Brussels Airlines' fleet renewal

[HQ_BRU_Lover]

When will OO-SBB be painted in TML c/s? When is OO-SBD expected to enter service? Again a one month wait needed for adaptations or do things go quicker now?

[nordikcam]

When will OO-SBB be painted in TML c/s? When is OO-SBD expected to enter service? Again a one month wait needed for adaptations or do things go quicker now?

And when OO-SFC will come back from MAN ? Thx

[skumfiduse]

When will OO-SBB be painted in TML c/s? When is OO-SBD expected to enter service? Again a one month wait needed for adaptations or do things go quicker now?

And when OO-SFC will come back from MAN ? Thx

Let's throw in one more question How about D-AIKG/OO-SFP?

[oldblueeyes]

Likely when the A359 / B789 queue will be smaller.
There is a need of 4-5 A359 with First in MUC to transfer the remaining A346 to FRA. Likely this should take place in autumn.
Than, once the B789 delivered would exceed additional B789 for Austrian and A343 retirements, more A333 would be free for reallocation.

[TimTam]

That is all long haul. I understand (correct me if I ma wrong) that allocating new or additional aircraft to airlines of the LH Group is a "Group" decision.
My conclusion is, again, that the top managers of LH Group and SN do not see SN as a priority and do not recognize SN's needs both long and short-medium haul. I will not join the long-haul discussion.
For the short and medium haul, my question is : is it not a (big) mistake to let SN fly the A320 only on those destinations ?
OS has Embraers and LX A220s.
Imho, to be able to fully play its role, SN should not only get A320s, but also either the E-175-E2 (OS operates Embraers, so not unfamiliar within the Group)
https://www.embraercommercialaviation.c ... rcial-jet/
or the A220-100 (which is my favorite) (LX operates A220s)
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft/a220/a220-100.
The A320 is too big for some European destinations.
What do the experts here think of it ?

[Atlantis]

That is all long haul. I understand (correct me if I ma wrong) that allocating new or additional aircraft to airlines of the LH Group is a "Group" decision.
My conclusion is, again, that the top managers of LH Group and SN do not see SN as a priority and do not recognize SN's needs both long and short-medium haul. I will not join the long-haul discussion.
For the short and medium haul, my question is : is it not a (big) mistake to let SN fly the A320 only on those destinations ?
OS has Embraers and LX A220s.
Imho, to be able to fully play its role, SN should not only get A320s, but also either the E-175-E2 (OS operates Embraers, so not unfamiliar within the Group)
https://www.embraercommercialaviation.c ... rcial-jet/
or the A220-100 (which is my favorite) (LX operates A220s)
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft/a220/a220-100.
The A320 is too big for some European destinations.
What do the experts here think of it ?

Well, the experts gave you already thousands of times the explanation but you still don't understand it

[Miqvell]

New article but also payware :
"Fleet planning is progressing [for expansion in Africa], but Brussels has to take a back seat for now, according to CEO von Boxberg"

Source : https://www.airliners.de/staerkung-dreh ... eren/73841

[TimTam]

That is all long haul. I understand (correct me if I ma wrong) that allocating new or additional aircraft to airlines of the LH Group is a "Group" decision.
My conclusion is, again, that the top managers of LH Group and SN do not see SN as a priority and do not recognize SN's needs both long and short-medium haul. I will not join the long-haul discussion.
For the short and medium haul, my question is : is it not a (big) mistake to let SN fly the A320 only on those destinations ?
OS has Embraers and LX A220s.
Imho, to be able to fully play its role, SN should not only get A320s, but also either the E-175-E2 (OS operates Embraers, so not unfamiliar within the Group)
https://www.embraercommercialaviation.c ... rcial-jet/
or the A220-100 (which is my favorite) (LX operates A220s)
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft/a220/a220-100.
The A320 is too big for some European destinations.

No longer a question, but a statement.

[Delta Sierra]

* OO-SFP will go to DUS in two weeks for small cabin modification before the transition to Brussels Airlines
* OO-SBE is now foreseen for the 24th of May
* OO-SBD is now foreseen for the 13th of June

[oldblueeyes]

E 175 was never needed by the group as on typical stage length the CRJ's had better economics.
Now the model is obsolet and this size won't be Re ordered for any group airline.

For A220 again, SN would need to prove a Business case :
- that it can operate them profitable
- In markets where there is no group alternative
- and can afford the investment
- ...In a subfleet size that is reasonably high

Likely there is no numbers based business case to match all boxes.

And eraliest Timing for New 221 is when the E 190 flying into LCY would be due for replacement.

