What are the advantages of the 747-800 vs the 747-400 ?

Captain · Post by **Captain** » 02 Jan 2006, 21:42

What are the advantages of the 747-800 compared to the 747-400 ?

Captain

Jense · Post by **Jense** » 02 Jan 2006, 21:59

The biggest advantage is probably that it's lighter (= so it burns less fuel).
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/747fam ... round.html for more info

Captain · Post by **Captain** » 03 Jan 2006, 22:22

Thanks for the info. I like their selling advantage of: "Seat-mile costs for the 747-8 Intercontinental are 8 percent lower than the 747-400,"

In these days of high fuel prices, this makes total sense just like the A380 is supposed to be economical too.

bits44 · Post by **bits44** » 03 Jan 2006, 22:41

A little more info from Boeings website.

http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/200 ... 1114h.html

Ken

smokejumper · Post by **smokejumper** » 06 Jan 2006, 21:29

The B-747-8 offers several advantages over the current production version. It has more effieient engines (787 technology), a more efficient wing, about 35-40 more seats (higher revenue) and, it is lighter per passenger than the B747-400. Also, the cockpit will be upgraded to that of the B-777 technology which is well liked by pilots.

All this means that the plane wil offer greater efficiency and lower costs. since the plane is a derivitive (although a major one) of a current aircraft, developmental costs will be less, thus the plane can be expected to cost less than a totally new airplane.

fokker_f27 · Post by **fokker_f27** » 07 Jan 2006, 22:04

And those cool engine cases disigned for less noise.

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 07 Jan 2006, 22:24

Does someone know whether Boeing intents to convert the B747-8 with a FBW system ? or is it to costly to do such a modification for a new derivative ? Because I suppose there would be quite some modifications to implement.....

fokker_f27 wrote:And those cool engine cases disigned for less noise.

Indeed they will not only use chevron nozzles but also chevron shaped cowlings.

I didn't read all the links, but it says that they will have GE engines which will be a derivative of the B787 engines ? Do they also intend to use bleedless engines? Or do they first wait to see the results on the 787 before installing those on any other plane ?

Chris

smokejumper · Post by **smokejumper** » 09 Jan 2006, 01:19

One writer asked:
Does someone know whether Boeing intents to convert the B747-8 with a FBW system ? or is it to costly to do such a modification for a new derivative ? Because I suppose there would be quite some modifications to implement.....

While it is techically feasible to convert any aircraft to Fly By Wire (FBW), it would be very difficult from a practical sense. You'd have to do extensive redesign and then test to a new aircraft certificate (this is no easy improvement); this would be expensive. If you are going to do this, you might as well just design a new aircraft with all modern design, construction and features.

smokejumper · Post by **smokejumper** » 09 Jan 2006, 21:20

I noticed in a Flight International article today that Boeing is considering limited FBW for the 747-8, perhaps for the spoilers or for lateral control. a three month wind tunnel test program is underway. Limited FBW makes sense as it will simultaneously help control costs and contribute to a lighter weight. They are (possibly) using a redefined wing that will be aft-loaded and supercritical. This will improve aerodynamics and increase fuel capacity, according to the article.

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 09 Jan 2006, 21:22

Thanks for your answers smokejumper.

Let's see how this limited FBW system will be implemented.

Chris

RC20 · Post by **RC20** » 13 Jan 2006, 00:33

I didn't read all the links, but it says that they will have GE engines which will be a derivative of the B787 engines ? Do they also intend to use bleedless engines? Or do they first wait to see the results on the 787 before installing those on any other plane ?

Chris

Ironically enough the engine used will be the ones that are being developed for the A350 (bleed air in other words).

So they get a bit of a free ride from Airbus on that. No comments if GE would have come out with a bleed version for the –8 alone.

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 13 Jan 2006, 01:24

Hello to all and happy new year!!!

is there a single 747-8 passenger version order for the moment ?

