Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

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Passenger
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

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airazurxtror wrote:Washington (CNN) --

U.S. Army personnel will continue to be placed in 21-day quarantine as they return home to their base in Italy, according to Williams, commander of US Army forces in Africa, who spoke to CNN from within the isolation area by military video conference.

The quarantine procedure is meant to reassure both military families and the Italian government that the US is doing everything it can to protect troops, the families and the surrounding communities, Williams said. He noted the Italians had expressed concerns about troops returning to Vicenza after serving in Liberia.

Williams outlined to CNN the quarantine conditions in detail. He said food is left in a room by a team that departs before the soldiers in isolation enter the room. Then Williams and his team come in to eat and leave. After that the utensils - generally plastic ware - are collected and burned. The troops are taking their own temperature twice a day.

As the initial U.S. military commander in Liberia, Williams traveled extensively in Liberia, but said numerous precautions were taken for all the troops. He noted he never came into direct contract with people ill with Ebola but did tour some Ebola testing areas. He said he generally kept a three foot distance and constantly washed his hands. At one point during his time in the hot zone his temperature was taken eight times a day.

There are more than 1,000 U.S. troops on the ground in Africa, with as many as 3,000 more set to deploy, and many of them may not come into contact with local citizens or military on ground. The major complication however may be the sheer logistics of keeping such a large number of people in 21 day isolation.
Reuters adds:

... There has been a growing chorus of critics, including public health experts, the United Nations, medical charities and even the White House, denouncing mandatory quarantines as scientifically unjustified and an obstacle to fighting the disease at its source in West Africa. "At CDC (U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention), we base our decisions on science and experience. We base our decisions on what we know and what we learn. And as the science and experience changes, we adopt and adapt our guidelines and recommendations," dr. Frieden said.

... Medical professionals say Ebola is difficult to catch and is spread through direct contact with bodily fluids from an infected person and not transmitted by asymptomatic people. Ebola is not airborne.

... Doctor Frieden (CDC) said high-risk people include healthcare workers who suffer a needle stick while caring for an Ebola patient or who tend to a patient without protective gear. He said returning health workers at “some risk” would have their health monitored daily by a local health department official who would check their temperature, look for signs of fatigue and review their daily activity plans to determine what activity “makes sense for that individual, at that time.”

President Barack Obama's spokesman, Josh Earnest, made clear Monday that the White House was not thrilled that individual states had implemented quarantines viewed as unfair to returning healthcare workers, though he acknowledged the states' rights to set them. "We want to make sure that whatever policies are put in place in this country to protect the American public do not serve as a disincentive to doctors and nurses from this country volunteering to travel to West Africa to treat Ebola patients," Earnest said.

teach
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by teach »

sean1982 wrote:Who is saying we need to stop flying there? We are only talking about commercial transport for Joe public.
As I've said: it's a dangerous idea that stopping commercial flights to those countries will somehow stop the disease from entering Europe. It won't, quite the opposite.

sean1982
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by sean1982 »

as long as a continuous flow of health workers and supplies is arranged through charters and military flights in a controlled way, then stopping commercial aviation is not a risk and will indeed prevent the disease from spreading through joe public

Inquirer
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by Inquirer »

sean1982 wrote:as long as a continuous flow of health workers and supplies is arranged through charters and military flights in a controlled way, then stopping commercial aviation is not a risk and will indeed prevent the disease from spreading through joe public
Just to get some factual information back into this topic:
does anybody know how many 'joe publics' are still flying there?

I've read that pretty much the entire capacity is being booked by officals and NGO staff flying on and off these days, so whereas these are officially still 'commercial' flights, they are pretty much what you are asking for in reality, it seems?

