[off topic]Traditions change quicker than the conservative mind[on topic]
Brussels Airlines in 2021
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
It is no secret that SN suffers from brand awareness and recognition since its creation. In Belgium, they are flagged as Flemish, not Belgian.oldblueeyes wrote: ↑19 Nov 2021, 12:51The more interesting question would be .. what is the Belgian identity and is this a topic were perceptions are different in the two major ethnic groups?Conti764 wrote: ↑18 Nov 2021, 17:36 I don't understand why there should be any Belgian flag or colors on an SN plane? Other legacy carriers don't have it... KL has no Dutch flag, nor the 'national' coloŕ (orange), neither has LH, OS,... Air Belgium does, but is has the name 'Belgium' in it, as does AF, IB, AZ,... The 'Belgian identity' is PR blah blah, but a bit unlucky chosen given the result...
The livery itself. First of all, eurowhite. Love it! Mostly white planes have a classy touch to them imho...
The dots need to grow on me but I kinda like the new livery. A better solution imho would have been to at least paint Belgian landmarks (Atomium, Manneken Pis,...) or famous Belgians (Adolphe Sax, Father Damian,...) and name their planes after them, too...
But the fond they use is hideous!
Let's look around (and i am doing it as a non Belgian):
- Air France has the name of the country and the colors of the flag incorported - most likely all French would run mad if the company would change its colors; similarly the other Belgian Airline where the French region is heavily represented by investments, HQ etc. has the name of Belgium and the Belgian flag colors in the design
- KLM has neither the name of the country nor the colors of the flag in its branding; all Dutch and international passangers have no problem on recognising it as a Dutch brand ; i would not say that Brussels is a the "flemish" airline in Belgium, but it's branding follows somewhow a similar logic - it is in essence about a brand and not about a national flag
Can it be that they way both tehnic groups perceives being "Belgian" is different, despite all local patriotic approaches, likes/non-likes of the Lufthana group, nationalization dreams, socialist stupid claims on branding cost and all the other comments not related to the brand itsefl?
Behind SN’s justification to open a new chapter, there is the presence of Air Belgium’s shade which is getting bigger year after year as the latter is still up in the skies despite being mocked when they started their operations.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
Actually I was correct and I was not forcing my believes onto anyone, just stating well known and verifiable facts. And I do respect others opinions but when something incorrect is stated I do like to correct it, wether it's a popular fact or not.Poiu wrote: ↑19 Nov 2021, 18:12
You are ABSOLUTELY not correct, it’s not absolute science, but nothing more than your personal interpretation!
There are two camps, they both have their arguments, just respect the other one’s and stick to your own conviction, but please don’t state the other ones are plain wrong!
Anyway, enough offtopic, back to SN's new livery. It might not be the good old Sabena livery, which was timeless, but it's a new, fun, livery. Although it has to grow, it took me a bit before I started to like it.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
I am curious to see how it will look like (in real) on an A333 ...
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
To me, the new c/s looks like varicella (chickenpox) disease skin rash
or even more: the covid-19 structure.
However, it will be cheaper to apply and easier to transfer planes within the LH-group...
or even more: the covid-19 structure.
However, it will be cheaper to apply and easier to transfer planes within the LH-group...
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
How many of these brand judgements are driven rather by personal frustration, other (ethnic) considerations and spotter judgements having nothing in common with the real life of the company which flyes the mass of average people?
If i am looking to the actual design, i can see some similarities to the old Sabena livery adapted to current branding trends - the last Sabena design was pretty puristic as well - white body (as today), big brand (highlighted similarly in the new branding scheme), usage of blue as signal color ( done as well). So it is not that far, considering that the Sabena brand is owned by somebody else, the same blue could be problematic, the engines are hamonized within the group to arctic white and the tail is following the current design trends.
Sabena as brand as some suggested is dead - although i understand enthusiasts, it is simple nostalgia - the average customer below 35 would have any real association with the brand.
As with any brand, one needs to get used to it- let's have this discussion in 2 years time and i bet that the optical perception of the "old" brand would be vintage.
If i am looking to the actual design, i can see some similarities to the old Sabena livery adapted to current branding trends - the last Sabena design was pretty puristic as well - white body (as today), big brand (highlighted similarly in the new branding scheme), usage of blue as signal color ( done as well). So it is not that far, considering that the Sabena brand is owned by somebody else, the same blue could be problematic, the engines are hamonized within the group to arctic white and the tail is following the current design trends.