Will it be a commercial flop like the 747sp... ?

Avro · Post by **Avro** » 13 Jan 2006, 11:32

RC20 wrote: Ironically enough the engine used will be the ones that are being developed for the A350 (bleed air in other words).

So they get a bit of a free ride from Airbus on that. No comments if GE would have come out with a bleed version for the –8 alone.

That's what I thought. I would have found it strange if they'd put bleedless engines on the 747-8. Sincethis would imply some major modifications in several aircraft systems.

Chris

vc-10 · Post by **vc-10** » 14 Jan 2006, 19:19

Which airlines have expressed interest in the 747-8I?

bits44 · Post by **bits44** » 14 Jan 2006, 20:51

You can be sure that Boeing would not commit the time or the money to develop an advanced version of the 747 if they did not have commitments from the Airlines.

The Cargo market alone is enough to justify the expense, but some majors are very interested, as was reported in other posts.

The name British Airways is one that was mentioned and I'm sure Qantas was among them.

some updated info from Boeing:

http://www.flightinternational.com/Arti ... paign.html

vc-10 · Post by **vc-10** » 15 Jan 2006, 17:41

But QANTAS have ordered the A380. I would love to see it in BA colours though!

Allnipponairways · Post by **Allnipponairways** » 17 Jan 2006, 11:08

the advantages are less weight .. less ticket price and new ... as the 747-400 are getting old as i am sure as i am flying on them from japan .. the 747-400 needs replacement by 2010 as you can only keep them safe for a while then they start to cost and become more fuel burning and unsafe .. THE POKEMON JET ... from ANA is 26 years old ... one of the first 747-400 ... it is in mechanics more then in the air .. as i was delayed for 6 hours from tokyo to paris due to pa system failure .. yeah wright so why are one of the engines new ..???
what do they think that the passengers are stupid adn the cabin crew also ... by now has been painted back in original colours to cover up their story ..
greets

lastrow · Post by **lastrow** » 17 Jan 2006, 12:31

I think that LH has mentioned strong interest in buying a 747-8I as this was discussed in another thread here.

People think that for LH the 747-8I is very interesting, because it could be a fitting replacement for their quite huge fleet of 747s: they have 29 of them and they start getting old as well. However: it is the question which of them will be replaced by A380 - LH has ordered 15 of them. I would expect that they will reaplace about the half of the Jumbos in terms of the demand. I do not know, if this consideration applies also to other airlines menitoned here (I know, obviously not for BA so)

And ... I have asked this in another thread but it was remained unanswered: what is your opinion about the A346HGW? actually this bird took off first in mid-November 2005. AFAIK is will be certified soon. The specs of Airbus for this plane is that is offers 12/54/314 seats - the 744 of Lufthansa offers 16/64/310 seats. that's pretty close. could it be that LH could move to an entirely Airbus fleet for high capacity long-haul routes? - keeping in mind that for less crowded routes LH will choose the A346HGW to replace the 744 and for more crowded the A388? LH has got already ten A346 and 29 A343.

I personally doubt it, because LH has mentioned many times that they would be happy to have two strong companies they can buy airliners from; so my guess is that they will try to keep the balance. But increasing the number of A346s and replacing the A343s with 787s sounds like a plan to me???

If I would be head of fleet planning at LH ...

Anyone from LH here who can confirm this??

-lr.

Ovostar · Post by **Ovostar** » 17 Jan 2006, 15:50

BA have so many 747! someone knows the exact number ?

So many times i se one in the sky in london.

It must be much easier for ba to order new 747s for the staff, maintenance etc...

lastrow · Post by **lastrow** » 17 Jan 2006, 17:07

ovostar: 57 - more to read in this very cool document, not really on BA's main homepage. very cool stuff, like average daily utilisation, fuel consumption etc. etc. :

http://media.corporate-ir.net/media_fil ... ction3.doc

Aviation24.be

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