Other than that: this topic is getting pretty boaring, with the same people posting the same point of view over and over again, each time with a link to somebody or something in support of their opinion.
I must say I really admire the persistency, especially as it should be clear by now that this discussion is making zero impact and the Belgian government isn't going to step in to forbid this, quite on the contrary: it seems even the popular media have as good as moved on and let go of it.

airazurxtror
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by airazurxtror »

The International SOS website has a full list of the more than 30 countries that have imposed some form of restrictions on travel from the affected West African countries.
https://www.internationalsos.com/ebola/ ... ent_id=435&
IF IT AIN'T BOEING, I'M NOT GOING.

airazurxtror
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by airazurxtror »

Inquirer wrote: I must say I really admire the persistency, especially as it should be clear by now that this discussion is making zero impact and the Belgian government isn't going to step in to forbid this, quite on the contrary: it seems even the popular media have as good as moved on and let go of it.
As for me, I am just trying to inform the people that read this forum - there are many readers, not only those who post on it, not only those registered that never post, but also a lot of non-registered people.
I certainly don't try to "make an impact" : those who read Luchtzak are then entirely free to form their own opinion - same as mine, or different.
IF IT AIN'T BOEING, I'M NOT GOING.

Passenger
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by Passenger »

airazurxtror wrote:The International SOS website has a full list of the more than 30 countries that have imposed some form of restrictions on travel from the affected West African countries.
https://www.internationalsos.com/ebola/ ... ent_id=435&
Informing people would mean that you would also add this when you Google "ebola travel ban":

United Nations Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon today urged countries that have imposed travel bans or closed their borders in response to the Ebola outbreak of the need to convey a sense of urgency without inciting panic, saying “the only way to stop Ebola is to stop it at its source.”

In response to a question about the politicians in Australia and the United States calling for restrictions on people returning from affected countries, U.N. spokesperson Tarik Jasarevic said mandatory quarantine was not recommended, as people were not contagious until they were showing symptoms.

The Secretary-General in Addis Ababa drew attention to travel bans and border closures imposed by some countries, saying such measures will only isolate the affected countries, and obstruct response efforts.

“The only way to stop Ebola is to stop it at its source,” Mr. Ban Ki-moon said. “I thank the African Union (AU) for its strong and consistent position on this point,” he said, and asked the AU to continue to appeal to its member states not to impose travel restrictions or close their borders, but rather to deploy the essential human resources.

“We urgently need more trained foreign medical teams to deploy to the region,” he said.

According to WHO spokesperson Tarik Jasarevic, the agency has 176 health personnel on the ground, while 700 had been deployed and rotated since the beginning of the outbreak. At any given time, he said there were about 200 people on the ground. In addition, medical teams from other organizations including medical teams from Cuba, China, and other countries. Mr. Jasarevic stated that 230 more burial teams are needed, to ensure 70 percent of safe burials. Eight to 10 people are needed for one burial team.

Source:
http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?N ... E_8Y-nu19A

teach
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by teach »

sean1982 wrote:as long as a continuous flow of health workers and supplies is arranged through charters and military flights in a controlled way, then stopping commercial aviation is not a risk and will indeed prevent the disease from spreading through joe public
Except, of course, for the part where it won't. As I've said, quite the contrary: cancelling commercial flights to those countries will only stop the legal, relatively easily manageable flow of people to and from that region. It'll make some of those needing to go from one place to another do some in a more clandestine way and, more importantly, in a way that we don't have any control over. This has the potential of facilitating the spread of the disease to many other countries, including European countries. So be very careful what you wish for...

FlightMate
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by FlightMate »

As there is no (official) cure yet, the only way to stop ebola at source is to prevent contact with sick or dead people.

Isn't what we are preaching here?

It seems you are happy for sick people to travel freely.

teach
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by teach »

FlightMate wrote:As there is no (official) cure yet, the only way to stop ebola at source is to prevent contact with sick or dead people.

Isn't what we are preaching here?

It seems you are happy for sick people to travel freely.
Just who are you reacting to? Because I don't see anybody here advocating sick people can travel freely.

FlightMate
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by FlightMate »

Some here seem to criticize the closure of borders and quarantine measures in place in the US. And they don't want to see the end of commercial travel to these countries.

but what are the other solutions they bring into the discussion?

