Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

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luchtzak
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by luchtzak »

sn26567 wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 22:53
Passenger wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 22:31
- Scanning baggage system / Système de scanning de bagages;
For this one, did they select the cheapest, or the most reliable contractor?
Brussels Airport apologizes after luggage system mishap and offers €50 vouchers to affected passengers

https://www.aviation24.be/airports/brus ... assengers/

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

Meanwhile in Duesseldorf ....

17JUL
DUS Luggage Hall.jpg
See : https://www.thelocal.de/20190717/chaos- ... -breakdown

Say what you want but these Germans are damn good when it comes to organize a chaos.
;)

Don't know if the PAX will get the 50 EUR vouchers though.

H.A.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by sn26567 »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
23 Jul 2019, 15:20
Meanwhile in Duesseldorf ....

17JUL

DUS Luggage Hall.jpg

See : https://www.thelocal.de/20190717/chaos- ... -breakdown

Say what you want but these Germans are damn good when it comes to organize a chaos.
;)

Don't know if the PAX will get the 50 EUR vouchers though.

H.A.
Ha ha! And some Belgians swear they will never fly from Brussels because Düsseldorf is so much better! :mrgreen:
André
ex Sabena #26567

JOVAN
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by JOVAN »

JOVAN wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 20:56
Stij wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 16:50
Atlantis wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 14:21
...
Your responses are the perfect example of an organisation that is centered around itself and doesn't even have an idea how their faults ruin their customers experience. Please google "Copernicus".

Could be we don't understand airline business, but you don't understand passenger business.

So. it's perfectly normal for Brussels Airport that in 3 months time, 3 days most of your pax leave without there luggage without ANY compensation? Brussels Airport screws up... passengers pay for whatever they need... without any compensation because the airline is not at fault.
Atlantis,

when you see Mr. Feist these next days please ask him to first present his apologies to all users of the airport for the malfunctions happening over and over again. An adbertisemnt inall newspapers can help.
ASk him to promise COMPENSATION to all users who got delays, travelled without luggage. etc.
I hope TEST AANKOOP / TEST ACHAT will open a Class action, so you take it seriously..

Also ask Mr. Feist to make clear what is done/ wil be done now to avoid this breakdowns in the future.
Not empty bla bla . Real measures and timing.

Accepting, recognizing there are huge problems and apologizing for them is a first step.
DENIAL is no longer possible.

Then promise to work on shorter queues at immigration, check in, baggaga delivery, shorter transfers, taxi queues, ..
Cleaner welcome area, exit, parking areas etc..
That is for the PAX.

then eventually talk to the airlines, your first degree customers. BRU is very expensive and offers a product so-so. They expect more and better services.

Once things are under control try to become a Top 20 Airport in Europe in terms of PAX (= a good measure !!). Next continue to become Top 15.
With Happy PAX it is possible.

Cheers
Excuses and compensation done: that is a good start in the process of showing respect to PAX.

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Conti764
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Conti764 »

JOVAN wrote:
22 Jul 2019, 22:14
Conti764 wrote:
20 Jul 2019, 12:30
b720 wrote:
20 Jul 2019, 09:05


And why are they to be paid more? It is a very luxurious environment to work at, compared to many other places they are deployed at. No hardship at all! Security risk? That is part of of their overall job..they are at risk whenever they are called to any situation. Taxes at BRU are high enough as they are.
They'll have to come up with some incentive to attract and keep officers.

Back in the days of the Rijkswacht/Gendarmerie it was easy. You were assigned to a post and only based on seniority hou could leave (often closer to home). Nowadays people are free to join any avaiable unit/zone even if they're straight out of police school. So young officers who are assigned to the border police leave again as soon as possible. Combined with older officers going on pension.

Many of them don't like to be in a cubicle for over 6 hours per shift...
We really have a crisis of authority in this country.

Too many ministers of mobility, but everything seems to come to a stop.

Fragmentation is disastrous. All noses are in different directions it seems.

How can you not have enough policemen to organize a decent Passport control system, with respect for the PAX. There are 40.000 of them in Belgium ?!?!
What are they doing. They have the help of thousands of intelligent cameras.

Mr. Feist should make this passport control issue a priority. Convince the local commander to put more officers during peak hours.

