Social actions at air navigation service provider skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

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SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

New hours for LGG tonight !

EBBR A0971/19 NOTAMN
Q) EBBU/SPLC/IV/BO/AE/000/055/5038N00533E
A) EBLG
B) 1903231800 1903232000
E) LIEGE APP CLSD DUE TO STAFF SHORTAGE. EMERG FREQ ARE WATCHED.

EBBR A0972/19 NOTAMN
Q) EBBU/STLC/IV/NBO/A/000/999/5038N00527E
A) EBLG
B) 1903231800 1903232000
E) LIEGE TWR CLSD DUE TO STAFF SHORTAGE. EMERG FREQ ARE WATCHED.

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

737MAX wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 07:51
mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 02:15 Let’s hope that those who called sick will get better soon.
Just to have an idea, how many have to call sick to create that lack of staff?
For this night, 2 were missing on a total staff of 5 I was told !

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

2 calling sick out of 5 for the whole ACC? Or per side (east / west?

Controllers are not obliged to accept a recall if they don’t feel like. So if someone calls sick and nobody (who is at home) picks up the phone, that’s it...

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

5 for the whole ACC on saturday nights. No stand-by shift at night, nor during week-end ! So indeed, you come back to work on a voluntary basis.

By the way, a volunteer showed-up in LGG, 0-rate cancelled.

EBBR A0974/19 NOTAMC A0971/19
Q) EBBU/SPCN/IV/BO/AE/000/055/5038N00533E
A) EBLG
B) 1903231136
E) NOTAM CANCELLED

EBBR A0975/19 NOTAMC A0972/19
Q) EBBU/STCN/IV/NBO/A/000/999/5038N00527E
A) EBLG
B) 1903231137
E) NOTAM CANCELLED

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

There used to be no stand-by shifts at all during years because management and controllers couldn't agree on how to put a system in place and what the conditions would be.
Now they have stand-by(s) for some shifts, not for others.
So yes, if nobody is willing to come, then Atco's who have called sick cannot be replaced. This is of course scary in aviation, when you know what the consequences can be in case of absence of several people. And it's also a handy tool to use if you want to block the system.

On the other hand, 5 Atcos for the whole night is little but it's still possible not to close the whole FIR with 5 people + probably a supervisor who can help too. Then we come to the minimum break requirements: a whole long story :D
Last edited by mvg on 23 Mar 2019, 14:40, edited 1 time in total.

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

Anyway it looks like Mr Dehaene's communication was a bit too quick this time !

https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2019/03/23 ... -van-luik/

https://www.lesoir.be/214104/article/20 ... t-de-liege
Last edited by SR20 on 23 Mar 2019, 14:42, edited 1 time in total.

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

737MAX wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:38
mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:22 There used to be no stand-by shifts at all during years because management and controllers couldn't agree on how to put a system in place and what the conditions would be.
Now they have stand-by(s) for some shifts, not for others.
So yes, if nobody is willing to come, then Atco's who have called sick cannot be replaced. This is of course scary in aviation, when you know what the consequences can be in case of absence of several people. And it's also a handy tool to use if you want to block the system.
Quite crazy :shock:
But we can't blame anyone for not coming to work in his day off, I guess...
You are right: a day off is a day off. And people have the right to have plans and refuse to come to work.

But there is an important sign here: one Atco accepted the recall in Liège: it clearly shows that some don't agree with the movement. Hats off to that person!

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

Note also that before beeing cancelled, the 0 rate was first shortened between 19 and 21 LT, one controller accepting to start his night shift earlier.

But of course, no mention of this in the media 😏

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:42
But there is an important sign here: one Atco accepted the recall in Liège: it clearly shows that some don't agree with the movement. Hats off to that person!
I would have another interpretation here ! Wasn't it said by the ACV representative that ATCO's would stop actions friday and during week-end ? 😉
If one can consider that not coming back to work on an day off is an action !
Last edited by SR20 on 23 Mar 2019, 15:08, edited 4 times in total.

flightlover
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by flightlover »

mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:42 You are right: a day off is a day off. And people have the right to have plans and refuse to come to work.

