Tri-Star from LUZAIR replacing Jetair's famous OO-TUC B767

[LX-LGX]

I assume many passengers must have been unpleasantly surprised, as they've expected to fly home with a Belgian 767.

Ask 50 people in the street if they can tell the difference between a 767 and a L1011... you'll get a lot of puzzled looks. The general public couldn't care less what plane you put them on, as long as it takes them home.

Now, ask 50 people here if they would mind their 767 being replaced with an L1011... most of them would probably go "yes! finally a chance to be on the good old threeholer!"

Ask 50 people in the street if the cruising alt from a jet is 1 km, 10 kms or 500 kms, and you will get a lot of strange answers.

Now, let's be serious: let's address 200 Belgian tourists who have flown from Brussels to Cuba with the JAF 767 just one or two weeks ago. And let's ask them if they feel happy because their return flight is not with the Belgian Jetair-plane, but with a 24-year old Portugese charter plane from Luzair. And let's ask them if they find it correct that they are only advised about this when they are already sitting down in their Tristar-seats.

Airline enthousiasts like stefanel, who know it's a exceptional plane, are the exception. Pax have the right to be informed on a more decent matter.

[stefanel]

Yes indeed they never informed anyone but I'm not surprised considering the general faults commited by Jetair staff.
I was relieved to have other stewardessed than Jetair's.

On the way to Cuba, the cabin chief was sooo rude, I have never seen this, from the start she was sulking, then of course yelled various times at passengers. She blocked the last row window that she never used, for the landing, I asked if I could seat there 20 minutes before the landing when it was sure the two seats would not be used as they have to seat in the back, one stewardess said no problem and then she came and yelled at me "no", so I asked "is it yes or no, I get two different answers" and she said "I said no" in such a superior and aggressive way that I was disgusted not only because the window remained free (and twice to Cuba I never got a window because Jetair assigns the seats before the check-in, such a stupid way of working as many passengers just want to sleep and don't care about having a seat) but because it would have changed nothing to her to say yes.

Last year in May from Cuba, many stewardesses were very rude too.

Every year in Cuba, the check-in staff "forgets" to give the 25 CUC (21€)for the tax that you have to pay at the customs so that many passengers have to pay a tax they have already paid (included in the ticket), not to mention that many of them have spent all their last pesos so that they have to go to the bank and withdraw money from their card at super high cost. I noticed this rip-off last year and this year too, I observed many passengers and then told them when they were queuing at the bank, so I decided to tell Jetair, went to talk to the representative, who COULD NOT CARE LESS... I invited the passengers to write Jetair, and they promised to do so, because this rip-off is a scandal.

By the way, how many days has Luzair operated for Jetair?

[piratehunter]

In December 2004 I flew Brussels-(Lisbon)-Varadero-Cancun with EuroAtlantic L-1011 Tristar. It was replacing JetAir's 767 that was under repairs. We had a mandatory stop in Lisbon, as under the agreement with the Mexican government a Portuguese airline was only allowed to carry passengers from Portugal...

On the way back from Cancun in January 2005, I flew EuroAtlantic B767, again via Lisbon, with over 9 hours delay. The plane arrived 5 hours late and was standing for 4.5 hours more just because "that type of plane (767) was not authorised to land in Cancun for this airline", so the airport demanded a 1000 USD fine. It was awful - the passengers were given NOTHING AT ALL (not even meal or drink vouchers) and no official information, the airport employees were calling a Jetair representative in vain, as he needed to sign a fax to be sent to Mexico City (late in the evening). They could reach JetAir in Brussels, but not in Cancun, as his mobile was swithched off... Finally the captain himself agreed to pay 1000 USD... We all watched our the airport window the captain going to the airport and then coming back to the plane with papers... We finally left at 00:30 local time, instead of the planned 15:20. And arrived in Brussels in the evening instead of the morning, after a stop in Lisbon...

I later wrote a complaint to JetAir, and they answered that the delay was caused by "technical reasons" and they could do nothing for me...