With a strong Minister for this Departemnt, things could change... :roll:
Yes, there are about 40k police officers in Belgium, of which roughly 11000 federal police officers and the rest local.

The aviation police is a federal entity so basicly you can only recruit within those 11k.Great, enough people you'd think, however... passportcontrol is a specialized job for which a member of the border polive has to follow an extensive formation, so not open to just everybody. On top of that, all federal units are in dire need of extra staff and you just can't force anybody to do a job he/she didn't choose.

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

Very remotely related to the BRU Infra topic here but ;)

Small article in the current edition of

AoW Jul19.jpg


ePassport Gates Extended.

Abstract :
The UK government has expanded the use of ePassport gates to seven(*) more countries allowing passengers to enter the UK quickly and securely…
(*) : Australia, Canada, Japan, New Zealand, Singapore South Korea and USA.

Home Secretary said : “Our new global immigration and border system will improve security and fluidity for passengers coming to visit or work in the UK.
The new system will help to drive our economy, cement our reputation as global leader and send a clear message to the world : The UK is open for business” …

There are 264 ePassport gates in operation at 15 air and rail terminals in the UK.

When there is a will, ...

H.A.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

... (or where there's a Brexit looming?) ;)

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Atlantis
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Atlantis »

Regarding the E-Gates -> under the umbrella of the government. First point of the new government should be to implement much more E-Gates

But, the first part of the B-Pier is now also fully refurbished since a few years, one the same level after you passed security check in in the Connector.

It would be a good idea to start to refurbish also the lower part of the B-Pier, the whole arrival level. Now it is still too dark and dull with at the end a too narrow border control. In the middle the officers who are checking the passports and on the left side you have a few E-Gates.

Preferable would be of the whole level would be more lighter, more day light. This will reduce also the cost in electricity and smaller the footprint.
The area for border control should be in the same very modern State-of-the-art level as the security check in the Connector. A lot of daylight and full of E-Gates. Keep only a few officers there for extra checking, random cases, people who are not allowed to enter the country, etc etc

We have very modern technology, it should be used in a very modern airport. We have about 28 security check in, one of the biggest in Europe, but to enter the country via Border Control is way too small and not efficient.

Via E-Gates you have a much better control who is coming in.

But the government has to do something, they should have the will to do it.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

What has government to do with the BAC architecture? It is a private venture, isn't it?

And, as I've stated before, keep a clear distinction between short term and long term. Long term, your ideas may well be fine, though I wonder who is going to pay for them. Not the Belgian government, so much is clear - they're already short of money, actually very short.

But there is a more urgent problem on the short term, if I understand things all right.

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Atlantis
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Atlantis »

jan_olieslagers wrote:
23 Jul 2019, 21:22
What has government to do with the BAC architecture? It is a private venture, isn't it?

And, as I've stated before, keep a clear distinction between short term and long term. Long term, your ideas may well be fine, though I wonder who is going to pay for them. Not the Belgian government, so much is clear - they're already short of money, actually very short.

But there is a more urgent problem on the short term, if I understand things all right.
Hi Jan,

I think that my first sentence was very clear:

"Regarding the E-Gates -> under the umbrella of the government" I was not writing anything about government and BAC architecture. Both has nothing to do with each other.

What I refer about is that the whole huge area has to be refurbished too, to make it modern, wider and efficient (which is under the umbrella of BAC) and to place it full with E-Gates (which is for the government)

Yes I know that the government is lack with money, around 7 billion euro. but you have to invest first to have a good return too.
Off topic, the Belgian industry starts to complain too that there is still no government, bcs they need also security and funds and a lot of other stuff.

I think you understand better now what I mean?

