to stay 3 night there. From an utilisation of the ressources perspective, this is not a good option. And SN could never fill a full A330 just with LAD. Also forget about A321LR/XLR, this is not the plan of the group to get some, and IF (with a very very low probability) SN would get them, it would be to fly to north America (less cargo) or eventually holiday destination where cargo demand and comfort expectation is lower.

[convair]

That's not correct the average passengers per flight to Luanda is 60...with high yield this because FIH without FIH they could do better.
They have to re-examine there strategy on this flight maybe with an A321XLR they are one of the first one that where flying to LAD and they didn't grow why in the mean time others did!

This is interesting and worth further consideration. I personnally don't like narrow bodies for medium/long haul. Looking for an alternate that would enable SN to operate LAD on non-triangle flights, I remembered one of the Airbus models I particularly liked: the A310.
I know it has been out of operation for years, but do you think such an aircraft (with updated instruments technology and engines) or a similar one could be suitable for that kind of flights?

[lumumba]

30 pax per flight to Luanda. it's very very low. I hope it's not the average load factor during the year, because i wonder how the airline can be profitable on this route (excluding the tag with Kinshasa) ? Huge demand in biz class and for cargo ?






https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... two-weeks/

That's not correct the average passengers per flight to Luanda is 60...with high yield this because FIH without FIH they could do better.
They have to re-examine there strategy on this flight maybe with an A321XLR they are one of the first one that where flying to LAD and they didn't grow why in the mean time others did!

Wrong, SN growed in LAD there where in the past 2 weekly flight BRU-LAD-FIH-BRU then SN got a 3rd right to to fly to LAD, so they added a 3rd BRU-LAD-FIH-BRU flight. This is the traffic right wich are a limitant factor. Flying just BRU-LAD-BRU would mean that the crew would need to stay 3 night there. From an utilisation of the ressources perspective, this is not a good option. And SN could never fill a full A330 just with LAD. Also forget about A321LR/XLR, this is not the plan of the group to get some, and IF (with a very very low probability) SN would get them, it would be to fly to north America (less cargo) or eventually holiday destination where cargo demand and comfort expectation is lower.

That's a very tiny grow if you know there where one of the first from 120 to 180 passengers a week!
For the crew they can work like the others and arrive in the morning and leave in the evening the crew rest overday.
SN don't fly much cargo to Luanda by the way.