Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance, Oneworld and Skyteam under one roof?

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by sn26567 » 19 Mar 2019, 22:16

Atlantis wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 22:12
The whole Vision 2040 is very ambitious I would say. Finally an airport management who has the guts to reveal great plans for the future, with more terminals, piers, longer runways, more pax, etc etc

They had the guts to sit in front of the people who are living in the neighborhood of the airport to hear them during the debates. Finally actions and not only words
... and three new shareholders who want to see a return on their investment:

https://www.aviation24.be/airports/brus ... reholders/
André
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Boavida
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Boavida » 19 Mar 2019, 23:36

Atlantis wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 19:18

At the same time, with the new Terminal (or the Terminal of the Future) you can give them even an own check in and fast connection to the concourse. The new part of the terminal for OW with direct access to the A-Concourse and the "old part" of the terminal to Star with direct access to the B-concourse
About this 'terminal of the future': are we talking about a brand new terminal building or a renovation of the current one?

I always thought a great place for a new terminal is the ugly & old Swissport building (next to the busstation).

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Jetter » 20 Mar 2019, 01:26

Conti764 wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 21:12
since in my idea BRU would mainly serve a function as reliever hub to LHR, thus having smooth connections extra shengen.
Problem is IAG purchased Aer Lingus for this purpose.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Atlantis » 20 Mar 2019, 13:13

JOVAN wrote:
17 Mar 2019, 21:12
Indeed nothing is to be expected from LH.


the Chinese tourists will keep on coming to Europe, there is certainly room for more connections to other "less known" cities (Chengdu, Tianjin, Guanghzou, Xiamen, Qingdao...); all have bigger population than Paris, Berlin...
We had in the past China Eastern at BRU but they are now working closely with Skyteam

But Hainan Airlines had in the past the intention to make form BRU their European hub between China and the US. They wanted to create before this a few things like their own hotel, Chinese banks, etc. They realized this bcs they bought very close to Brussels a famous and huge hotel. Chinese tourists are using this now mainly. Chinese banks also came.

In meantime Hainan decided to open a fourth destination from China to France. Like it was in the past, shortly after they also opened a new destination to BRU. So maybe there is sth new in the pipeline

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by ZavCity » 20 Mar 2019, 15:42

I read a few months ago an article stating that only 1 chinese carrier had authorisation to fly to Belgium..??true??
gtz
paul

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by JOVAN » 20 Mar 2019, 20:54

jan_olieslagers wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 10:03
TGV/ Eurostar connections easy to realize from BRU.
Perhaps not so easy as implied: with its measly three platforms, the railway station is close to maximum capacity. It must be said, though, that this is at least partly due to its use as a terminal station: some trains occupy the platforms much longer than just the time for transferring passengers. And no, it won't be easy to add platform capacity, plus nobody wants more Diabolo tax.

One possible formula could be to have a HST from either London or Paris pass by the Brussels South, Central and North stations, enter the airport from the North, and continue towards Liege, perhaps even continuing into Germany. But even that might be quite complicated to implement. HST from Paris could even avoid the (itself saturated) South-North transfer by using line 26, passing Brussels on the East side.
AMS Train station has 6 platforms (10 tracks ?): it is a very busy and popular station.
BRU train station has 3 (5 tracks): I think all are go-thru ; so also a lot of possibilities. Connections to Germany are very few.

Diabolo tax should be cancelled and repalced by an extra amount in the airport tax.
Or better: the airport should bear this costs and then profit by attracting more passengers.Airport taxes are high enough now.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Conti764 » 20 Mar 2019, 22:40

JOVAN wrote:
20 Mar 2019, 20:54
jan_olieslagers wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 10:03
TGV/ Eurostar connections easy to realize from BRU.
Perhaps not so easy as implied: with its measly three platforms, the railway station is close to maximum capacity. It must be said, though, that this is at least partly due to its use as a terminal station: some trains occupy the platforms much longer than just the time for transferring passengers. And no, it won't be easy to add platform capacity, plus nobody wants more Diabolo tax.

One possible formula could be to have a HST from either London or Paris pass by the Brussels South, Central and North stations, enter the airport from the North, and continue towards Liege, perhaps even continuing into Germany. But even that might be quite complicated to implement. HST from Paris could even avoid the (itself saturated) South-North transfer by using line 26, passing Brussels on the East side.
AMS Train station has 6 platforms (10 tracks ?): it is a very busy and popular station.
BRU train station has 3 (5 tracks): I think all are go-thru ; so also a lot of possibilities. Connections to Germany are very few.

Diabolo tax should be cancelled and repalced by an extra amount in the airport tax.
Or better: the airport should bear this costs and then profit by attracting more passengers.Airport taxes are high enough now.
BRU has two platforms and three tracks in both directions.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba » 20 Mar 2019, 22:56

JOVAN wrote:
20 Mar 2019, 20:54
jan_olieslagers wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 10:03
TGV/ Eurostar connections easy to realize from BRU.
Perhaps not so easy as implied: with its measly three platforms, the railway station is close to maximum capacity. It must be said, though, that this is at least partly due to its use as a terminal station: some trains occupy the platforms much longer than just the time for transferring passengers. And no, it won't be easy to add platform capacity, plus nobody wants more Diabolo tax.