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

It does not matter whether I understand you. You should understand that no money is to be expected from the federal government. Certainly not for new architecture (but neither will the shareholders pass one penny more than absolutely totally unavoidably necessary) but neither for border control. Not today and not tomorrow. No use to state "they should" - they won't. Especially because no degree of investment will bring a profit, at least not first-hand short-term. And, as has been stated before, politics has ceased to consider long-term altogether - regrette qui veult.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by sn26567 »

Who invested in the new area for customs in the arrivals area? The airport, or the PFS Finances in charge of Customs and Excise (if it hasn't any money to do it)?
André
ex Sabena #26567

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

Ah, the FodFin might well see a short-term return on investment, yes, I am quite willing to believe that. Quite a lot of nice valuable stuff to be seized. And well done on them, brave bravi! But that is customs & excise, indeed, not border control.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba »

What I saw this morning at the airport is completely outrageous at the customs there were 4 policeman plus the machines for the European passports....and for foreign passports there were only two policeman,there was a line of at least of an hour and a half for them.
I crossed the border in less than 5 minutes....how is this possible I can not understand that!!!!!!!
Last edited by lumumba on 26 Jul 2019, 19:02, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Sabena320 »

Sadly enough it's not that abnormal, especially flights arrive here in peaks and even then, a flight that is 15 min early and one that is 15min late can cause a sudden pax flow. Waiting times at border control CAN be high in any part of the world and I have waited +1hr in several other 'civilized' countries as well...

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba »

Sabena320 wrote:
26 Jul 2019, 15:56
Sadly enough it's not that abnormal, especially flights arrive here in peaks and even then, a flight that is 15 min early and one that is 15min late can cause a sudden pax flow. Waiting times at border control CAN be high in any part of the world and I have waited +1hr in several other 'civilized' countries as well...
That's one thing but 4 policeman plus the 8 machines compare to two policeman!
That's 12 to 2 that's not ok!!!!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Passenger »

lumumba wrote:
26 Jul 2019, 10:11
What I saw this morning at the airport is completely outrageous at the customs there were 4 policeman plus the machines for the European passports....and for foreign passports there were only two policeman,there was a line of at least of an hour and a half for them.
I crossed the border in less than 5 minutes....how is this possible I can not understand that!!!!!!!
Gives your previous hateful posts about/against Brussels Airlines and/or against Brussels Airport, I don't believe you.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote:
26 Jul 2019, 19:10
lumumba wrote:
26 Jul 2019, 10:11
What I saw this morning at the airport is completely outrageous at the customs there were 4 policeman plus the machines for the European passports....and for foreign passports there were only two policeman,there was a line of at least of an hour and a half for them.
I crossed the border in less than 5 minutes....how is this possible I can not understand that!!!!!!!
Gives your previous hateful posts about/against Brussels Airlines and/or against Brussels Airport, I don't believe you.
About Brussels Airlines I don't want to start it again I said enough....
About this morning it's 100% true but Passanger you have to understand I fly Star alliance close to 200.000 miles every year and I love Brussels Airport and Brussels Airlines but what is the problem to express my opinion?
I want them to be better and when something is wrong I say it punt!
And what happened this morning was very wrong.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Stij
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Stij »

luchtzak wrote:
23 Jul 2019, 15:02
sn26567 wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 22:53
Passenger wrote:
14 Jul 2019, 22:31
- Scanning baggage system / Système de scanning de bagages;
For this one, did they select the cheapest, or the most reliable contractor?
Brussels Airport apologizes after luggage system mishap and offers €50 vouchers to affected passengers

https://www.aviation24.be/airports/brus ... assengers/
A very late reaction as I was on holidays...

A much appreciated gesture form Brussels Airport. A sign they can take responsibility for their imperfections...
Well done...

Cheers,

Stij

Stij
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Re: Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Post by Stij »

sn26567 wrote:
23 Jul 2019, 16:19
Homo Aeroportus wrote:
23 Jul 2019, 15:20
Meanwhile in Duesseldorf ....

17JUL

DUS Luggage Hall.jpg

See : https://www.thelocal.de/20190717/chaos- ... -breakdown

Say what you want but these Germans are damn good when it comes to organize a chaos.
;)

Don't know if the PAX will get the 50 EUR vouchers though.

H.A.
Ha ha! And some Belgians swear they will never fly from Brussels because Düsseldorf is so much better! :mrgreen:
Also a bit late...

I feel these posts are a bit written for me...

I didn't even mention it on this forum when the infamous belt broke down the first time. Sh*t happens.... Unfortunately... everywhere... In Brussels... Düsseldorf... Amsterdam... I only started really complaining on this forum when the Brussels system broke down for the 3rd time in 3 months. There's a difference... See also my previous post.

Cheers,

Stij

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