Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by **sn26567** » 15 Oct 2019, 23:08

Ansett wrote: ↑
15 Oct 2019, 16:08
Well, Guys ! I think that on an aviation geeks site we have pretty well exhausted the point and time has come to turn the corner on it. Everybody will draw its own conclusions.

As Saratoga rightly pointed out in an earlier post : they must have more important issues to deal with at the moment.

Can we get back to (strictly) aviation ?

I could not have written better myself. Back to aviation now!

rwandan-flyer · Post by **rwandan-flyer** » 16 Oct 2019, 21:19

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by sn26567 » 07 Oct 2019, 20:41

rwandan-flyer wrote: ↑
07 Oct 2019, 19:29
Brussels Airlines: the divorce with Eurowings is not yet registered

Three months after announcing its separation from Lufthansa's low-cost subsidiary, the Belgian airline is still part of the Eurowings group, pending a strategic plan.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... ncore-acte

The article is behind a paywall!But indeed there are many signs that Brussels Airlines is far from having regained its independence from Eurowings: no monthly statistics, no mention of the airline in the LH press releases, etc.

Seen this morning, at Paris Cdg, OO-SNN (Bru-Cdg-Bru), but no operated by Brussels Airlines on the fuselage. I don't know, if it was still the case on this aircraft

CTBke · Post by **CTBke** » 17 Oct 2019, 15:19

It never was the case ... it arrived at SN like this.. only the belgian registration gives it away.

brusselsairlinesfan · Post by **brusselsairlinesfan** » 17 Oct 2019, 23:18

rwandan-flyer wrote: ↑
16 Oct 2019, 21:19

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by sn26567 » 07 Oct 2019, 20:41

rwandan-flyer wrote: ↑
07 Oct 2019, 19:29
Brussels Airlines: the divorce with Eurowings is not yet registered

Three months after announcing its separation from Lufthansa's low-cost subsidiary, the Belgian airline is still part of the Eurowings group, pending a strategic plan.

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... ncore-acte

The article is behind a paywall!But indeed there are many signs that Brussels Airlines is far from having regained its independence from Eurowings: no monthly statistics, no mention of the airline in the LH press releases, etc.

Seen this morning, at Paris Cdg, OO-SNN (Bru-Cdg-Bru), but no operated by Brussels Airlines on the fuselage. I don't know, if it was still the case on this aircraft

Is this plane still needed within the SN fleet after the demise of Thomas Cook ?

RoMax · Post by **RoMax** » 18 Oct 2019, 00:03

Besides being the most recent A320 to join SN's fleet, OO-SNN is also effectively the youngest A320 in the fleet (9 years younger than OO-SNA) and owned by LHG contrary to most others in SN's A32F fleet. Two factors which are quite certainly more important than the livery... In case SN has an excess of A32F aircraft, it doesn't make any sense at all to sent this one away just because of the livery.

This is really not a priority for SN now. The few passengers that will be confused "are we flying Eurowings?!" discover soon enough that it's normal SN staff, normal SN product, etc. on board.

brusselsairlinesfan · Post by **brusselsairlinesfan** » 18 Oct 2019, 07:32

RoMax wrote: ↑
18 Oct 2019, 00:03
Besides being the most recent A320 to join SN's fleet, OO-SNN is also effectively the youngest A320 in the fleet (9 years younger than OO-SNA) and owned by LHG contrary to most others in SN's A32F fleet. Two factors which are quite certainly more important than the livery... In case SN has an excess of A32F aircraft, it doesn't make any sense at all to sent this one away just because of the livery.

This is really not a priority for SN now. The few passengers that will be confused "are we flying Eurowings?!" discover soon enough that it's normal SN staff, normal SN product, etc. on board.

I do 100% agree... seems so logical. But I was also thinking in terms of overcapacity.

Post by **Stij** » 23 Oct 2019, 14:41

According to Flemish Newspaper "De Standaard", Brussels Airlines should become a smaller but more profitable company. However, no employees are to be fired. More news to follow...
https://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf2019102 ... 7732535605

Post by **sn26567** » 23 Oct 2019, 16:08

Stij wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 14:41
According to Flemish Newspaper "De Standaard", Brussels Airlines should become a smaller but more profitable company. However, no employees are to be fired. More news to follow...
https://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf2019102 ... 7732535605

The whole Belgian press writes about it. Also Aviation24.be:

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... crap-jobs/

SLM · Post by **SLM** » 23 Oct 2019, 17:12

L'histoire se répète?