Sabena as brand as some suggested is dead - although i understand enthusiasts, it is simple nostalgia - the average customer below 35 would have any real association with the brand.
As with any brand, one needs to get used to it- let's have this discussion in 2 years time and i bet that the optical perception of the "old" brand would be vintage.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
Problem with the flight from Faro with Tomorrowland?!
Cancelled!
Cancelled!
Hasta la victoria siempre.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
Hello everybody ! Had a quick look at most post. My conclusion (fwiw) is that they wanted a new livery (what is really necessary until SN got brand new planes, if ever they get them). The livery is probably inexpensive. No problem with that. I find the front of the plane rather good, but as SkyJet mentioned, it looks like the tail has got chicken pox. Too bad.
LH's new livery looks so dark, like travelling in a hearse (nearly).
A few days ago, I flew with Tintin. May sound childish, but it make me happy.
I understand that it might be too expensive to paint every plane in a really special livery ; again too bad.
Honestly, this investment was not necessary at this moment.
At least, they could have presented three different liveries and hold a poll among their employees. No ?
Unlike oldblueeyes, I think it will be difficult to get used to a plane suffering from a disease.
LH's new livery looks so dark, like travelling in a hearse (nearly).
A few days ago, I flew with Tintin. May sound childish, but it make me happy.
I understand that it might be too expensive to paint every plane in a really special livery ; again too bad.
Honestly, this investment was not necessary at this moment.
At least, they could have presented three different liveries and hold a poll among their employees. No ?
Unlike oldblueeyes, I think it will be difficult to get used to a plane suffering from a disease.
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
Planes get new painting every 6-7 years. And the transition will be done at the time each aircraft needs anyhow a new visit to the paint shop, regardless of the livery.
To me, timing is ok :
- there is a new positioning as network airline
- 2023 there are 3 committed A320 NEOs coming, PR wise good to present them into new liveries
- many Airlines have after restructuring programs new liveries implemented- it's a psychologisch thing, for the employees staying to look forward
New Designs can also evolve - there is one now, the company is getting feedback and adapt slightly.
Lufthansa tested 40 years ago a yellow Design on a 737-200. BA had 20 years ago teils without the Union Jack, New Coke scored great in blind test but once on the market failed etc.
Marketing is a discipline for itself, but it works with data generated in statistics, focus groups etc. and it always carries tge risk that the value which has to be generated - emotional impact - goes the other way round. But the judgements are like in football 99% of these having no clue believe to be entiteled to have an unqualified opinion.
To me, timing is ok :
- there is a new positioning as network airline
- 2023 there are 3 committed A320 NEOs coming, PR wise good to present them into new liveries
- many Airlines have after restructuring programs new liveries implemented- it's a psychologisch thing, for the employees staying to look forward
New Designs can also evolve - there is one now, the company is getting feedback and adapt slightly.
Lufthansa tested 40 years ago a yellow Design on a 737-200. BA had 20 years ago teils without the Union Jack, New Coke scored great in blind test but once on the market failed etc.
Marketing is a discipline for itself, but it works with data generated in statistics, focus groups etc. and it always carries tge risk that the value which has to be generated - emotional impact - goes the other way round. But the judgements are like in football 99% of these having no clue believe to be entiteled to have an unqualified opinion.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
you heard him boys, all SN staff should mass-quit their jobsFlanker2 wrote: ↑19 Nov 2021, 19:34 Rebranding costs millions.
Repainting the tail in different colors costs more because you need to rebalance the rudder and that alone is a non-negligible cost.
Then think about new uniforms, new headrest covers, new safety cards, new catering disposables, new signs all over the place from Bhouse to hangars and check-in area, manhours spent changing websites, stickers, etc...
SN management think that they can shrug off the bad customer service of the past 18 months with a new identity.
I haven't received a refund for cancelled flights, haven't been contacted at all.
With Ryanair I was spontaneously sent a voucher without having asked for it, and then they even extended it without asking for it.
My advice to SN staff, especially the operational staff, is to look around for better jobs.
Many places are hiring with much better pay, less stress, more glam, job security and more appreciation from customers and leadership.
Now is not a good time to be in this business. Soaring oil prices, low and unstable demand, deep losses at virtually every airline, fraud by OEM's, etc...
"I love aviation", it's a bit passé, those of us who moved on from SN are doing much better both financially and in terms of general happiness, than those who stayed and the job market now is offering so many opportunities that it would be a waste not to take them.