The only way to stop the disease is for infected people to stop infecting others (and unfortunately then wait for them to be cured, or more likely to die)
To do that, you need to detect the disease early and the isolate them.

detecting early means detecting before they had a chance to transmit it.

Making travel more difficult means making the spread of the virus more difficult as well.

The true effectice measure would be to find a cure. But in the mean time, the only thing we can do is detect, isolate and stop sick people from traveling.

If 'normal' transportation is halted or more difficult, a big majority of people won't bother with crazy alternatives.
Business and leisure travellers will postpone their trips.
it will hurt the local economy, I agree. But less than a full blown epidemic.

Either the epidemic will be under control in a few months, hence we need to slow the propagation.
or it will be much worse and a big pandemic. And so there is nothing we can do except wish for a cure

teach
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by teach »

FlightMate wrote:Some here seem to criticize the closure of borders and quarantine measures in place in the US. And they don't want to see the end of commercial travel to these countries.
Yup, and I'm one of them. And the reasons? Because actual experts do so too, and I trust them above politicians or knee-jerk reactions from an easily scared public. And because the idea of stopping the spread of the disease by stopping travel to and from those coutries only works in theory. In reality, it'll do the exact opposite.
If 'normal' transportation is halted or more difficult, a big majority of people won't bother with crazy alternatives.
It's not the 'big majority' we need to worry about, it's the small minority that DOES bother with those 'crazy' alternatives. Because if they manage to get to another country, we'll have NO idea, and they have the real potential of spreading the disease FAR faster than is the case now, especially in countries not now affected.

Why is it that in cases like this so many people are convinced that they know better than the experts? Because you don't.

FlightMate
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by FlightMate »

What if the borders were 100% hermetic? I know they are not and never will. But hypothetically, this would be the best measure.
And when I say borders, I mean borders outside the infection foyer, not the whole country.

On the other hand, what seems to be the consensus amongst people who are against a travel ban is that banning air travel will only delay the inevitable.

So if it is inevitable the outbreak will reach us, we've got nothing to do except wish for a cure?

Well, I say, any delay is good to take, if it gives more time to the pharmaceutical companies to develop and produce anti-ebola drugs.

If they need more doctors and more supplies, please, double, triple the number of inbound flights. But control the outbound flights better.

teach
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by teach »

FlightMate wrote:What if the borders were 100% hermetic? I know they are not and never will.
Exactly. And that's why it's a bad idea.
On the other hand, what seems to be the consensus amongst people who are against a travel ban is that banning air travel will only delay the inevitable.
You seem to be inventing your own consensuses now. It'll speed it up, not slow it down. As I've now said four times.

airazurxtror
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by airazurxtror »

A new poll finds that a majority of Americans support quarantining people arriving from West Africa.

A CBS News poll indicates that 80 percent of Americans believe U.S. citizens and legal residents returning from West African nations where the Ebola outbreak is prevalent should be quarantined upon their arrival until it is certain they do not have the deadly disease. Only 17 percent of those polled believe travelers should be allowed to enter the U.S. as long as they don’t show any Ebola symptoms.

Among foreign visitors coming from West Africa,
- 56 percent of Americans believe they should be quarantined upon arrival
- 27 percent believe they shouldn’t be allowed to enter the U.S. whatsoever until the Ebola outbreak is over.
- 14 percent believe they should be allowed to enter the U.S. if they aren’t showing any Ebola symptoms.

The poll was conducted from Oct. 23-27 among 1,269 adults.

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2014/10/ ... arantined/
IF IT AIN'T BOEING, I'M NOT GOING.

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sn26567
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

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airazurxtror wrote:The International SOS website has a full list of the more than 30 countries that have imposed some form of restrictions on travel from the affected West African countries.
https://www.internationalsos.com/ebola/ ... ent_id=435&
I suggest that every country in the world follows the enlightened leadership of the Great Leader of North Korea:

North Korea has banned foreign tourists since 24 October over fears of ebola; the ban applies to all entry points and border crossings.
André
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Passenger
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

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airazurxtror wrote:A new poll finds that a majority of Americans support quarantining people arriving from West Africa. A CBS News poll indicates that 80 percent of Americans believe U.S. citizens and legal residents returning from West African nations where the Ebola outbreak is prevalent should be quarantined upon their arrival until it is certain they do not have the deadly disease. Only 17 percent of those polled believe travelers should be allowed to enter the U.S. as long as they don’t show any Ebola symptoms.
Indeed: vox populi. Actually, I don't blame the responders for not knowing that ebola is more dangerous for us on the long term when western aid workers won't travel to West Africa anymore because of the three weeks quarantine after their return.

