Brussels Airlines in 2020

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convair
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Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by convair » 23 Jan 2020, 19:58

Inquirer wrote:
23 Jan 2020, 17:21
FWIW, it has been numerously reported in the past that boardmembers take no remuneration whatsoever... :roll:
It's different for each company ( wether airlines or others). Normally, the remuneration, if any, of the Board Members, is inscribed in the Company By-laws and/or decided by the General Assembly of the Shareholders.

Inquirer
Posts: 2019
Joined: 14 Feb 2012, 14:30

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Inquirer » 23 Jan 2020, 20:14

Poiu wrote:
23 Jan 2020, 18:49
Inquirer wrote:
23 Jan 2020, 17:21
FWIW, it has been numerously reported in the past that boardmembers take no remuneration whatsoever... :roll:
That is completely new to me, do you have a reference?
I know several members of different boards and not a single one is doing it for free, quite the opposite!
SN26567 meanwhile provided you with credible reference material in support, I suppose?

SN's boardmembership clearly doesn't come with a remuneration, yet despite this it seems they have no problem getting the people they want to sit in it. I suppose it's seen as an honour to be part of it, given the legacy it carries and the people you share the table with…?

Passenger
Posts: 6476
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Passenger » 23 Jan 2020, 22:41

sn26567 wrote:
23 Jan 2020, 19:20
The annual report of SN Airholding shows indeed 0 euro for the board members (and 4,072 euros for the commissioners). But I'm sure 'passenger' can enlighten us on those figures.
Haven't checked this for SN Airholding nv/sa yet, but for Brussels Airlines nv/sa, computer says no (onbezoldigd / ne pas rémunéré):
FR:
http://www.ejustice.just.fgov.be/tsv_pd ... 108672.pdf
NL:
http://www.ejustice.just.fgov.be/tsv_pd ... 108671.pdf

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Conti764
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Conti764 » 23 Jan 2020, 22:54

https://www.tijd.be/ondernemen/luchtvaa ... 81226.html
‘Als alles maar schijn is en alles beslist is voor we vergaderen, dan blijven we niet langer. We zijn daar vrij in. Toen we begonnen bij Brussels Airlines, was er geen geld en dus beslisten we dat de bestuurders niet betaald zouden worden. Dat is nooit veranderd. We zitten in de raad zonder vergoeding en dat maakt ons intellectueel totaal vrij.
"We're in the board without remuneration..."

Etienne Davignon, two years ago.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by lumumba » 31 Jan 2020, 14:24

Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Passenger » 31 Jan 2020, 15:35

lumumba wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 14:24
Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
Stop your nonsense, Lumumba. Brussels Airlines has allways been a normal airline.

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CTBke
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by CTBke » 31 Jan 2020, 16:51

lumumba wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 14:24
Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
lumumba wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 14:24
Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
are you serious? how not normal was Brussels Airlines according to you ?
Citybird
The flying dream

jan_olieslagers
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by jan_olieslagers » 31 Jan 2020, 17:16

Also, please define "normal"?

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by lumumba » 31 Jan 2020, 17:44

CTBke wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 16:51
lumumba wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 14:24
Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
lumumba wrote:
31 Jan 2020, 14:24
Now that Brussels Airlines is going to become a normal airline, will it give as many miles as the others?
are you serious? how not normal was Brussels Airlines according to you ?
I apologise for the misunderstanding I meant home carrier not linked to Eurowings(low cost)anymore.
Because till now you receive x6 miles with Brussels Airlines instead of x7 with the other home carriers.
Will they change that?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Stij
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Location: Belgium

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Stij » 01 Feb 2020, 09:19

Nope, Brussels Airlines isn't a normal airline... it's a great airline! :) :) :)

Have a nice weekend, and take life with a smile!

Stij

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by sn26567 » 02 Feb 2020, 23:28

Two disappointing reports on long-haul trips onboard Brussels Airlines A330s, one in Economy and the other in Premium Economy. It seems that Economy really means savings on everything: quality of service, IFE, amenities and quality of food and drinks. Reboot?

SN should take better care of the travel class in which the majority of passengers are flying. There may be nice reports about the business class, but that concerns only some happy few.

BRU-ROB in Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... -monrovia/
JFK-BRU in Premium Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... nomy-a330/
André
ex Sabena #26567

737MAX
Posts: 326
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by 737MAX » 03 Feb 2020, 12:53

sn26567 wrote:
02 Feb 2020, 23:28
Two disappointing reports on long-haul trips onboard Brussels Airlines A330s, one in Economy and the other in Premium Economy. It seems that Economy really means savings on everything: quality of service, IFE, amenities and quality of food and drinks. Reboot?

SN should take better care of the travel class in which the majority of passengers are flying. There may be nice reports about the business class, but that concerns only some happy few.