Most employers will match your seniority without a second thought.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
if flanker says you should, you should.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
if anything, all this shows that LH is committed to SN. I have a better feeling now than 2 years ago. I hope SN has a bright future ahead under LH nowoldblueeyes wrote: ↑21 Nov 2021, 11:15 Planes get new painting every 6-7 years. And the transition will be done at the time each aircraft needs anyhow a new visit to the paint shop, regardless of the livery.
To me, timing is ok :
- there is a new positioning as network airline
- 2023 there are 3 committed A320 NEOs coming, PR wise good to present them into new liveries
- many Airlines have after restructuring programs new liveries implemented- it's a psychologisch thing, for the employees staying to look forward
New Designs can also evolve - there is one now, the company is getting feedback and adapt slightly.
Lufthansa tested 40 years ago a yellow Design on a 737-200. BA had 20 years ago teils without the Union Jack, New Coke scored great in blind test but once on the market failed etc.
Marketing is a discipline for itself, but it works with data generated in statistics, focus groups etc. and it always carries tge risk that the value which has to be generated - emotional impact - goes the other way round. But the judgements are like in football 99% of these having no clue believe to be entiteled to have an unqualified opinion.
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
OO-SFG seems still in DUB per FR24. Must have been serious to divert there instead of RTB BRU where passengers could have been, probably, better handled.
Per Flightstats.com, Golf had been put on yesterday afternoon to run SN203 to DSS tomorrow 22NOV. Only to be replaced 2 hours ago by OO-SFB.
Bravo was planned for JFK tomorrow and this flight got cancelled; also announced on BRU web site now.
H.A.
Per Flightstats.com, Golf had been put on yesterday afternoon to run SN203 to DSS tomorrow 22NOV. Only to be replaced 2 hours ago by OO-SFB.
Bravo was planned for JFK tomorrow and this flight got cancelled; also announced on BRU web site now.
H.A.
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
There are no spares on Mondays, and since SFG is still in Dublin, one flight had to be cancelled. And it's JFK again, where travellers can easily go by other airlines.Homo Aeroportus wrote: ↑21 Nov 2021, 17:02 OO-SFG seems still in DUB per FR24. Must have been serious to divert there instead of RTB BRU where passengers could have been, probably, better handled.
Per Flightstats.com, Golf had been put on yesterday afternoon to run SN203 to DSS tomorrow 22NOV. Only to be replaced 2 hours ago by OO-SFB.
Bravo was planned for JFK tomorrow and this flight got cancelled; also announced on BRU web site now.
H.A.
André
ex Sabena #26567
ex Sabena #26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
Every Sunday there are a bunch of Star Alliance flights from Dublin to:
Newark
Toronto
Frankfurt
Munich
Zurich
Warsaw
Lisbon
Istanbul
Oslo
Copenhagen
Geneva
Not to mind a bunch of transatlantic flights with non-Star Alliance flights:
Aer Lingus
Delta
Icelandair
Newark
Toronto
Frankfurt
Munich
Zurich
Warsaw
Lisbon
Istanbul
Oslo
Copenhagen
Geneva
Not to mind a bunch of transatlantic flights with non-Star Alliance flights:
Aer Lingus
Delta
Icelandair
- Airbus330lover
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
thanks but they needed place for 154 PAX and many flights were fullCharlie Roy wrote: ↑21 Nov 2021, 21:23 Every Sunday there are a bunch of Star Alliance flights from Dublin to:
Newark
Toronto
Frankfurt
Munich
Zurich
Warsaw
Lisbon
Istanbul
Oslo
Copenhagen
Geneva
Not to mind a bunch of transatlantic flights with non-Star Alliance flights:
Aer Lingus
Delta
Icelandair
- Darjeeling
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
There were more than 200 seats available on UA and LH from MUC to either JFK or EWR (3 flights) this Saturday.
Once more, I repeat, a bunch of AMATEURS. And I stick to it (the "bollekes" episode of the rebranding being another proof).
Once more, I repeat, a bunch of AMATEURS. And I stick to it (the "bollekes" episode of the rebranding being another proof).
Re: Brussels Airlines in 2021
And how would they have gotten those pax to MUC?Darjeeling wrote: ↑22 Nov 2021, 11:20 There were more than 200 seats available on UA and LH from MUC to either JFK or EWR (3 flights) this Saturday.
Once more, I repeat, a bunch of AMATEURS. And I stick to it (the "bollekes" episode of the rebranding being another proof).