Brussels Airlines in 2018

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by RoMax »

nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 16:36
Thank you for these remarks. I generally appreciate your comments like those of Romax or others. That said, and if I may, "bad luck" is a "typical" answer ( réponse type ) to a customer "lambda". I do not think that a general management can be satisfied in AG to say "Oohh...bad luck" ... there is a real problem and the passenger who perceives it is a passenger often "lost".
And the problem is being solved, but new A330's don't fall out of the sky (no pun intended).

SN's M&E department is doing what it can to keep these old aircraft as reliable as possible and they're doing a very good job (and from what I know Airbus is quite impressed by the way these oldest A333's are kept operational the way they are). But yes the amount of AOG's is too high compared to what should be acceptable, especially as SN cannot absorb this easily with its small fleet.

But the bad luck comment remains valid to a certain extent, it's not because you were very unlucky to have 2 out of 3 flights cancelled, that this is the standard. You could have faced the same issue with another airline.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 14:26
RoMax wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 14:07

Besides, do you have the statistical proof that this a much more regular issue at SN than other airlines? It's always easy to judge on an airline (or other company) which you're following much more closely (e.g. because of personal interests, because of what you regularly use yourself, ...). That doesn't mean the grass is that much greener on the other side.
I obviously do not have official statistics ... but I have mine! In 2017 : 3 YYZ with SN of which 2 canceled.
1 with AC and 1 with LH who were operated on. 6 with AF / KL that were operated too. If the grass is not greener, there is grass!

But it's because I'm attached to SN that I rattle! "Qui bene amat, bene castigat" ! ( Qui aime bien, châtie bien ) ;)
Same for me last year one Douala and one Kinshasa cancelled and that's for 12 months...the last 10 years with Air France 0 for the last 10 years with TAP 1 and I never had one cancellation with Lufthansa all my life and that's the airline I fly the most....

But I continue to fly SN because it's my airline also when I fly SN I never ever receive my miles I always have to ask them after ...yes there is a lot of work here!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Jetter
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Jetter »

Looked at some facts, the completion factor of SN isn't bad compered with other large European airlines. Their on-time performance is much worse than average though. See: https://www.flightstats.com/company/mon ... /airlines/

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu »

RoMax wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 14:07
Poiu wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 13:52
Why don’t they call Air Belgium?
Two A340s ready to go with a couple of hours notice. (I know why, but I will be shot down in flames if I write it down)
Who says they're ready to go in a couple of hours for SN?!
Do you really think SN is cancelling (or delaying by 24h) long haul flights just because it's too proud to wet-lease from e.g. AB?! Any idea about the costs of this vs. a 1 time wet-lease? I would really expect some realism on this forum instead of those stupid theories.
I can tell you that AB has lots of crew who are eager to fly and have their mobile phones on, hoping they get a call. A daily inspection and the A340s are ready as well. If they don’t fly for SN it’s because SN didn’t call AB.
As you are close to SN, maybe you can ask them why and suggest them to do so in the future.
Shooting the messenger and call his theories stupid is easy but not convincing!

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Jetter wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 17:34
Looked at some facts, the completion factor of SN isn't bad compered with other large European airlines. Their on-time performance is much worse than average though. See: https://www.flightstats.com/company/mon ... /airlines/
Believe I'm not lying and for me it's obvious that SN has more cancellation than the others or in the past flying in an old Tri Star etc...my experience is based on years flying 300.000 miles a year.

No a better option is to react and find solutions.
Last edited by lumumba on 31 Mar 2018, 19:32, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by RoMax »

Poiu wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 18:49
I can tell you that AB has lots of crew who are eager to fly and have their mobile phones on, hoping they get a call. A daily inspection and the A340s are ready as well. If they don’t fly for SN it’s because SN didn’t call AB.
A yes let's call the crew and Sabena Aerospace (or is it LHT for them?) and it'll be alright for tomorrow. :roll:

Again, think about the cost of a 24h delay or a cancellation of 1-2 long haul flights, whoever could fly, they would take it.

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by convair »

The current problem seems to be due to SFM that should have been back from mx several days ago (was scheduled for YYZ on the 25th!) but is still in Hahn (almost 5 weeks now).
They should have seen it coming.

I agree with RoMax that SN would do anything possible in order to avoid a cancellation, ...except call on Air Belgium. That would be a crime of "lèse-majesté", equivalent to "high treason". ;)
Last edited by convair on 01 Apr 2018, 19:51, edited 1 time in total.

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Conti764
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Conti764 »

convair wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 20:38
The current problem seems to be due to SFM that should have been back from mx several days ago (was scheduled for YYZ on the 25th!) but is still in Malta (almost 5 weeks now).
They should have seen it coming.