[stefanel]

In December 2004 I flew Brussels-(Lisbon)-Varadero-Cancun with EuroAtlantic L-1011 Tristar. It was replacing JetAir's 767 that was under repairs. We had a mandatory stop in Lisbon, as under the agreement with the Mexican government a Portuguese airline was only allowed to carry passengers from Portugal...

On the way back from Cancun in January 2005, I flew EuroAtlantic B767, again via Lisbon, with over 9 hours delay. The plane arrived 5 hours late and was standing for 4.5 hours more just because "that type of plane (767) was not authorised to land in Cancun for this airline", so the airport demanded a 1000 USD fine. It was awful - the passengers were given NOTHING AT ALL (not even meal or drink vouchers) and no official information, the airport employees were calling a Jetair representative in vain, as he needed to sign a fax to be sent to Mexico City (late in the evening). They could reach JetAir in Brussels, but not in Cancun, as his mobile was swithched off... Finally the captain himself agreed to pay 1000 USD... We all watched our the airport window the captain going to the airport and then coming back to the plane with papers... We finally left at 00:30 local time, instead of the planned 15:20. And arrived in Brussels in the evening instead of the morning, after a stop in Lisbon...

I later wrote a complaint to JetAir, and they answered that the delay was caused by "technical reasons" and they could do nothing for me...

what an incredible story!!!

[LX-LGX]

Every year in Cuba, the check-in staff "forgets" to give the 25 CUC (21€)for the tax that you have to pay at the customs so that many passengers have to pay a tax they have already paid (included in the ticket), not to mention that many of them have spent all their last pesos so that they have to go to the bank and withdraw money from their card at super high cost. I noticed this rip-off last year and this year too, I observed many passengers and then told them when they were queuing at the bank, so I decided to tell Jetair, went to talk to the representative, who COULD NOT CARE LESS... I invited the passengers to write Jetair, and they promised to do so, because this rip-off is a scandal.

Sorry I have to go into details for my reply:

there’s a difference between airport departure tax and a local departure taxes. The Belgian consumer law (WHPC) says that all airport taxes must be included in the tour price and/or in the ticket price. But local departure taxes must not be included if:
1. they are a tax or a retribution;
2. they only can be settled at departure;
3. they are a tax, aimed at consumers only.

There was much discussion about this small difference between airport tax and departure tax, at airports and in court cases and in the travel mediation commission, and therefore a special Koninklijk Besluit / Arrêt Royal was published about this difference.

Some touroperators however forget that the same KB / AR also states that, if the touroperator excludes these departure taxes from his all-in offer, he must clearly announce, in written and at least in Euro, how much these taxes will cost to the consumer.

Just to make sure: airport departues taxes, to be paid to the airline, always must be included in the tour price and/or the ticket price.

The law, signed on 11th July 2003, was published in Belgian’s State Gazette on… 22th June 2004:

Dutch text:
http://www.staatsbladclip.be/wetten/200 ... 11333.html

French text:
http://www.staatsbladclip.be/lois/2004/ ... 11333.html

German text:
Sorry, don’t know if the text has been translated already

English text:
Sorry, Belgian laws are only published in the 3 official Belgian languages: Dutch, French and German.

[stefanel]

Every year in Cuba, the check-in staff "forgets" to give the 25 CUC (21€)for the tax that you have to pay at the customs so that many passengers have to pay a tax they have already paid (included in the ticket), not to mention that many of them have spent all their last pesos so that they have to go to the bank and withdraw money from their card at super high cost. I noticed this rip-off last year and this year too, I observed many passengers and then told them when they were queuing at the bank, so I decided to tell Jetair, went to talk to the representative, who COULD NOT CARE LESS... I invited the passengers to write Jetair, and they promised to do so, because this rip-off is a scandal.

Sorry I have to go into details for my reply:

there’s a difference between airport departure tax and a local departure taxes. The Belgian consumer law (WHPC) says that all airport taxes must be included in the tour price and/or in the ticket price. But local departure taxes must not be included if:
1. they are a tax or a retribution;
2. they only can be settled at departure;
3. they are a tax, aimed at consumers only.

