Brussels Airlines in 2019

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JOVAN
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by JOVAN »

DannyVDB wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 12:40
The reason why OS is more of a network airline is not of its intercontinental network (they have more or less the same number of long haul aircraft as SN) but are the many connections to eastern european destinations (70+% of pax is transfer traffic).

If you look at their route map you hardly see anything in Southern Europe for example: no Madrid, no Lisbon or Porto, no Malaga, Bilbao ... I even am not sure whether they fly Barcelona

Danny
Indeed OS and VIE are the preferred connection popint for almostr all of Eastern Europe.
This is a "historical" thing, knowing that Austria was an Empire occupying many of those countries long ago.
Vienna was the cultural center and the reference city for most of the countries.
Investments froim Austria in thisd countries is also very imporatant.

SN / BRU is same or similar story for Africa.
But SN / BRU could certainly catch a lot more PAX by being the best, fastest, smoothest; most convenient and friendliest transfer point (or Hub) for important but smaller business cities in Western Europe.
When Swissair was in charge; SN airready had 10 million PAX a year.
They had frequent connections to and from the 8 or 10 biggest cities in UK, D, F, I , and other countries.
That wazs a good strategy, with smaller planes ( Avro's ).
Creating the market was OK.
Only they failed because BRU at that time was not made for such HUB - function. It was sometimes very busy and chaotic.
Now pier A would be an ideal transfer station for all intra-Schengen destinations.
And with some good thinking also non-Schengen citries can be added with the use of Pier B.

AMS proofs every day thata it is possible (see how many destrinations in UK, Norway etc...).
On top of the intra-Europe connections, the systrem also feeds the long haul flights from KLM and associated airlines.

As AMS is saturated I could imagine that a SN with (eg) about 20 Embraers would become a good choice for business travellers. Same day return. Collaboration between SN and BRU is essential.

Mr. Reutlinger (CEO of Sabena in those days) was certainly on the good way, but the Swissair-top-crooks (and Al Qaeda) decided otherwise.

If SN and BRU stay with the same strategy (or lack of ..) they will only grow a few hundred thousand PAX a year.
Compared to millions extra for AMS and KLM.

HUB strategy is the future.

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lumumba
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Location: brussels Europe

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by lumumba »

JOVAN wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 13:41
DannyVDB wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 12:40
The reason why OS is more of a network airline is not of its intercontinental network (they have more or less the same number of long haul aircraft as SN) but are the many connections to eastern european destinations (70+% of pax is transfer traffic).

If you look at their route map you hardly see anything in Southern Europe for example: no Madrid, no Lisbon or Porto, no Malaga, Bilbao ... I even am not sure whether they fly Barcelona

Danny
Indeed OS and VIE are the preferred connection popint for almostr all of Eastern Europe.
This is a "historical" thing, knowing that Austria was an Empire occupying many of those countries long ago.
Vienna was the cultural center and the reference city for most of the countries.
Investments froim Austria in thisd countries is also very imporatant.

SN / BRU is same or similar story for Africa.
But SN / BRU could certainly catch a lot more PAX by being the best, fastest, smoothest; most convenient and friendliest transfer point (or Hub) for important but smaller business cities in Western Europe.
When Swissair was in charge; SN airready had 10 million PAX a year.
They had frequent connections to and from the 8 or 10 biggest cities in UK, D, F, I , and other countries.
That wazs a good strategy, with smaller planes ( Avro's ).
Creating the market was OK.
Only they failed because BRU at that time was not made for such HUB - function. It was sometimes very busy and chaotic.
Now pier A would be an ideal transfer station for all intra-Schengen destinations.
And with some good thinking also non-Schengen citries can be added with the use of Pier B.

AMS proofs every day thata it is possible (see how many destrinations in UK, Norway etc...).
On top of the intra-Europe connections, the systrem also feeds the long haul flights from KLM and associated airlines.

As AMS is saturated I could imagine that a SN with (eg) about 20 Embraers would become a good choice for business travellers. Same day return. Collaboration between SN and BRU is essential.

Mr. Reutlinger (CEO of Sabena in those days) was certainly on the good way, but the Swissair-top-crooks (and Al Qaeda) decided otherwise.