One possible formula could be to have a HST from either London or Paris pass by the Brussels South, Central and North stations, enter the airport from the North, and continue towards Liege, perhaps even continuing into Germany. But even that might be quite complicated to implement. HST from Paris could even avoid the (itself saturated) South-North transfer by using line 26, passing Brussels on the East side.
AMS Train station has 6 platforms (10 tracks ?): it is a very busy and popular station.
BRU train station has 3 (5 tracks): I think all are go-thru ; so also a lot of possibilities. Connections to Germany are very few.

Diabolo tax should be cancelled and repalced by an extra amount in the airport tax.
Or better: the airport should bear this costs and then profit by attracting more passengers.Airport taxes are high enough now.
You can not cancel the Diabolo tax because that's private money that financed the tunnel.
Or maybe you could buy the tunnel investment from the private company but I don't think there is money for that!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by jan_olieslagers » 21 Mar 2019, 09:14

The map shows three tracks:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/50.89761/4.48465

And looking in the real-time info for the station I see 3 platforms being used - unsurprisingly #s 1, 2, 3.
http://www.belgianrail.be/jp/sncb-nmbs- ... yStopsSID=

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by webstermc » 21 Mar 2019, 09:24

I've been in the trainstation monday (I came back from Bilbao).
Indeed only 2 platforms and 3 tracks in total

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by sn26567 » 21 Mar 2019, 10:04

The discussions about the train station are far away from the subject. Could you please continue in the BRU infrastructure topic?
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Conti764 » 21 Mar 2019, 13:50

Jetter wrote:
20 Mar 2019, 01:26
Conti764 wrote:
19 Mar 2019, 21:12
since in my idea BRU would mainly serve a function as reliever hub to LHR, thus having smooth connections extra shengen.
Problem is IAG purchased Aer Lingus for this purpose.
BRU is right in the middle between three huge competing alliances hubs: AMS, CDG (ST) and FRA (*A). It might offer OW some opportunities to steal away some traffic from KL, AF, LH, UA, name it... besides the (partially) relieve hub function...

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by TLspotting » 15 Apr 2019, 22:29

Belgium is between all these hubs and we are all waiting for a miracle !
I'm Thibault Lapers, spotter in Belgium for now 3 years, but not yet across the world and a huuuuuge aviation geek ! Join me on Facebook & Twitter @TLspotting

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by Atlantis » 30 Jun 2019, 15:24

I gave previously already a small overview regarding Star and OneWorld. But it is maybe a good idea to go deeper in the possibilities regarding those both and where to give the exact space.
About Blue Sky we don't speak bcs BRU is between those two major hubs and those home carriers, KLM/AF, are going to replace planes by trains.

What are the possibilities for Star:

* Brussels Airlines: new and more direct destinations in Africa. Make SN again the specialist of Africa. An evening flight to New York and maybe one more destination at the East Coast.

* Air Canada: merged together with Air Transat. For the moment both will fly as own entities but maybe this can change in the future. As both are flying from the same city and both are using big equipment, maybe we could see the B777 or even an aditional flight with the A321XLR.
Canada itself organise yearly the trade and work fair in Brussels. They are keen on finding Belgians who wants to work in Canada, especially Quebeq. It could be a nice new destination with the A321XLR

* Air India: is in financial deep water but a destination in India is a must. First destination Mumbai. But not only AI, also Indigo is interested and this last one could be even faster. For sure SN will not start up again to India.

* Asiana Airlines: is also in financial deep water but talks are on the way to start up flights. We will see

* Shenzhen Airlines: China is the next in a must be. Hainan is offering three flights already. They even could open their European hub in BRU but adding one to two extra destinations. They recently opened a new one to Paris. Mostly BRU is following as we could see in the previous statistics. But Shenzhen is a new airline who is going to fly to BRU with cargo. A logic step after is pax and this from the e-commerce city. Two different Chinese carriers is more safe.

* Singapore Airlines: this is on top of the list. The carrier was flying already in the past with the B747 but is receiving new planes. This is a must to have

* United Airlines: upgraded one of the destinations to the largest B787-10. But an evening flight to NY would be nice to have on top of a new destination to Houston and one from the West Coast.
United could opening by this a hub at BRU. And why not like the success of KLM/Delta, to offer connections from The States to India via BRU. And onward connections via BRU like Jet Airways did.

Star Alliance could have their worldclass hub at the A Pier. The T Gate can be replaced to the new A Pier West to have smooth connections between the long haul flights.


What could offer OneWorld more? OneWorld has already a strong base at BRU with many carriers, mostly European ones. If long haul could be added to this, then the network is completed. Which one can be added?

* American Airlines: this was a very loyal carrier for many decades. This is a must have carrier. New York and Chicago should be added again and they even can use the A321XLR. Extra destinations would be good with them.

* Royal Air Jordanian: was flying already to BRU. They added newer planes to the fleet and can be an other gate to the ME.

