Is there any plan to expand the rail link at BRU airport

[Comet]

Connections from BRU to Brugge and Oostende would be popular

You took the words right out of my mouth. A BRU - Oostende connection would certainly make my life easier. Time to start a campaign

Changing in any of the Brussels stations when travelling between BRU and Oostende is a real nightmare sometimes. Last year we went Oostende-Antwerp-BRU rather than change in Brussels. At least in Antwerp you are boarding the train at the start and not getting onto an already full train that has started somewhere else. Oostende-BRU is a long overdue route I think!

Also some of the trains on the airport service are entirely unsuitable for that run.


This was the train from BRU into Brussels we caught last September. It consisted of two carriage units, which filled up in BRU, as you would expect, with people carrying lots of luggage. There was no proper luggage space between seats like you get on some trains and it was crammed, it was quite difficult to get to the doors when we wanted to get off because the train was so full. These two unit things might be perfect on quieter "stoptrein" routes but they are not fit for the airport run.

The three carriage unit we caught from Antwerp to BRU was a little better in that it had space between seats for luggage, but it still got very full. Some of these airport trains are too short. De Panne often has a double decker running to the airport, why can't these trains be used on most, if not all, of the airport services?

[sn26567]

Ostend and Bruges are not the only large cities in need of a direct link with Brussels Airport. For example, why are the trains going to Leuven limited at Leuven or Landen? They could continue to Liège!

Namur and Charleroi also could have a link to the airport.

But the completion of the Diabolo is quite recent. Let's give B-rail some time to adapt, but not too long.

[Koltchak]

This was the train from BRU into Brussels we caught last September. It consisted of two carriage units, which filled up in BRU, as you would expect, with people carrying lots of luggage. There was no proper luggage space between seats like you get on some trains and it was crammed, it was quite difficult to get to the doors when we wanted to get off because the train was so full. These two unit things might be perfect on quieter "stoptrein" routes but they are not fit for the airport run.

The three carriage unit we caught from Antwerp to BRU was a little better in that it had space between seats for luggage, but it still got very full. Some of these airport trains are too short. De Panne often has a double decker running to the airport, why can't these trains be used on most, if not all, of the airport services?

Why? Simply because SNCB doesn't have enough double decker stock (M6 coaches). And the ones available are already heavily sollicited on others relations.

The "two carriage units" you're speaking of will be replaced this year (according to the information we got) by new three carriage EMU of the Desiro class.

[Conti764]

The NMBS also has a fairly large stkck (130 units) of older but renovated M5-carriages. Albeit not as spacious, nor comfortable as the M6 stock, still useful...

[gumblebee]

But the completion of the Diabolo is quite recent. Let's give B-rail some time to adapt, but not too long.

The diabolo is not complete yet : the new railway line along the E19 is still missing the section from Brussels to the airport (not sure how far construction has advanced). The fourth leg of the diabolo will provide a second route between Brussels and the airport, via this unfinished section. When this section is finished, the new line will also be used for an extra, direct link between Brussels and Mechelen.

[Tomskii]

Ostend and Bruges are not the only large cities in need of a direct link with Brussels Airport. For example, why are the trains going to Leuven limited at Leuven or Landen? They could continue to Liège!

Namur and Charleroi also could have a link to the airport.

But the completion of the Diabolo is quite recent. Let's give B-rail some time to adapt, but not too long.

Because the train to Landen is a P train from Leuven onwards.

It would make more sense but hey.. never heard logic and NMBS in the same sentence unless it was negative.

@Gumblebee, how does the fyra (when it runs) go directly to BRU then..?

[Comet]

The airport trains we caught a few years ago were much better than the ones we have been catching in the last couple of years. Admittedly they were always busy (which you expect with airport trains) but at least they were longer than some of the ones we have been in recently.

The NMBS also has a fairly large stkck (130 units) of older but renovated M5-carriages. Albeit not as spacious, nor comfortable as the M6 stock, still useful...

The ride from BRU into Brussels is not such a long one, I would have thought these older carriages would be ideal, more capacity so not as crammed or as difficult to get off for those of us who prefer to change trains in Noord station rather than Centraal or Zuid. The ride in the two carriage thing was the worst I have had between the airport and Brussels.

[fets]

But the completion of the Diabolo is quite recent. Let's give B-rail some time to adapt, but not too long.

The diabolo is not complete yet : the new railway line along the E19 is still missing the section from Brussels to the airport (not sure how far construction has advanced). The fourth leg of the diabolo will provide a second route between Brussels and the airport, via this unfinished section. When this section is finished, the new line will also be used for an extra, direct link between Brussels and Mechelen.