But there is an important sign here: one Atco accepted the recall in Liège: it clearly shows that some don't agree with the movement. Hats off to that person!
Or you could see it as that one person is more dedicated to delivering a service than upset about the conditions. it does not mean he doesn't agree with his colleagues about the issues raised.

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

By the way, for those who think that everything runs smoothly in a private ANSP !
Capture+_2019-03-23-16-05-06.png

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

SR20 wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 16:18 By the way, for those who think that everything runs smoothly in a private ANSP !

Capture+_2019-03-23-16-05-06.png
DFS is private but owned 100% by the State. Reminds me of a company in our country :)
Of course privatizing won’t solve everything but will at least provide a better business continuity as there will be clear rules accepted by both sides and set up from the start.
Now neither the management neither the Atcos respect the rules. It’s a mess!

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:42 ....
But there is an important sign here: one Atco accepted the recall in Liège: it clearly shows that some don't agree with the movement.....
Or maybe his mother in law was coming for dinner ...

;)

H.A.

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luchtzak
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by luchtzak »

From:24 MAR 19 00:30 Till:24 MAR 19 03:00
Text:BRUSSELS ACC CLSD DUE TO STAFF SHORTAGE. EMERG FREQ ARE WATCHED

convair
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by convair »

Homo Aeroportus wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 18:37
mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:42 ....
But there is an important sign here: one Atco accepted the recall in Liège: it clearly shows that some don't agree with the movement.....
Or maybe his mother in law was coming for dinner ...

;)

H.A.
:thumbup:

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luchtzak
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by luchtzak »

English version for all our friends abroad (I found it on Facebook and google translated it :-D ):

Dear Lecteus, dear travellers,

As air controllers of skeyes, we are in the last few days, much more than we wish, in the heart of a storm (media).

We believe that you have the right to know the reasons for our use of current actions.
Contrary to the explanations that are often presented to you, there are no financial claims, but only a request for respect for laws and labour regulations, and this in a guarantee of guarantee of your security.
Indeed, we have been facing a lack of staff for a few years. In the canac air control centre, this one rises even to 25 % of the frame!

This shortage is the direct consequence of a clear lack of planning and long-term vision in the head of our direction, as well as a thirsty thirst for savings.

Can you imagine the consequences in your business, department or service if the same tasks were to be accomplished with a quarter of your colleagues in less!

The leaders of skeyes, which we have been preparing for years of the disaster scenario that was preparing, continues to deny reality, and seek his salvation in the non-respect of laws and labour regulations. Waiting for judgments in the five trials against our employer, we are continuously facing series of more than ten days of consecutive work, which is contrary to all international recommendations.

Fatigue, demotivation and even health problems due to this rhythm of infernal work are only increasing, and that at the expense of security.

We realize the great economic importance of our sector, and the role we play in it, but security is and will always remain our priority. Never we could accept that this situation has the result of a fatal incident or accident.

A very simple solution is within reach, since it is already applied in other air control centers, which have to manage the same problems of lack of staff.

Unfortunately, skeyes's leaders prefer to focus on achieving the best results, and refuse to engage in a path where controllers, airlines and passengers would be all winners.

In view of the risks for security that are taken by the direction of skeyes, we decided to react by showing the right example. This is why our actions are to work with reduced teams in order to continue to guarantee the continuity and security of operations.

We make the impact possible for travellers, but we hope to be able to count on your understanding in this fight for our safety to all.

Finally, Friday we will also be closing the attacks on March 22, a dramatic event that has all affected us, like the rest of the aeronautical community...

By respect for the workers of the airport as well as for the victims and their families, we will not be able to do any action during the tribute ceremonies.

Our thoughts are with them!

Thank you for your understanding.

The aerial dosimeters of skeyes.

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

mvg wrote: 23 Mar 2019, 14:22 On the other hand, 5 Atcos for the whole night is little but it's still possible not to close the whole FIR with 5 people + probably a supervisor who can help too. Then we come to the minimum break requirements: a whole long story :D
5 Atcos for the whole night, for 2 sectors, supervisor included !

Boeing767copilot
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Boeing767copilot »

CEO Decuyper interview Het Nieuwsblad (Google translate)

Despite an agreement, the air traffic controller Skeyes continues to fiddle. Friday and Saturday night, air traffic was already hampered, and from Monday the Christian union promises more actions. For weeks, managing director Johan Decuyper abstained from commenting, "not to torpedo the negotiation process". Now he is responding for the first time. According to him it is not about work pressure, but about power. "Some of the Belgian Guild of Air Traffic Controllers hold the company hostage."