* LATAM: South America is a must have. They are flying already with cargo to BRU. Pax would be the logical next step. Brazil and surroundings are high on the list.

Most of the OneWorld carriers are flying from the B Pier. This could be for them the worldclass pier. Only Finnair and Iberia are flying from the A Pier but smooth connections are already on place.

At the same time, the old boarding bridges at the B pier are gradually replaced by the new double bridges, This will make the comfort for the pax higher in boarding and de-boarding.

At this moment there are three waves at BRU. A big one in the morning till noon. One in the afternoon and evening.
For the evening wave, flights to The States, Africa and China can be added. Remember the very successful and always fully booked evening flight of SABENA to NY. Passengers in Europe who missed their connections where flown to BRU to take there this last NY flight. It can be again a success. In the evening again a lot of connections to USA, ME, China and Japan

For the afternoon wave Amman can be added and Far East destinations. To make also optimal the European feeder flights of SN for the evening wave.

At the same time to have a hub for United and Hainan and even maybe an other carrier but also to offer fifth freedom rights like Singapore had in the past. It could make BRU even more attractive.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by sn26567 » 30 Jun 2019, 16:51

Impressive summary, Atlantis.
Atlantis wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 15:24
About Blue Sky we don't speak bcs BRU is between those two major hubs and those home carriers, KLM/AF, are going to replace planes by trains.
I guess you mean SkyTeam. They are worth looking at, because Delta has always been a strong contender in BRU with its two major hubs in JFK and ATL drawing throngs of travellers.

It's true that AF and KL will more and more use train connections, but BRU should try to attract travellers by train as well. This is done for the Netherlands, but not for France.
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by rwandan-flyer » 30 Jun 2019, 17:31

* American Airlines: this was a very loyal carrier for many decades. This is a must have carrier. New York and Chicago should be added again and they even can use the A321XLR. Extra destinations would be good with them.
American Airlines is currently expanding from its Philadelphia hub. I see that there are 3 airlines, from BRU to NYC, on this route, it's probably enough. PHL is also less saturated than New York, the competition is less stiff (no UA or Delta Hubs), and you can reach, many cities in North America and South Africa via PHL.
LATAM: South America is a must have. They are flying already with cargo to BRU. Pax would be the logical next step. Brazil and surroundings are high on the list.
I don't know how is market between Brussels and South America, but if a carrier starts a cargo service, that dosen't mean, that they will start passengers service. Both Qatar Cargo and Emirates Cargo serve some destinations only with a cargo service. Also, an airline can serve a big market in term of pax, but can't provide a cargo service to these destinations
It's true that AF and KL will more and more use train connections, but BRU should try to attract travellers by train as well. This is done for the Netherlands, but not for France.
Not only AF KLM. TGVAir has partnership with Air India, Qatar Airways, French Bee, Air Transat, Air Thaiti, Air Caraibes , Air Austral, Etihad, Emirates, Vietnam Airlines Royal Jordanian.

See the list, at the bottom of the page: https://agence-voyage.oui.sncf/vol/tgvair
Last edited by rwandan-flyer on 30 Jun 2019, 17:51, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by ZavCity » 30 Jun 2019, 17:50

Hallo
Shenzen is not flying cargo to BRU, it will be Sichuan airlines (maybe)later this year
gtz
paul

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by flightlover » 30 Jun 2019, 17:51

rwandan-flyer wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 17:31

I don't know how is market between Brussels and Brazil, but if a carrier starts a cargo service, that dosen't mean, that they will start passengers service. Both Qatar Cargo and Emirates Cargo serve some destinations only with a cargo service. Also, an airline can serve a big market in term of pax, but can't provide a cargo service to these destinations
Except for short haul LCC ops, all flights will take cargo. How much is limited by number of pax, size of plane and most importantly: demand.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by Atlantis » 30 Jun 2019, 18:00

sn26567 wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 16:51
Impressive summary, Atlantis.
Atlantis wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 15:24
About Blue Sky we don't speak bcs BRU is between those two major hubs and those home carriers, KLM/AF, are going to replace planes by trains.
I guess you mean SkyTeam. They are worth looking at, because Delta has always been a strong contender in BRU with its two major hubs in JFK and ATL drawing throngs of travellers.

It's true that AF and KL will more and more use train connections, but BRU should try to attract travellers by train as well. This is done for the Netherlands, but not for France.
SkyTeam indeed, thank you for the correction Andre :)

It is correct that BRU is attracting a lot more pax from The Netherlands then from France. This also bcs of the many campaigns in The Netherlands. It would be also good if a lot of Business would be attracted and not only leisure

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU): Star Alliance and Oneworld under one roof?

Post by Poiu » 30 Jun 2019, 19:42

Atlantis wrote:
30 Jun 2019, 18:00

It is correct that BRU is attracting a lot more pax from The Netherlands then from France. This also bcs of the many campaigns in The Netherlands. It would be also good if a lot of Business would be attracted and not only leisure
Business passengers are mainly looking for a schedule which suits their plans, AMS has a lot more possibilities than BRU.
The recreational Bizz flyer is looking for the cheapest option and that is often AMS as there is a lot more competition.

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