Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 is missing

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Sai
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Sai »

This theory seems more plausible to me iso hijacking...http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh ... ical-fire/

Flanker2
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Flanker2 »

I considered the electrical failure scenario in the first days, see earlier pages, but I've dismissed it very soon.

It doesn't make sense and also this theory is useless because we won't find anyone alive anymore if true.
The best course of action is to look at the scenario's where they could still find the passengers alive.
If the searches are based on a crash scenario, the pax that could still be found alive as hostages may not be found alive.

To look for wreckages, they can always do it later together with Jacques Cousteau if they fancy that. Pursuing on those leads is useless even if they find a FDR that might not tell us how or where the fire started, and I'm glad that the authorities are focussing on the most hopeful and useful direction, being that of finding where the aircraft was landed with pax alive.

One more thing is that even an electric fire won't take out all systems simultaneously and so suddenly. It would take a very strong lightning strike at a bad spot like the WX radar or ground power inlet, causing a massive surge and frying the circuits, starting a fire, for communications to be lost so spontaneously.
But then it would have also taken out the autopilot and satcom.

No wreckage found to date, no ELT signal and evidence that it flew over 7 hours, probably on the autopilot and sometimes below radar coverage. The Malaysian coast lines are well lit, the captain could have returned to KUL easily by following them, weather was good and it wasn't that far.
Cell phones could have been used to reach someone on the ground.
Best evidence of all: Satcom was still emitting signals, and if that could emit, then the pilots could have used SATCOM to communicate as well...

This theory can be dismissed. The best evidence against it is that the authorities who know much more than they're sharing have already confirmed unlawful interference.

While looking whether I could find the B777 AMM online, I stumbled across this Chinese forum page where someone asked for a copy of the B777 AMM manual about 6 months ago and got it, but has done little more on this forum: http://bbs.airacm.com/read-htm-tid-252107.html
Imagine if that had something to do with this case... :lol:

I think that many airline pilots are freaked out by this event and refuse to believe that such a thing could happen to another pilot or themselves, and hence try to find scenario's that would comfort them.

teddybAIR
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by teddybAIR »

I'm afraid that in a hijack scenario where hijackers are knowledgeable enough to disable all communication systems and dodge primary radar, they are also likely to disable CVR and FDR, no?

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quixoticguide
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by quixoticguide »

Some commentators call for the implementation of live streaming of in-flight black box data. But the costs involved with such a system are huge, and not worth (while in no way attempting to devalue the 239 souls on board MH370), the modest benefit that that would emanate from such a system.
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teddybAIR
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by teddybAIR »

There's cheaper solutions such as disabling the feature allowing a crew to switch off a transponder without consent from the ground...

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Treeper
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Treeper »

Almost every smartphone, tablet has a GPS tracker. That seems an affordable solution too. By the way, there are apps to find your smartphone if you lose it, or if it's been stolen. It can't be that hard to install it on every plane, nor would it be too expensive.

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sn26567
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by sn26567 »

Summary of today's MH370 press conference: Malaysia knows nothing new, can't reveal anything more, and focus remains on finding the plane.
André
ex Sabena #26567

teddybAIR
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by teddybAIR »

Treeper wrote:Almost every smartphone, tablet has a GPS tracker. That seems an affordable solution too. By the way, there are apps to find your smartphone if you lose it, or if it's been stolen. It can't be that hard to install it on every plane, nor would it be too expensive.
I'm not sure, but I believe that "GPS" on your tablet/smartphone is based on cellular signal triangulation, not satelate signal triangulation. hence, if you're out of reach of the mobile network, your gps will not display correctly. Not sure, though.

Acid-drop
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Acid-drop »

guys the problem is sending data ...
that's the costy part

no wireless network => need to use sat, need a big antenna
My messages reflect my personal opinion which may be different than yours. I beleive a forum is made to create a debate so I encourage people to express themselves, the way they want, with the ideas they want. I expect the same understanding in return.

flightlover
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by flightlover »

teddybAIR wrote:
Treeper wrote:Almost every smartphone, tablet has a GPS tracker. That seems an affordable solution too. By the way, there are apps to find your smartphone if you lose it, or if it's been stolen. It can't be that hard to install it on every plane, nor would it be too expensive.
I'm not sure, but I believe that "GPS" on your tablet/smartphone is based on cellular signal triangulation, not satelate signal triangulation. hence, if you're out of reach of the mobile network, your gps will not display correctly. Not sure, though.
Depending on the phone using AGPS or GPS. AGPS or Assisted GPS is based on network triangulation and needs a data network to be active.
The other one works like any other stand alone GPS.