There was much discussion about this small difference between airport tax and departure tax, at airports and in court cases and in the travel mediation commission, and therefore a special Koninklijk Besluit / Arrêt Royal was published about this difference.

Some touroperators however forget that the same KB / AR also states that, if the touroperator excludes these departure taxes from his all-in offer, he must clearly announce, in written and at least in Euro, how much these taxes will cost to the consumer.

Just to make sure: airport departues taxes, to be paid to the airline, always must be included in the tour price and/or the ticket price.

The law, signed on 11th July 2003, was published in Belgian’s State Gazette on… 22th June 2004:

Dutch text:
http://www.staatsbladclip.be/wetten/200 ... 11333.html

French text:
http://www.staatsbladclip.be/lois/2004/ ... 11333.html

German text:
Sorry, don’t know if the text has been translated already

English text:
Sorry, Belgian laws are only published in the 3 official Belgian languages: Dutch, French and German.

Thanks for your time but it seems I haven't made it clear that Jetair takes responsibility for handing the 25 CUC to each passenger (they have a bunch of CUC bills at the check-in desk however the staff often "forgets" to give this money to the passengers). It is Jetair's decision that pax should not pay themselves, so they should just make this work!
I'm sure I raised a very sensitive issue, I could tell by the face and reaction of everyone when I made a scandal about it, after observing their circus two years in a row.

[LX-LGX]

Today's flight JAF501 from Brussels to Varadero / Punta Cana was supposed to leave at 06h00 this Friday morning.

18h45: the Tristar should leave BRU any moment now...

[LX-LGX]

Today's flight JAF501 from Brussels to Varadero / Punta Cana was supposed to leave at 06h00 this Friday morning.

18h45: the Tristar should leave BRU any moment now...

Plane finally left only at 20h58: 15 hours delay

Arrival of the return flight JAF502 is still announced as on schedule for 10h00 Saturday morning. If friends/relatives from passengers read this: don't expect them before Saturday 23h59...

corrected : I've first wrote "... 10h00 Sunday morning..."

[Homo Aeroportus]

Arrival of the return flight JAF502 is still announced as on schedule for 10h00 Sunday morning. If friends/relatives from passengers read this: don't expect them before Sunday 24h00...

And JAF501 to Mo'Bay tomorrow still with ETD 12:15. Is this operated by CS-TMP as well?
Another band of (un)happy campers for tomorrow.

Could BIAC, woops, Brussels Airport help on this?
Hundreds are concerned who will leave home tomorrow morning and be stuck for probably the whole day.

Thanks for them.

[rut-her]

What is wrong with OO-TUC again?

Greetz,
Rutger

[spotter1102]

What is wrong with OO-TUC again?

Greetz,
Rutger

With all these repairs, I ask myself if this aircraft is just good to be scrapped...

Don't forget that the plane was grounded for 2 weeks in Lisbon during it's delivery flight from Brazil due to a problem with a motor

[JAF 23]

It is clear that OO-TUC is the pain in the ass of our company. Almost everything on it has been replaced. Let this be a lesson that the cheapest airplane, isn't the best choice. Yesterday evening, at 21h50 pm LT OO-TUC landed. I still don't know what is wrong this time.

What to do with this plane? One-way ticket to Nevada desert, and buy something new or in a better state.
Hopefully the Arkefly 767 that will come this year will preform better than our crippled bird.

[Spotter 22]

Hopefully the Arkefly 767 that will come this year will preform better than our crippled bird.

Hi, You mean OO-TUC will be replaced by a 767 from arkefly or do the dutch get a new plane? It's not very clear...
thanks

[LX-LGX]

Is there someone from Jetair, JAF or Brussels Airport online? Then do something please.

JAF501 to Varadero / Punta Cana has left BRU on Friday with exactly 15 hours delay. The return flight JAF502 is also announced with a Tristar, so I assume it's the same plane (*).