[JOVAN2]

That is all long haul. I understand (correct me if I ma wrong) that allocating new or additional aircraft to airlines of the LH Group is a "Group" decision.
My conclusion is, again, that the top managers of LH Group and SN do not see SN as a priority and do not recognize SN's needs both long and short-medium haul. I will not join the long-haul discussion.
For the short and medium haul, my question is : is it not a (big) mistake to let SN fly the A320 only on those destinations ?
OS has Embraers and LX A220s.
Imho, to be able to fully play its role, SN should not only get A320s, but also either the E-175-E2 (OS operates Embraers, so not unfamiliar within the Group)
https://www.embraercommercialaviation.c ... rcial-jet/
or the A220-100 (which is my favorite) (LX operates A220s)
https://aircraft.airbus.com/en/aircraft/a220/a220-100.
The A320 is too big for some European destinations.
What do the experts here think of it ?

Well, the experts gave you already thousands of times the explanation but you still don't understand it

Atlantis,
Let us be serious , there are no real experts on this forum.
Just Aviation enthousiast.

Some would-be experts use arrogant style to appear more clever. Quod non.

[oldblueeyes]

You don't need to be an expert to make a difference between a dream and an educated guess.

Information if public and it needs just few clicks, reading, understanding and a check if something fits locally.

Just a sum of public Information available to everyone:
- annual and quartely reports
- investor presentations and roadshows
- investor conferences
- executives Interviews- most of them in the regular enthusiast websites

Being Informed does not mean to be arrogant - just better prepared and not ignorant.

[fcw]

Let us be serious , there are no real experts on this forum.
Just Aviation enthousiast.

Some would-be experts use arrogant style to appear more clever. Quod non.

Maybe no aviation experts, experts in trolling on the other hand…

[JOVAN2]

It remains strange that Spohr launches news about Brussels to become a hub for USA to Africa traffic.

UA.AC and SN have hardly 7 or 8 flights a day.
SN flies mostly to french speaking countries in Africa. Not hot spots for US citizens...

At the same time SN has to downsize European network, cancelling most of their UK destinations.

We can expect AF/KL, to beat SN/ Spohr
by 10-1 .
Just see the networks via AMS and CDG versus BRU.

[nordikcam]

It remains strange that Spohr launches news about Brussels to become a hub for USA to Africa traffic.

UA.AC and SN have hardly 7 or 8 flights a day.
SN flies mostly to french speaking countries in Africa. Not hot spots for US citizens...

At the same time SN has to downsize European network, cancelling most of their UK destinations.

We can expect AF/KL, to beat SN/ Spohr
by 10-1 .
Just see the networks via AMS and CDG versus BRU.

And so this would be the “good” reason for doing nothing, for not planning, for not inventing...

They canceled Birmingham for the summer season...not "most"...

Sierra Leone, Liberia, Cameroun, Gambia, Rwanda, Uganda, Kenya, Ghana are countries with an english-speaking diaspora...

[Miqvell]

At the same time SN has to downsize European network, cancelling most of their UK destinations.

Well, only BHX is gone now, EDI is now planned for next winter.

[Lux_avi]

What's an aviation expert anyway?

Most are self proclaimed.
Some get invited on TV while they have no professional background in aviation at all, and are presented as "aviation experts

Intelligence is also the capability to listen to others and get smarter with their input (even more if it is a professional input).

[luchtzak]

This topic is about the fleet of Brussels Airlines. Please go back on-topic!

[TimTam]

It remains strange that Spohr launches news about Brussels to become a hub for USA to Africa traffic.

UA.AC and SN have hardly 7 or 8 flights a day.
SN flies mostly to french speaking countries in Africa. Not hot spots for US citizens...

At the same time SN has to downsize European network, cancelling most of their UK destinations.

We can expect AF/KL, to beat SN/ Spohr
by 10-1 .
Just see the networks via AMS and CDG versus BRU.

To a large extent I agree with you. It is not a coincidence that Spohr made this announcement at the time of social unrest at SN. A promise that will not be kept because it cannot be kept with the current LH Group strategy towards SN. Not seeing the contradiction might be naive.

[oldblueeyes]

You can compare apples to apples - CDG and AMS to FRA+MUC+ZRH.

The markets BRU serves are not core for LH. So BRU would get some additional connectivity to fill capacity, not more, not less.

You're overestimating your brand and it's role, hence the frustration vs your dreams.

See the facts - although you won't like them :
- the Premium brands are Swiss and LH - with First offerings and New/ although delayed Premium cabin Produkt
- second would come ITA - simply by long haul fleet size and importance of the market
- leisure travel / Discover+ Edelweiss in the large markets is more important than small brands, due to synergies and competition
- OS and SN complete the picture as complementary offering - not less, not more ; they would get their fair growth share, but this follows the rest

In a nutshell : the A350 for Edelweiss were more important for the group, and scaling up Discover as well.

SN has a clear path - A 319-》 A320 to compete in a LCC Environment and some additional written off A330 for minor interest markets. That's what you get.

- no 80 seaters, as the whole group got rid of them
- no models which can't play a role for more group brands
- no dwarf diversification
- no local approach that could harm group efficiency

Again here, the role split is clear :
- intra European Hub is MUC
- feeding of the major 3 hubs / with FCO 4 comes after