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Treeper
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Treeper »

teddybAIR wrote:
Treeper wrote:Almost every smartphone, tablet has a GPS tracker. That seems an affordable solution too. By the way, there are apps to find your smartphone if you lose it, or if it's been stolen. It can't be that hard to install it on every plane, nor would it be too expensive.
I'm not sure, but I believe that "GPS" on your tablet/smartphone is based on cellular signal triangulation, not satelate signal triangulation. hence, if you're out of reach of the mobile network, your gps will not display correctly. Not sure, though.
ah ok, didn't know that. What about expensive cars then? They also have GPS tracers, so that the manufacturer can find your car if it's been stolen. Or is this also via the cellular signal?
anyhow, it can't be that hard to produce, no?

for the antenna: the bulbs on some B747 are antenna's, no?

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quixoticguide
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by quixoticguide »

Treeper wrote:Almost every smartphone, tablet has a GPS tracker. That seems an affordable solution too. By the way, there are apps to find your smartphone if you lose it, or if it's been stolen. It can't be that hard to install it on every plane, nor would it be too expensive.
An app find my plane?!

There's no cellular signal above the ocean. You can't find your smartphone when it has no signal.
Sending this GPS data (realtime) to the satellites is very expensive.
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Flanker2
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by Flanker2 »

Sending this GPS data (realtime) to the satellites is very expensive.
It's expensive but it would also make traffic managament much better and it could reduce other costs.
It would remove the need for NAT OS system that works on position reporting and costs this industry million of euro's in additional fuel due to routing.
It would make more direct routing possible.

Not to speak of the fact that it would enable precise location for search and rescue and help a lot with investigations, to see the flight path of an aircraft before it crashed. For me, the current FDR system is outdated and useless.

So instead of investing in the useless ADS-B, it would be much better and useful to have access to realtime GPS tracking data through SATCOM.

teddybAIR
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by teddybAIR »

There's an entire comittee at ICAO that is devoted to future technological evolutions in aviation. I'm sure they are investigating all possible scenario's in greater depth than we can ever imagine!

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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by caravelle21 »

sn26567 wrote:Summary of today's MH370 press conference: Malaysia knows nothing new, can't reveal anything more, and focus remains on finding the plane.
I really hope they find it, or its remains, soon. Of course in the first place for the relatives of the passengers.

But even the slightest remote possibility of the plane being stored somewhere within the reach of Europe with the upcoming nuclear summit in the Hague where all world leaders will be present must be a nightmare to security there as well. I hope they will be watching closely for any stray 777 in the vincinity of the venue.
Only the thought of it scares the hell out of me for sure....

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sn26567
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by sn26567 »

There is no lack of theories about MH370. Here is a very simple one:

Electrical fire on-board. The pilot wants to divert to the closest suitable airport: Langkawi. Loss of transponders and communications is explained by fire. Overcome by smoke in the cockpit, the pilot abandons control to the auto-pilot which flies the plane until it crashes by lack of fuel.

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh ... ical-fire/
André
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fretn
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by fretn »

sn26567 wrote:There is no lack of theories about MH370. Here is a very simple one:

Electrical fire on-board. The pilot wants to divert to the closest suitable airport: Langkawi. Loss of transponders and communications is explained by fire. Overcome by smoke in the cockpit, the pilot abandons control to the auto-pilot which flies the plane until it crashes by lack of fuel.

http://www.wired.com/autopia/2014/03/mh ... ical-fire/
It would have to be a strange fire for it to last for several hours. We all know how vulnerable isolation in an airplane is to fire. Also look all other fire related accidents (Heldenberg, the Dubai 747 spring to mind), all caused the plane to perish in less than 30 minutes. I find it strange to believe.

regi
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by regi »

The main point still today is: where is the airplane ?

The fact that it has not been found back becomes a big nightmare for the entire aviation world - civilian + military.
I am sure that there are already heads rolling because responsable persons have to say "I don't know".
example: the Cessna landing on the Red Square chopped the head off several Soviet top brass.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mathias_Rust

FlightMate
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by FlightMate »

What about the aircraft who said it heard the pilots say that cabin was desintegrating?
Or the oil rig workers having seen an explosion?

I get lost between facts, "facts" and rumours...

But it could be an explanation. Sudden loss of oxygen due rapid decompression (explosion).
Pilots turn to langkawi or penang. And then lose consciousness due to failure of oxygen supply?

the only thing is the climb to FL450, as reported by medias.
but then, could an heavy b777 (217 pax + 7h of fuel) get to FL450 straight away?
for info, an empty B744 with 4h of fuel can't.

me109
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Re: Malaysia Airlines says it has lost contact with flight M

Post by me109 »

I do not believe in an accident neither in suicide. Accident : why the pilot did not inform ATC? Suicide for that he does not have to change the direction !
Now they are searching at the Maledives but as it was a 777-200ER the aircraft could even reach African coast !
Are there unused airports in that area where he can land ... in secret?

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