BRU-ROB in Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... -monrovia/
JFK-BRU in Premium Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... nomy-a330/
Strange that some of you prefer the "good old A333" of Air Canada next to their brand new 787, but seem to quickly negative when it comes to Brussels Airlines. Not sure how an old/used looking cabin of an Air Canada can be better than a refurbished SN A330 to be honest... :|

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by lumumba » 03 Feb 2020, 13:14

737MAX wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 12:53
sn26567 wrote:
02 Feb 2020, 23:28
Two disappointing reports on long-haul trips onboard Brussels Airlines A330s, one in Economy and the other in Premium Economy. It seems that Economy really means savings on everything: quality of service, IFE, amenities and quality of food and drinks. Reboot?

SN should take better care of the travel class in which the majority of passengers are flying. There may be nice reports about the business class, but that concerns only some happy few.

BRU-ROB in Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... -monrovia/
JFK-BRU in Premium Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... nomy-a330/
Strange that some of you prefer the "good old A333" of Air Canada next to their brand new 787, but seem to quickly negative when it comes to Brussels Airlines. Not sure how an old/used looking cabin of an Air Canada can be better than a refurbished SN A330 to be honest... :|
But that's exactly what he said that the cabin was good.
The problems were different!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

airlittoral
Posts: 1
Joined: 03 Feb 2020, 13:48

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by airlittoral » 03 Feb 2020, 14:01

The problems are indeed different.
I worked 10+ years at SN (started at the time of SNBA and recently left) and I think that the problem is two-fold:
* quality in delivery: from cabin maintenance all the way to airport experience and service on board, there's simply NO consistency. When travelling on duty or for leisure, I would always check the crew composition before the flight and could predict exactly what was going to happen on board. Enforcing standards has always been a HUGE problem at SN, but people seem to think "well, we're Belgians, so we're pragmatic"...... well, so are the customers.
* cost-cutting and lack of customer-centricity: "we go the extra smile", "we want to become the most personal airline blablabla" are what SN tells the external audience. Inside, it's a totally different story. "People are concerned about on-time performance. Great! Let's take this as an excuse to cut all the rest (while staying one of the worst in Europe for on-time performance)". SN wants to be everything, and, as someone at LH told me a few years ago "you want to be Air Berlin and pretend that you're going to succeed where everyone else has failed. have fun!".
This is precisely what everyone at SN knows deep inside that is being pictured in these reports. Nobody dares to say it, internally, just because they're afraid of being referred to as "living in the past". For sure, flying with SN is part of the past for me though I wish them the best of luck in a very challenging environment, where differentiation is key.

sean1982
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by sean1982 » 03 Feb 2020, 14:47

1 cabin crew member for a whole economy class because the other crew is on break?? on a 6 hour flight? Who came up with these service standards??

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by convair » 03 Feb 2020, 19:38

sean1982 wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:47
1 cabin crew member for a whole economy class because the other crew is on break?? on a 6 hour flight? Who came up with these service standards??
It seems unbelievable and, if true, unacceptable, even if you're not totally satisfied with your salary and/or working conditions. Pax deserve a minimum of respect and care.

sean1982
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by sean1982 » 03 Feb 2020, 20:14

convair wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 19:38
sean1982 wrote:
03 Feb 2020, 14:47
1 cabin crew member for a whole economy class because the other crew is on break?? on a 6 hour flight? Who came up with these service standards??
It seems unbelievable and, if true, unacceptable, even if you're not totally satisfied with your salary and/or working conditions. Pax deserve a minimum of respect and care.
With British Airways, crew rest (as in organised in bunks or rest seats) is only on flights over 8 hours and even then it would be on the pursers discretion. If the flight was too busy it didnt happen. Legal required rest only comes in play after a flight duty period of 11 minimum to extend the maximum FDP. A break on a 6 hours wide body flight is really not done ....

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Passenger » 03 Feb 2020, 21:56

sn26567 wrote:
02 Feb 2020, 23:28
Two disappointing reports on long-haul trips onboard Brussels Airlines A330s, one in Economy and the other in Premium Economy. It seems that Economy really means savings on everything: quality of service, IFE, amenities and quality of food and drinks. Reboot?

SN should take better care of the travel class in which the majority of passengers are flying. There may be nice reports about the business class, but that concerns only some happy few.

BRU-ROB in Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... -monrovia/
JFK-BRU in Premium Economy: https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brus ... nomy-a330/
.