If SN and BRU stay with the same strategy (or lack of ..) they will only grow a few hundred thousand PAX a year.
Compared to millions extra for AMS and KLM.

HUB strategy is the future.
Exactly knowing that all big Hubs are overcrowded there is a gap to take for Brussels enjoying is geographical position.
Last edited by lumumba on 04 Jul 2019, 14:06, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by sn26567 »

DannyVDB wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 12:40
The reason why OS is more of a network airline is not of its intercontinental network (they have more or less the same number of long haul aircraft as SN) but are the many connections to eastern european destinations (70+% of pax is transfer traffic).

If you look at their route map you hardly see anything in Southern Europe for example: no Madrid, no Lisbon or Porto, no Malaga, Bilbao ... I even am not sure whether they fly Barcelona

Danny
Another reason why OS is a network airline: like LH in FRA and MUC, like LX in ZRH, it has over 60% market share in VIE, while SN has only 40% in BRU.

The market share of SN in BRU has been constantly increasing, year after year, since 2001. But there is still a lot to do to equal the performances of the network airlines.
André
ex Sabena #26567

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Atlantis
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by Atlantis »

I think a lot of people are making it themselves very difficult here. The press release was very, very clear.
NO integration of SN into EW. This means that both will have nothing to do anymore with each other. EW will stop in some time with long haul. We will see where those planes will go, probably into the network.

But EW has to clean up their own shit and will become a small player on the German market with their own AOC

SN will do what they were doing before but let's hope that they can expand further into Africa as this is what they are good and and which they know as their pocket and they have very good managers overthere.
Maybe one or two more USA flights would be good for SN like NY and BOS.

But please, let's wait and see what they have in their mind and it will become more clear within 3 months.
SN need their own feeder flights for the long haul. So it would be a good idea to stop with some leisure flights and to focus more on real business destinations which will bring also the money. With flights to Cabo Verde they don't earn a lot I think

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by convair »

Atlantis wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 15:06
So it would be a good idea to stop with some leisure flights and to focus more on real business destinations which will bring also the money. With flights to Cabo Verde they don't earn a lot I think
Although I agree with the rest of your post, I believe the leisure flights, mostly done on weekends, can contribute to optimize the use of the fleet, hence to the profitability of the company as well.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by sn26567 »

convair wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 16:04
Atlantis wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 15:06
So it would be a good idea to stop with some leisure flights and to focus more on real business destinations which will bring also the money. With flights to Cabo Verde they don't earn a lot I think
Although I agree with the rest of your post, I believe the leisure flights, mostly done on weekends, can contribute to optimize the use of the fleet, hence to the profitability of the company as well.
I tend to agree with convair. Nobody ever said the leisure flights are unprofitable. SN has an agreement with Thomas Cook, which fills up most of the seats, and this is probably done at a price that is profitble for SN (otherwise there is no need to have an agreement).
André
ex Sabena #26567

Boavida
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by Boavida »

Let's hope Brussels Airlines will become more visible again in its home airport. After the terrorist attacks, the prominent sales & ticketing desk didn't reopen. Now it's totally tucked away, in a hidden corner of the departures hall. Not visible at all.

Image
^^ The old prominent desk. Gone since 2016...

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Conti764
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by Conti764 »

SN still is pretty visible in the departure hall... Rows 1 and 2 are for them and it's red and blue all over the place.

brusselsairlinesfan
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Joined: 29 Mar 2007, 14:44

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by brusselsairlinesfan »

Boavida wrote:
04 Jul 2019, 20:01
Let's hope Brussels Airlines will become more visible again in its home airport. After the terrorist attacks, the prominent sales & ticketing desk didn't reopen. Now it's totally tucked away, in a hidden corner of the departures hall. Not visible at all.

Image
^^ The old prominent desk. Gone since 2016...
Any project to rebuild a new ticketing & sales counter ?

convair
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Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by convair »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
03 Jul 2019, 09:15
OO-SFL is on her "once-in-a-month" charity flight, same as on 03JUN.

She left EBBR this morning as BEL9903 to position for the EW1112 DUS-EWR with STD 11:35LT.

;)

H.A.
Hi H.A., what do you mean by "charity flight"?