VoloperTe · Post by **VoloperTe** » 23 Oct 2019, 17:42

I'm really sad, i feel like living the dark years of Sabena !! Cuts in the fleet ? I think yes, they are too many and old A319 and A320... in the future LH has interest to acquire smaller aircrafts (A220) for Brussels Airlines, remove all A319 and CRJ900, and keep maybe A320 fleet with newer A320/A321neo.
For widebodies aircraft, A330 fleet is perfect (why not A330-900) and A321LR...

lumumba · Post by **lumumba** » 23 Oct 2019, 18:50

I my opinion wrong way to try to make a company profitable....but who am I.

Homo Aeroportus · Post by **Homo Aeroportus** » 23 Oct 2019, 20:38

Need to go to Bamako.
CDG-BKO with AF is not appealing as I carry some bulky equipment.
Solution out of BRU : via another airport in the region (DSS, ABJ, OUA, ...) then a connection with Air Senegal or Ivoire but no same-day transit available hence need to stay overnight.
My preference goes for a hotel rather an airport bench but then Oopsie Daisy, except for Senegal you need a visa

I booked SN to DSS then, next day flight to BKO with HC (Air Senegal).
Just by curiosity I checked the other members of the LH family :
LH : Error "There are no flights or fares available for the dates you have selected". This on Business, Premium and Economy.
LX : destination entered as "DSS" or "Dakar" returns a "No Items found".
SN : still bookable so seats available at that date.

With friends like these you don't need enemies, do you?

I am so stunned to see that, apparently, you cannot book a BRU-DSS on LH or LX that I would appreciate cross-check by others.
If I didn't goof on that one, what could possibly be the explanation for mutty Lufty and brother LX not to propose the SN flight.

H.A.

PS : forgot this last one. On the Star Alliance web site, BRU-DSS is available ... but only TK via IST !!!

nordikcam · Post by **nordikcam** » 23 Oct 2019, 21:14

Homo Aeroportus wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 20:38

With friends like these you don't need enemies, do you?

I am so stunned to see that, apparently, you cannot book a BRU-DSS on LH or LX that I would appreciate cross-check by others.
If I didn't goof on that one, what could possibly be the explanation for mutty Lufty and brother LX not to propose the SN flight.

H.A.

PS : forgot this last one. On the Star Alliance web site, BRU-DSS is available ... but only TK via IST !!!

SN sleeps since LH cares ... Cristina Foerster has no influence on the future of SN and does not have the phone number of LH ... or LH wants the burial of SN.
It does not take years of discussion to coordinate or see schedules of connection ... it takes will. No will. So...

DeltaWiskey · Post by **DeltaWiskey** » 23 Oct 2019, 21:44

VoloperTe wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 17:42
For widebodies aircraft, A330 fleet is perfect (why not A330-900) and A321LR...

A330's are actually a bit too big for some destinations. In my opinion, the A321(X)LR is a very compelling aircraft and would fit very well in the current network, the only downside is its cargo capacity (especially for Africa), and its high price.

Let's not jump to conclusion regarding today's news, it's only based on rumours so far. But a shrink can't be a big surprise to all of us, Thomas Cook was good for 800-900k passengers per year (about 10% of short haul capacity), so it is widely expected that 2020 will be a shrink due to the TC bankruptcy. We just have to wait a few weeks until more is known about the full "Reboot" plan.

Regarding the booking system: now that SN is not going to integrate in EW, it is going to the same booking engine as OS, LX, LH. So yes, it will be possible in the future to also book SN flights on the website of LH, LX, OS. Rome wasn't built on one day either, just be patient.
And to all of you who just think these are "just" some IT configuration issues, these reservation systems are the core of an airline, these are mega IT-projects that easily go into the tens of millions euros, with many, many parties involved.

PttU · Post by **PttU** » 23 Oct 2019, 22:14

DeltaWiskey wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 21:44
Let's not jump to conclusion regarding today's news, it's only based on rumours so far. But a shrink can't be a big surprise to all of us, Thomas Cook was good for 800-900k passengers per year (about 10% of short haul capacity), so it is widely expected that 2020 will be a shrink due to the TC bankruptcy. We just have to wait a few weeks until more is known about the full "Reboot" plan.

The details may still be covered in rumours, but the shrink is not based on a rumour.

Regarding the booking system: now that SN is not going to integrate in EW, it is going to the same booking engine as OS, LX, LH. So yes, it will be possible in the future to also book SN flights on the website of LH, LX, OS. Rome wasn't built on one day either, just be patient.
And to all of you who just think these are "just" some IT configuration issues, these reservation systems are the core of an airline, these are mega IT-projects that easily go into the tens of millions euros, with many, many parties involved.