Let me copy/paste some of the stuff that the above Ben Smithson (The Points Guy) has posted:

.
Then came the lunch service. Oh my days. This was the longest meal service of any flight I have taken. To give you some context, the seatbelt sign was turned on a few times during the service because of mild turbulence, which I recognize can interrupt the service flow. However, only at one period did the pilot actually instruct the crew to halt the service and take their seats (for about 10 minutes or so). The rest of the time, the crew couldn’t seem to make up their mind about whether they should continue the meal service or not. I was in the large rear economy cabin, and most of the trolleys were kept at the rear of the aircraft, so they had to be wheeled past me up the aisle to start service. There was a drinks trolley, a food trolley and then a rubbish trolley. I gave up counting but would guess these trolleys wheeled past me at least 25 times during this marathon meal service. The crew wheeled a trolley up an aisle, served a few people then wheeled it all the way to the back. Then it would appear again about 10 minutes later, when exactly the same thing would happen. Repeat again and again.

Here’s an approximate breakdown of the first four or so hours of the flight:
1 p.m.: Takeoff.
1:30 p.m.: Seatbelt sign off, trolleys start appearing.
2 p.m.: Drinks served with snacks.
3 p.m.: Lunch tray served with second round of drinks.
3:30 p.m.: I completely finish my meal and wait patiently for the crew to collect the tray. The completely full cabin and never-ending procession of trolleys up and down the narrow aisles means it’s impossible to use the bathroom.
4 p.m.: Trays still not collected, and the crew have given up on serving tea or coffee. Passengers are increasingly frustrated at being imprisoned at their seats by dirty meal trays and start stuffing them elsewhere, like in the aisles and around their feet. When a crew member asks a neighbor not to block the aisle with his food tray, the passenger curtly responds, “Well, why don’t you collect them, then?”.
4:30 p.m.: It’s now dark outside. Unable to wait any longer, I maneuver myself out of my seat to use the bathroom, placing my tray back on the tray table. The trolley parade continues, with crew yet again pushing trolleys up the aisle, so I’m hopeful my tray will finally be collected.
4:40 p.m.: I return to my seat to find my dirty tray was still on my tray table. It’s the same all around me. Passengers are now yelling out in the cabin: “Where are the crew?” “Why are our trays still here?” “Why is this taking so long?” Flight attendants ignore call buttons.
5:15 p.m.: Trays are finally collected, and lunch service is finally concluded.
Failing BA? Well, the above is a report from London-Dubai, in Economy, in a brand new Airbus A350. Indeed: the quote above is not a review on Brussels Airlines, but on British Airways. Posted by the same guy, one month ago.
https://thepointsguy.co.uk/reviews/brit ... 0-economy/

Ansett
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Ansett » 03 Feb 2020, 23:55

airlittoral is right. For me, too, SN is no priority anymore. It will become a thing of the past.
I liked snba. There was enthusiasm at that time among the crews.
Imho, SN made too major mistakes in its short life.
1. The merger with Virgin Express, a loss making competitor.
Brandon got a very good deal. He would probably have left BRU if his airline did not make a profit).
The merger brought him some money at least (I think). It was the beginning of a new ominous era for Brussels Airlines.
2. The idea to let LH take over SN was initially good. The agreement with Mayrhuber was fair. His replacement, CF, did not want SN. He handed his hot potato over very quickly to CS who did not want SN either.
SN's Board made the major mistake of giving (too long) extensions to LH/CS to acquire the remaining shares.
No decision from LH to buy the remaining shares according to schedule was a clear sign.
Of course, some members will say that without LH, SN would already be dead. Perhaps. We'll never know.
With LH, SN is going to die, at least as things stand today.
The "doctor's prescription" to make savings when there is no room for savings, is everything but a magic potion to save the airline. I's poison.

Darjeeling
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Joined: 29 Dec 2006, 10:13

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2020

Post by Darjeeling » 04 Feb 2020, 09:13

What I read here is utter BS.

The situation where there is only one F.A in the aft galley is when the duty free sales are in progress or the inventory and sales are being completed in the front / mid galley by the rest of the F.A. That might take up to 3 (!!) hours on a december or july Kinshasa flight !!

How would 7 F.As rest at the same time when there's only 2 or 4 crew rest seats available ?? On most of day flights it's only 2 seats. That's for facts.

On a more emotional note, of course everything deteriorated at SN like many others carriers. Have you ever flown the sh--y economy product of LH ?
SN's crew had to deliver many efforts, they have give in for everything, some of them fly 6 long hauls per month + medium haul in between. Everyone is exhausted. What do passenger expect ?? They pay peanuts they get peanuts treatment. Moreover, the situation described is up to the stubbornness of the inflight service dept at SN which wants to keep the duty free sales which is a huge loss of time, attention consuming and useless from a strict product quality point of view. But it brings a lot of "ancillary revenue", and African pax like to shop while being seated rather than buying in an airport. I wouldn't dare telling how much a FA earns as extra a month for these silly in flight sales.

Typical of SN as described above they give "the impression that" with stupid things like "the extra smile" "these little important extras like DF sales"... but their hard product is declining very quickly.

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