??? This part is already built, and used by the Thalys Trains from Brussels to Amsterdam (and also for the daily Thalys from Paris to the Airport). It should get more use once the new train timetable schedule is in place (was planned for end 2013, but more probably end 2014).
The only thing that is on hold right now it the junction from L26 to L25N, since it is not urgent. (You can go to the airport via L26 -> L36).

[Comet]

The "two carriage units" you're speaking of will be replaced this year (according to the information we got) by new three carriage EMU of the Desiro class.

I hope the Desiro trains will be a bit better than the Siemens trains which are used where I live. They are among the worst, most uncomfortable trains I have been on in Britain, and they are used on long distance services. Truly horrible things.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_185 The horrid "Desiro" variant which runs in my area.

"The loss of seats relative to an equivalent three-coach 158 means that more passengers have to stand at peak times. An increase in passenger numbers since the trains were brought in to operation has meant that some passengers are unable to board 185s at peak times due to them being seriously overcrowded." Very true, doesn't help when 98% of all seats on the damned things are reserved.

"The air conditioning on board these trains has, in the past, attracted many complaints from passengers as it was set too cold. A software modification has now been completed and the temperature is somewhat improved: complaints from passengers regarding the temperature have decreased. In the recent cold weather this was a much more serious problem." I remember we made a complaint about how cold these hateful things are.

I hope your Desiro trains will be better than the ones we have to endure over here.

[Tomskii]

Well I sat in one of those Desiro trains last week. And they were good for the Mechelen - Leuven trip via Brussels Airport to Landen. But the seats are a bit hard. Apart from being on a train track and knowing theyre used by the NMBS I have a more metro/underground-ish feeling of them instead of a train feeling.

These are ours

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_j0iMrIi95ro/T ... 020e_o.jpg

[fets]

@Gumblebee, how does the fyra (when it runs) go directly to BRU then..?

The Fyra still uses the "old" route over L25. Moving it over to L25N (the new link) would require a lot of shuffling of trains within the Brussels North-South junction (it would have to move from the western to the eastern side) which is not possible short term.

[Koltchak]

I hope the Desiro trains will be a bit better than the Siemens trains which are used where I live. They are among the worst, most uncomfortable trains I have been on in Britain, and they are used on long distance services. Truly horrible things.

I hope your Desiro trains will be better than the ones we have to endure over here.

I'm working nearly every week in Desiro these last times and I'm still amazed by the performances of these trainsets.

That's not the most comfortable trainsets which are running in Belgium. But they're not destined for. They've been built for local trains with a high amount of stops for which it is required to have high performances, comfort is there and is enough for "short haul" trains.

Seats comfort is on the average, still far better than the one you get from a "Classic" EMU (the one you've travelled in), there is room for luggages, easy access and public information systems. Anything you can expect from a modern train which do shuttles between the Airport and Brussels (20 mins ride).

[RoMax]

With all the Fyra-troubles now... So to conclude, The Hague wants a regular IC train service to Brussels, Antwerp wants a IC train service to The Hague and/or Amsterdam (both with or without Fyra). The Dutch now also say Brussels Airport is also willing to step into the/a project. Market research is currently running in The Netherlands for IC trains to Belgium (even when the Fyra comes back, it may be another operator as NS or NMBS).

So who nows, currently NOTHING is certain when talking about international train services between Belgium and The Netherlands (since I started to use Amsterdam-Antwerp about weekly in September, the problems slightly began...), but it would nice for BRU to have connections with The Netherlands. For BRU a high speed service may be better...mhh I'm not sure about that actually, but MAYBE, but I don't see that happening soon. So let's hope for an IC train.

[Tomskii]

So who nows, currently NOTHING is certain when talking about international train services between Belgium and The Netherlands (since I started to use Amsterdam-Antwerp about weekly in September, the problems slightly began...), but it would nice for BRU to have connections with The Netherlands. For BRU a high speed service may be better...mhh I'm not sure about that actually, but MAYBE, but I don't see that happening soon. So let's hope for an IC train.

Thalys no? Or is that only to CDG?

[RoMax]

Thalys no? Or is that only to CDG?

Thalys only runs one daily beteen Paris Nord (not CDG) and BRU, a coorperation with SN, Hainan and Jet Airways. But that's not enough and they still don't have a connection with The Netherlands (unlike AMS that's connected to Belgium, France and Germany by train services).

[Tomskii]

Oh ok, thanks for clearing that up! Thought it went on to Amsterdam.

[Air Key West]

There are approximatley every two hours Thalys trains between Paris-Nord, Brussels Zuid-Midi, Antwerp, Rotterdam, Schiphol and Amsterdam. But only one Thalys indeed from Paris-Nord to BRU per day, which ends at BRU.

[Tomskii]

Well there used to be a Paris-BRU line before but that didn't work out so I suppose Thalys wants to take it easy and only increase the frequency when it would be needed.