But then... Let's not worry too much. The Flemish vox populi - HLN forum - is confident that ebola will dissappear: "...De incubatietijd van het virus gaat anders zijn in de winter dan bij tropische temperaturen. Wetenschappers zeggen zelfs dat de winter een gevaarlijk seizoen is voor dit virus. Hopelijk word het snel hoogzomer dan hoeven we ons geen zorgen meer te maken..."
Translated: "...The ebola incubation period is different in the winter then it is at tropical temperatures. Scientifics even say that winter is a dangerous season for the virus itself. Let's hope it soon becomes high summer, as we then don't have to worry anymore..."

So let's not listen too much to the vox populi about quarantine, because some even don't know that seasons south of the equator are adverse to ours.

airazurxtror
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by airazurxtror »

The World Health Organization (WHO) says there has been a decline in the spread of Ebola in Liberia, the country hardest hit in the outbreak.
The WHO's Bruce Aylward said it was confident the response to the virus was now gaining the upper hand.
But he warned against any suggestion that the crisis was over.
He said the new number of cases globally was 13,703 and that the death toll, to be published later on Wednesday, would probably pass 5,000.
Liberia's Red Cross said its teams collected 117 bodies last week, down from a high of 315 in September.
Treatment centres also have empty beds available for patients.
Dr Aylward said : "It appears that the trend is real in Liberia and there may indeed be a slowing."
"Do we feel confident that the response is now getting an upper hand on the virus? Yes, we are seeing a slowing rate of new cases, very definitely."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-29822303
IF IT AIN'T BOEING, I'M NOT GOING.

Passenger
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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

Post by Passenger »

Image
Fatimata Gaima from Sierra Leone, ebola survivor and mother of three.

Doctors and nurses from all over the world go to West Africa now for a few weeks: to save lives. Unfortunately, they couldn't save Fatimata's three children: they all died from ebola. Just like Fatimata's husband.

Meanwhile, the World Bank has calculated that 5.000 more volunteers are needed to encounter ebola.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-29798555

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Re: Aviation and the Ebola epidemic in West-Africa

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Ebola outbreak: Nurse Kaci Hickox defies quarantine

A US nurse who returned from treating Ebola patients in Sierra Leone has defied a quarantine order, leaving her house in Maine for a brief bike ride. Kaci Hickox maintains isolation is unnecessary, as she has no symptoms and has tested negative for Ebola.

Maine officials have vowed to go to court to try to enforce the quarantine.

US officials are at odds over whether American healthcare workers who return from treating Ebola patients in West Africa should be forced into quarantine until that period has expired.

New Jersey and other states had put quarantine rules into place after a New York doctor who treated Ebola patients in West Africa came down with the disease. But the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), America's chief public health agency, merely recommends daily monitoring of returned health workers, rather than enforced isolation.

And President Barack Obama has warned that overly restrictive measures imposed upon returning healthcare workers could discourage them from volunteering in Africa.

Ms Hickox returned to the US on Friday, landing at Newark International Airport.

Officials say she had a minor fever, necessitating a quarantine at a Newark, New Jersey, hospital. Ms Hickox contested the quarantine regimen, ultimately threatening legal action. After showing no fever or other symptoms for a 24-hour period, she was discharged and brought to her home state of Maine.

On Thursday morning, Ms Hickox left her home on a bicycle, followed by police officers who monitoring her movements and public interactions. She returned home shortly after. Without a court order, the police were barred from detaining her.

Full article from BBC: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-29836550
André
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