Urgent question to Jetair, JAF, Brussels Airport: why is the return flight announced with a short delay from 2 hours? At this moment (09h00), the flight is announced as delayed from 10h00 till 12h10. We all know the delay will be 15 hours. Are you going to add extra delays every now and then? Why don't you immediately tell the friends / relatives from it's passengers they only have to come to the airport by midnight? This will allow them to do something else on this Saturday then sitting at home, witing till it's time to leave for the airport.

(*) = if JAF was able to subcharter a second Tristar and if that one has flown empty to Cuba yesterday to pick up the stranded pax, then the delay indeed could be some 2 hours. I apologise then for my remark.

PS Outgoing JAF601 to Montego Bay (ETD 12h15) is scheduled for the OO-TUC

[Kapitein]

LX-LGX,

I see you are getting nervous.Time to clear things out. The displayed delay on the Brussels Airport website isn't the fault of the Brussels Airport Company.

JetAirfly has to give the exact time to the handler, the handler puts it into the system. Then the system sends it to everbody like the website or TT. When JetAirfly wants to give the corrected delay, then it will be showed everywhere, hopefully correct this time.

[LX-LGX]

LX-LGX,

I see you are getting nervous.Time to clear things out. The displayed delay on the Brussels Airport website isn't the fault of the Brussels Airport Company.

JetAirfly has to give the exact time to the handler, the handler puts it into the system. Then the system sends it to everbody like the website or TT. When JetAirfly wants to give the corrected delay, then it will be showed everywhere, hopefully correct this time.

Brubia, don't worry: I'm not nervous at all : I'm not involved, I don't have friend/relatives/clients on the flight. And yes, I've spent enough time on the airport to know how the alert system works. But I hate it when people are voluntury mislead, and I also hate it when others who could do something about it, don't do it. And that's what's happening here. We all know since Friday evening that there's a 15 hours delay on this route. And yet the arrival this morning (ETA 10h00) was announced as delayed till 12h10 - amended later on to 13h10.

Only just now, it's announced as it should be: cancelled.

Now, another question: outgoing flight JAF601 to Montego Bay, OO-TUC, has left on time (ETD 12h15, dep at 12h31). Is OO-TUC going to pick up the stranded pax?

[JAFflyer]

OO-TUC does JAF601-602 as scheduled today.
Luzair needed a crew rest in PUJ (18hrs) before flying further to VRA and returning to BRU. ETD PUJ: tonight 23.00Z. So once again, BRU screens are not correctly displaying info while Flightcare knows for a long time now that the aircraft will leave PUJ at 23.00Z. The cancelled now on the screens is the most misleading info that has been put on the website in the last hours.

[TUB023]

so it is NOT cancelled?

on brussels site it says a 767 from JFA departed @ 12.15 to montego bay jamaica, then why was the arrival @ 10.00 cancelled i'm confused:D:D:D

[JAF 23]

Hopefully the Arkefly 767 that will come this year will preform better than our crippled bird.

Hi, You mean OO-TUC will be replaced by a 767 from arkefly or do the dutch get a new plane? It's not very clear...
thanks

We will fly a 767 together with Arkefly (mixed crew) and we will also add a new destination for both Arkefly and Jetairfly.
Reason: they have a 767 that isn't used most of the time, and we need an extra long haul aircraft. Also a 757 is under investigation, but about that subject i don't have more info.

[Spotter 22]

We will fly a 767 together with Arkefly (mixed crew) and we will also add a new destination for both Arkefly and Jetairfly.
Reason: they have a 767 that isn't used most of the time, and we need an extra long haul aircraft. Also a 757 is under investigation, but about that subject i don't have more info.

Nice, they have 3 classes on their 767...nostalgia
But I want to see how mixed crews work in the cabin with Belgian pax as most Dutch FA's hardly speak any French and most French-Belgian pax hardly speak any English...The belgian crew prob. will have extra work...constantly running around to translate