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by lumumba »

Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
1 or 2 times a week or even Brussels-Kinshasa-Lubumbashi should work?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by sn26567 »

lumumba wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 17:18
Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
1 or 2 times a week or even Brussels-Kinshasa-Lubumbashi should work?
Probably a problem of bilateral traffic rights.
André
ex Sabena #26567

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by lumumba »

sn26567 wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 17:29
lumumba wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 17:18
Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
1 or 2 times a week or even Brussels-Kinshasa-Lubumbashi should work?
Probably a problem of bilateral traffic rights.
Maybe but South African and Ethiopian are flying there .
Maybe it's possible to negotiate to open this market?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

jan_olieslagers
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by jan_olieslagers »

Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
Remember Korongo? They'd be clean daft to point even one finger at Lubumbashi. That name is burnt, and will be for some time. It would be nice enough, though, I must agree.

TLspotting
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by TLspotting »

D-ASTX has begun on 27 June 2019 its ACMI contract for Brussels Airlines :

Image

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/luft ... d-october/
Hi. I'm T., spotter and aviation geek. Join me on Facebook & Twitter @TLspotting

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by lumumba »

jan_olieslagers wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 18:21
Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
Remember Korongo? They'd be clean daft to point even one finger at Lubumbashi. That name is burnt, and will be for some time. It would be nice enough, though, I must agree.
Yes but that was a local player with everything around the purpose here should be to fly directly or via....but you just keep the structure like it is plus an office in Lubum.

And if Brussels Airlines does not have the authorisation maybe another airline from de group could do it to Frankfurt for example with the support of Brussels Airlines on the field.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

convair
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Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by convair »

jan_olieslagers wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 18:21
Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
Remember Korongo? They'd be clean daft to point even one finger at Lubumbashi. That name is burnt, and will be for some time. It would be nice enough, though, I must agree.
Probably a matter of traffic rights as André says. However, times have changed and Belgium should try and get these rights now; no reason to be treared worse than SAA and Ethiopian.

nordikcam
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by nordikcam »

convair wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 21:50
jan_olieslagers wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 18:21
Why is Brussels Airlines not flying to Lubumbashi?
Remember Korongo? They'd be clean daft to point even one finger at Lubumbashi. That name is burnt, and will be for some time. It would be nice enough, though, I must agree.
Probably a matter of traffic rights as André says. However, times have changed and Belgium should try and get these rights now; no reason to be treared worse than SAA and Ethiopian.
May be they do not have the traffic rights between Kinshasa and Lubumbashi...but a direct flight one or two times a week...on the way to KGL ??

rwandan-flyer
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by rwandan-flyer »

Is the market is big to see SN to fill an A330 to Lubumbashi ? Ethiopian Airlines, serves FBM, every day, sometimes with the B787. Kenya Airways (not in Star Alliance) serves also FBM, every day (plus a weekly cargo service). But probably a big part of trafic is Asia-DR Congo.

I think that that Turkish Airlines is probably currently the only European airlines, that could directly link FMB to Europe. Thanks to the Istanbul localisation, they can use their B737-800 / 900ER on many Africans routes.

They serve several secondary cities, in Africa ( Port Harcourt, Port Sudan, Mombasa, Zanzibar, Kilimanjaro, & soon Pointe Noire).

However Air France operates weekly service to Pointe Noire, but they has just canceled Port Harcourt service.
KLM operates a daily service to Kilimanjaro
Lufthansa operates a daily service to Port Harcourt


After all, why not ? I don't include South Africa and North Africans countries.

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2019

Post by convair »

nordikcam wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 22:21
convair wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 21:50
jan_olieslagers wrote:
07 Jul 2019, 18:21


Remember Korongo? They'd be clean daft to point even one finger at Lubumbashi. That name is burnt, and will be for some time. It would be nice enough, though, I must agree.
Probably a matter of traffic rights as André says. However, times have changed and Belgium should try and get these rights now; no reason to be treared worse than SAA and Ethiopian.
May be they do not have the traffic rights between Kinshasa and Lubumbashi...but a direct flight one or two times a week...on the way to KGL ??
I meant direct flights actually, or maybe with a stopover at KGL or Entebbe, or...

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