Contact with the unions is actually going pretty well, says Skeyes CEO Johan Decuyper. Surprising, knowing that it has been storming at the former Belgocontrol for weeks now. Reconciliation attempts with ACV-Transcom and the smaller liberal association VSOA always failed. And that to the great annoyance of travelers, airlines and airports. Last Friday an agreement was reached on the joint committee, a consultative body between employers and employees. But for the time being, only the non-strike socialist union approved the agreement.

Decuyper is convinced that the promotions will continue despite a "good agreement" according to the management. “We have dealt with all 25 points of the strike notice. The agreement was approved by a majority and will be worked out in consultation with the trade unions. ”At the same time he tightens the reins. Disciplinary proceedings have been started against the chairman of the Guild. “We will tackle certain practices from now on. We will no longer tolerate illegal absences. Management manages the company, not the Guild. "

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

The CEO is right: only a small group of "leaders" create the mess. The others do not dare to stand up and say no. It has been like that for years!

Nevertheless I fear that bringing one person to court is going to (re)create a larger group of protest and lead to even more tensions and actions. Let's see.

About the closures at night when there were only 5 Atcos (supervisor included), it's hard to say if they could have remained open the whole night. You need to see who was qualified for east and for west (some have both qualifications). Mathematically it's possible to stay open the whole night with 3 for one sector (approach is doing it every night on a standard basis). So there was definitely room for keeping at least half the FIR open (there must have been 3 atcos out of 5 qualified on one side at least).
Who remembers about the double or triple shifts? Nobody was complaining about breaks or fatigue at that time. Not sure it was respecting the rules either ;)

About breaks, ICAO says:
The ratio of duty periods to breaks.
Breaks within a duty period should be planned according to workload, complexity of ATC provision, time of the day, type of rostering system. The minimum duration of a break should be 30 minutes.

Maximum time providing ATC service without breaks.
The maximum time providing ATC service should be 2 hours for personnel providing ATC service working with visual terminals and/or radar displays. Intervals can be reviewed periodically or when an increase in traffic load was experienced. ATSUs experiencing low traffic loads for prolonged periods of time may extend shift sessions to 3 hours.

Not sure where that 3 hours interruption/closure in the middle of the night comes from...

About the future, the only long term solution is to start from zero. Put clear conditions on paper and hire those who are willing to work. As long as the company and the employees will be linked to the State with thousands of rules that everyone interprets to his advantage, it will not work.
Many airline have changed their model. It's high time for ATC to do the same, together with a redesign of the airspace at European level (EASA shall be the safeguard to guarantee that the rules are safe). The airlines will benefit from it and also the controllers. A big part of the staff shortage will be solved as well.
One example: Liège and Maastricht: why are there two different approach sectors?
There are hundreds of similar examples accross Europe. Let's change this! And let the things move! They have been working on such projects for years for very little change.

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sn26567 »

mvg wrote: 24 Mar 2019, 09:06 Many airline have changed their model. It's high time for ATC to do the same, together with a redesign of the airspace at European level (EASA shall be the safeguard to guarantee that the rules are safe). The airlines will benefit from it and also the controllers. A big part of the staff shortage will be solved as well.
One example: Liège and Maastricht: why are there two different approach sectors?
There are hundreds of similar examples accross Europe. Let's change this! And let the things move! They have been working on such projects for years for very little change.
Exactly. Airlines for Europe (A4E) has been fighting for a more efficient airspace since it was created.

At the beginning of this month, I attended the annual A4E Aviation Summit. Its new Chairman Michael O'Leary was saying: "The EU must tackle inefficient ATC monopolies through internationalisation of airspace, introduction of competition between ATC providers, and quicker delivery and flexible deployment of air traffic controllers. Airlines are doing everything possible to protect their passengers from another year of record delays and cancellations due to Europe’s mismanaged airspace. The EU must take responsibility to fix these fundamental problems rather than endlessly talking about them."

https://www.aviation24.be/organisations ... anagement/
André
ex Sabena #26567

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