Why isn't EW and the rest of the LH-group on the same booking engine anyway? There are LH-flights operated by EW as well. And I assume the same booking engine for both would be cheaper, ergo in the benefit of EW?

convair · Post by **convair** » 23 Oct 2019, 22:25

DeltaWiskey wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 21:44
Regarding the booking system: now that SN is not going to integrate in EW, it is going to the same booking engine as OS, LX, LH. So yes, it will be possible in the future to also book SN flights on the website of LH, LX, OS. Rome wasn't built on one day either, just be patient.
And to all of you who just think these are "just" some IT configuration issues, these reservation systems are the core of an airline, these are mega IT-projects that easily go into the tens of millions euros, with many, many parties involved.

It's the same the other way around: if you try BRU-ATL, you get to GVA with SN, then to IAD with UAL, then to ATL with UAL again; same thing for the return flights; no mention of the direct LH flights from FRA to ATL and back!

DeltaWiskey · Post by **DeltaWiskey** » 23 Oct 2019, 22:29

PttU wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 22:14
Why isn't EW and the rest of the LH-group on the same booking engine anyway? There are LH-flights operated by EW as well. And I assume the same booking engine for both would be cheaper, ergo in the benefit of EW?

That's one of the reasons why the EW-SN split was announced last June, some big decisions had to be made with regards to IT infrastructure. It was concluded that EW had to go to the simplest, leanest, most cost-efficient solution, but this wouldn't work for a hub-like airline like SN. There is unfortunately not a one-size-fits-all solution.

Atlantis · Post by **Atlantis** » 23 Oct 2019, 22:38

No surprise at all. Of what is known now. Each airline nowadays is looking at its own destination map. What doesn't perform good will be removed. The same will be for SN. But we can be sure about long haul. This will not be touched and as we could see, this will even grow.

Correct that the A330 is too for certain destinations. That's why triangular flights are still needed and even than they are not full.

For sure the ex-TC planes are too much, even more than those. Like I wrote before, going for a full A319 and A320 for Europe was a too big plane. The A320 fits much better for certain destinations.

As long haul, the B787 would be a better choice.

But OK, that would mean too much of different types. But it could be, Boeing for long haul and Airbus for short and medium haul

I wish them all success bcs aviation is not easy. A lot of companies are suffering for the moment.

Jetter · Post by **Jetter** » 24 Oct 2019, 04:17

nordikcam wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 21:14
SN sleeps since LH cares ... Cristina Foerster has no influence on the future of SN and does not have the phone number of LH

Do you know this for a fact or is this just your imagination? If true, maybe she could score his number if she would dress better.

DeltaWiskey wrote: ↑
23 Oct 2019, 21:44
Let's not jump to conclusion regarding today's news, it's only based on rumours so far. But a shrink can't be a big surprise to all of us, Thomas Cook was good for 800-900k passengers per year (about 10% of short haul capacity), so it is widely expected that 2020 will be a shrink due to the TC bankruptcy. We just have to wait a few weeks until more is known about the full "Reboot" plan.

Indeed, the name 'reboot' was known many months ago and that could only mean a shrink. Adding the Thomas Cook disaster at the hands of Bernard Gustin made it absolutely sure SN has to shrink. Thus we don't know much more with the revelation of today.

Flanker3 · Post by **Flanker3** » 24 Oct 2019, 08:53

There is no willpower at SN management.
The talented ones with willpower have already left the boat frustrated.

Thomas Cook's failure is a bummer, but part of the travel agencies have been taken over by Wamos so not all is lost. I personally don't understand why SN didn't make a bid on it, considering that as major creditors, they could have secured a good deal and set it up as a separate subsidiary with low risks.
To stick it to Gustin is unfair.

About merging IT systems and Rome not being built in one night. Well, they are part of the LH group since 10 years, sharing the same mileage program. It's really not that hard to merge IT systems and it should have been one of the first priorities.
As you can see, LH is also not properly run.

LH has many fires brewing.
OS not profitable and VIE has now become an ultra-competitive environment. I doubt that OS will survive, LH has clearly lost control of the situation.

With SN announcing a retreat in fanfare, I wonder if we won't see a massive LCC offensive. I'm thinking about Lauda, Easyjet and Wizzair.
I won't be surprised if LH loses its grip on BRU too.

SN is well-positioned overall.
Quite frankly, fares are competitive, they offer decent timings, decent services, the Loop program is working well.
I have also seen progress at Eurowings, they are really transforming into a pan-European airline to the image of Spohr.

So I wil reiterate some suggestions from the past. Narrowbodies to Africa, widebodies to Asia, real business class product on short haul, better profiling and segmentation for yield management to maximise business with high unit margin while maximising leisure with volume to get the most revenue from both segments.
More regional routes to connect more dots and feed nto the network.
Offer more frequencies to Italy and Spain in the high season. This is where Ryanair is making its money.