I agree with RoMax that SN would do anything possible in order to avoid a cancellation, ...except call on Air Belgium. That would be a crime of "lèse-majesté", equivalent to "high treason". ;)
That's old SN (Sabena/(SN) Brussels Airlines) maybe. But I can't imagine LH would just accept its daughter company to cancel flights when two perfectly flyable A343's are standing idle at BRU because of mere pride... Remember, it's Africa tjey're cancelling. Not some N-American destination where there are plenty of rerouting options...

JustPlanes
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by JustPlanes »

convair wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 20:38
The current problem seems to be due to SFM that should have been back from mx several days ago (was scheduled for YYZ on the 25th!) but is still in Malta (almost 5 weeks now).
They should have seen it coming.

I agree with RoMax that SN would do anything possible in order to avoid a cancellation, ...except call on Air Belgium. That would be a crime of "lèse-majesté", equivalent to "high treason". ;)
Air Belgium is not a competing airline at all with SN... and if it means helping their pax vs stranding them its the right thing to do... not to mention they would get a better deal than chartering any other airline because the planes are right in BRU.

I still cannot believe that SN owned by LH which has so many new planes on order doesn't have a single new plane bound for SN... just old stuff others don't want anymore... if that isn't sad... nice to see TUI flying new dreamliners and 737 MAX aircraft... I wonder what the people at SN think of this situation!

nordikcam
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by nordikcam »

nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 12:56
And we left for a New Festival of SN l/h cancellations ... today Accra and Lomé moved to tomorrow ... tomorrow Toronto moved or not ... scary! The new CEO does not just have the work to do ( pain sur la planche ) , but the whole bakery!-+
Ouch ! It's not only the YYZ flight to be cancelled. The JFK too ! 25% of SN l/h flights cancelled today ! Welcome Mrs the new CEO...maybe is it a joke beacause 1 of April ?? :roll:

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

nordikcam wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 10:30
nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 12:56
And we left for a New Festival of SN l/h cancellations ... today Accra and Lomé moved to tomorrow ... tomorrow Toronto moved or not ... scary! The new CEO does not just have the work to do ( pain sur la planche ) , but the whole bakery!-+
Ouch ! It's not only the YYZ flight to be cancelled. The JFK too ! 25% of SN l/h flights cancelled today ! Welcome Mrs the new CEO...maybe is it a joke beacause 1 of April ?? :roll:
SFM : (back yesterday from Hahn), in flight, SN205 to DSS
SFZ : in flight, SN359 to LAD
SFY : in flight, SN371 to DLA
SFX : in flight, SN455 to BJM
SFT : in flight, SN515 to IAD
SFU : in flight, SN601 to BOM
SFO : in flight, SN1277 to ACC
SFW : in flight, SN285 to ABJ
SFN : in flight, SN241 to ROB

I count 9 chicks operating.

SFV seems u/s. She came back yesterday morning 31MAR but had no flight planned. Seemed unable to resume ops and declared u/s this early morning, JFK cancelled.

Bad news for those Pax whose flight was cancelled today but 25% of the fleet out is incorrect statement.

H.A.

nordikcam
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by nordikcam »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 12:39
nordikcam wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 10:30
nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 12:56
And we left for a New Festival of SN l/h cancellations ... today Accra and Lomé moved to tomorrow ... tomorrow Toronto moved or not ... scary! The new CEO does not just have the work to do ( pain sur la planche ) , but the whole bakery!-+
Ouch ! It's not only the YYZ flight to be cancelled. The JFK too ! 25% of SN l/h flights cancelled today ! Welcome Mrs the new CEO...maybe is it a joke beacause 1 of April ?? :roll:
SFM : (back yesterday from Hahn), in flight, SN205 to DSS
SFZ : in flight, SN359 to LAD
SFY : in flight, SN371 to DLA
SFX : in flight, SN455 to BJM
SFT : in flight, SN515 to IAD
SFU : in flight, SN601 to BOM
SFO : in flight, SN1277 to ACC
SFW : in flight, SN285 to ABJ
SFN : in flight, SN241 to ROB

I count 9 chicks operating.

SFV seems u/s. She came back yesterday morning 31MAR but had no flight planned. Seemed unable to resume ops and declared u/s this early morning, JFK cancelled.

Bad news for those Pax whose flight was cancelled today but 25% of the fleet out is incorrect statement.

H.A.
You're right. 2 cancelled l/h flights YYZ and JFK on 9 l/h flights it's only 22,22 % and not 25% ! Sorry !

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 12:39
nordikcam wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 10:30
nordikcam wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 12:56
And we left for a New Festival of SN l/h cancellations ... today Accra and Lomé moved to tomorrow ... tomorrow Toronto moved or not ... scary! The new CEO does not just have the work to do ( pain sur la planche ) , but the whole bakery!-+
Ouch ! It's not only the YYZ flight to be cancelled. The JFK too ! 25% of SN l/h flights cancelled today ! Welcome Mrs the new CEO...maybe is it a joke beacause 1 of April ?? :roll:
SFM : (back yesterday from Hahn), in flight, SN205 to DSS
SFZ : in flight, SN359 to LAD
SFY : in flight, SN371 to DLA
SFX : in flight, SN455 to BJM
SFT : in flight, SN515 to IAD
SFU : in flight, SN601 to BOM
SFO : in flight, SN1277 to ACC
SFW : in flight, SN285 to ABJ
SFN : in flight, SN241 to ROB

I count 9 chicks operating.

SFV seems u/s. She came back yesterday morning 31MAR but had no flight planned. Seemed unable to resume ops and declared u/s this early morning, JFK cancelled.

Bad news for those Pax whose flight was cancelled today but 25% of the fleet out is incorrect statement.

H.A.
Ok it's not 25% it's 20% that's still very much....!!!!!
And yesterday also there was a flight cancelled!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Homo Aeroportus
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

Play with the numbers the ways you can be happy with, I'm not trying to convince you of anything here.

SN long haul fleet is made of 10 A/C if I'm not mistaken.
Today 9 are flying out of these 10.
And that is not good, indeed. But as said time and again, with such a small fleet the odds are against you to get them all up everyday.

Reason why there are TWO flights cancelled today and not only one, besides it gives you a chance to point it out, is because it seems that SN preferred to run ACC to rescue those Pax waiting there. Flight today is SN1277.
Pax bound to JFK and YYZ could probably be taken care of by other airlines.

H.A.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 13:14
Play with the numbers the ways you can be happy with, I'm not trying to convince you of anything here.

SN long haul fleet is made of 10 A/C if I'm not mistaken.
Today 9 are flying out of these 10.
And that is not good, indeed. But as said time and again, with such a small fleet the odds are against you to get them all up everyday.

Reason why there are TWO flights cancelled today and not only one, besides it gives you a chance to point it out, is because it seems that SN preferred to run ACC to rescue those Pax waiting there. Flight today is SN1277.
Pax bound to JFK and YYZ could probably be taken care of by other airlines.

H.A.
I understand that but this numbers is like a strike day with AF it's big and recurrent for years now.

I repeat I LOVE BRUSSELS AIRLINES and I want them to be with the best because here in Belgium we have the people and the knowledge to do so.
When I see this numbers it's bad and it make me sad.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

nordikcam
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by nordikcam »

Homo Aeroportus wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 13:14

Pax bound to JFK and YYZ could probably be taken care of by other airlines.

H.A.
Yes of course ! All this is right.
SN needs to cancel a new flight a day because SN needs to ensure the canceled flight of the day before ... it's crazy. I'm sure the passengers are taken care of by the way by others, of course!
As I said, a passenger sent elsewhere stays elsewhere. As far as I'm concerned it's AF on Africa and the Atlantic tasting very little German services ...

Bel33
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Bel33 »

In the same time, the EW flight operated with SFM is not cancelled... Priority to Eurowings. Passengers of SN can wait...

airbuske
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by airbuske »

Bel33 wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 14:42
In the same time, the EW flight operated with SFM is not cancelled... Priority to Eurowings. Passengers of SN can wait...
EW flight operated with SFM ?
SFM if flying to DSS/CKY
Best regards,

Airbuske

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sn26567 »

airbuske wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 15:10
Bel33 wrote:
01 Apr 2018, 14:42
In the same time, the EW flight operated with SFM is not cancelled... Priority to Eurowings. Passengers of SN can wait...
EW flight operated with SFM ?
SFM if flying to DSS/CKY
It's SFC which is flying for EW, and it is idle (not flying) in FRA.
André
ex Sabena #26567

sean1982
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sean1982 »

Ansett wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 20:40
Jetter wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 16:04
Darjeeling wrote:
31 Mar 2018, 15:23
The state of some of SN's A330 is just appalling... You should see the mid-galley of OO-SFW (just when you enter via door 2), I'm sure even AFSCA/FAVV would not dare to approve and certificate what I've seen...
Amazing how an airline with planes like that can be a 'center of excellence'. :o
As I have said, I will believe it when I see it, this centre of excellence in Brussels.

But let's see thinks as they are today and let's say that SN is doing an excellent job with what LH is prepared to give them.
This center of excellence obviously has nothing to do with SN being experts at long haul. Quite foolish to believe theu would be better at it than LH itself. The only reason why (and possibly the only reason why LH chose to invest) is to outplay the german trade unions and (re-)employ people on inferior belgian contracts (in comparison to their old german one). Social dumping at its best

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