SN Brussels Airlines and Virgin Express going together
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That's my point, it is stupid for those of us who associate the new company with SABENA..but of course sabena is history would be completely forgotten in some years, hopefully by then the new SN/Vex would have grown...the S symbol could be seen detached from sabena..elegant .. just think of the S and not of sabena..does add up.
Why are so many people on this forum nostalgic about SABENA?
It never had a good reputation (Such A Bad Experience Never Again)!
Surely ditching any association with a failed, bankrupt and unpopular (certainly among non-Belgians) airline might be better for the new, merged SN/VEX airline.
Brussels Airlines works, but its certainly not exciting - it doesn't enthuse you or doesn't seem cool or trendy. I expect the hype will blow over and in twelve months we'll just have a slightly larger, dull Belgian national carrier.
I hope they've decided to be a little more imaginative and creative - I believe there's enough creative talent in Belgium. TinTinAir perhaps?
That's my two cents.
It never had a good reputation (Such A Bad Experience Never Again)!
Surely ditching any association with a failed, bankrupt and unpopular (certainly among non-Belgians) airline might be better for the new, merged SN/VEX airline.
Brussels Airlines works, but its certainly not exciting - it doesn't enthuse you or doesn't seem cool or trendy. I expect the hype will blow over and in twelve months we'll just have a slightly larger, dull Belgian national carrier.
I hope they've decided to be a little more imaginative and creative - I believe there's enough creative talent in Belgium. TinTinAir perhaps?
That's my two cents.
Sabena's second home market was Africa and if you compare the former Belgian national carrier to most of the former and current African carriers, I'm pretty sure Sabena was not so bad after all!! Sabena only had a very bad reputation in Belgium…
Currently SN Brussels Airlines is more or less a codeshare airline on its European routes. In my opinion, a good and viable strategic option should be a major focus on African routes (intensify the existing routes and also add new routes from Europe to Africa; more or less the same Iberia is currently doing on Latin-American routes), come back to a modernized version of the original Sabena brand (the name Sabena remains the best option, as in Africa they are still talking about Sabena even five years after the company's bankruptcy…) and join as quickly as possible a global alliance (oneworld®??) for most of its European routes (+ all American and Asian routes).
Belgium needs a separate LCC for shorthaul routes (EasyJet, Clickair, Air Berlin…) AND a specialized longhaul carrier but certainly NOT a carrier somewhere in between as nowadays both markets are too different!!
Currently SN Brussels Airlines is more or less a codeshare airline on its European routes. In my opinion, a good and viable strategic option should be a major focus on African routes (intensify the existing routes and also add new routes from Europe to Africa; more or less the same Iberia is currently doing on Latin-American routes), come back to a modernized version of the original Sabena brand (the name Sabena remains the best option, as in Africa they are still talking about Sabena even five years after the company's bankruptcy…) and join as quickly as possible a global alliance (oneworld®??) for most of its European routes (+ all American and Asian routes).
Belgium needs a separate LCC for shorthaul routes (EasyJet, Clickair, Air Berlin…) AND a specialized longhaul carrier but certainly NOT a carrier somewhere in between as nowadays both markets are too different!!
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tolipanebas
- Posts: 2442
- Joined: 12 May 2004, 00:00
As an employee of SNV, I don't really care for a second what the new name of my company will be: whether it is short or long, whether it sounds like a girl's name or just keeps Brussels Airlines, whether we will still fly around under the elegant S, ... it really is all the same to me.
Obviously I will be interestedly listening on November 7th what the new name will be and I will be hoping for something not cheep sounding and easily pronouncable in both French as well as English, but what I am much more looking out for is that my company would FINALLY add a clear time line to their strategic plans.
Sounds like November 7th will be yet another one of those balloon events where they wave a new flag, show us a freshly painted A319 and then we are off again for another round of speculation on much more important issues like future product strategy, route strategy, fleet strategy, alliance (or partner) strategy and expansion strategy (if any)...
Obviously I will be interestedly listening on November 7th what the new name will be and I will be hoping for something not cheep sounding and easily pronouncable in both French as well as English, but what I am much more looking out for is that my company would FINALLY add a clear time line to their strategic plans.
Sounds like November 7th will be yet another one of those balloon events where they wave a new flag, show us a freshly painted A319 and then we are off again for another round of speculation on much more important issues like future product strategy, route strategy, fleet strategy, alliance (or partner) strategy and expansion strategy (if any)...
From Flightglobal..."
Sabena reborn: SN Brussels-Virgin Express merger 'set to take former Belgian flag carrier brand'
By Victoria Moores
Belgian full-service carrier SN Brussels Airlines and low-fares compatriot Virgin Express are preparing to disclose the brand name under which the airlines will jointly operate, amid strong indications that they will resurrect the name ‘Sabena’.
A senior source close to the two carriers has informed Flight that the Sabena brand – the name of the former Belgian flag-carrier, which collapsed in 2001, and from which SN Brussels emerged – is to be used for the merged airline.
SN Brussels and Virgin Express have not confirmed this plan and the companies have so far declined to comment on the name to be used for the combined carriers’ operations.
The two airlines are scheduled to hold a press briefing next month to detail their strategy.
SN Brussels Airlines previously operated as a regional division of Sabena under the name Delta Air Transport.
Sabena reborn: SN Brussels-Virgin Express merger 'set to take former Belgian flag carrier brand'
By Victoria Moores
Belgian full-service carrier SN Brussels Airlines and low-fares compatriot Virgin Express are preparing to disclose the brand name under which the airlines will jointly operate, amid strong indications that they will resurrect the name ‘Sabena’.
A senior source close to the two carriers has informed Flight that the Sabena brand – the name of the former Belgian flag-carrier, which collapsed in 2001, and from which SN Brussels emerged – is to be used for the merged airline.
SN Brussels and Virgin Express have not confirmed this plan and the companies have so far declined to comment on the name to be used for the combined carriers’ operations.
The two airlines are scheduled to hold a press briefing next month to detail their strategy.
SN Brussels Airlines previously operated as a regional division of Sabena under the name Delta Air Transport.
I completely agree with you !! The most important will be the strategic plans. I really hope that they will have a well defined ambitious reasonable and dynamic vision of their future.tolipanebas wrote: but what I am much more looking out for is that my company would FINALLY add a clear time line to their strategic plans.
Sounds like November 7th will be yet another one of those balloon events where they wave a new flag, show us a freshly painted A319 and then we are off again for another round of speculation on much more important issues like future product strategy, route strategy, fleet strategy, alliance (or partner) strategy and expansion strategy (if any)...
Chris
Dear all,
I agree with tolipanebas in stating that the brand name is secondary (while 90% of the discussions is exactly on the name).
Personally I think you should not expect too much from 7/11. They've already indicated what their strategy will be:
- Streamline operations in Europe and drop non profitable routes (focus on 40 key routes - probably not including the code-share routes and summer specific routes)
- Extend long haul operations into Africa and start operations in the US
- Try to start one (or more) intra-african hub(s) with +/- 6 regional jets
- Extend the laung haul fleet from 3 to 5 or 6 planes depending on availability of aircraft at affordable rates
- Keep the AVRO's, A319 and B737, at least till 2010; extend with 3 medium haul planes
- Keep the people
- Try to get at least a 40% share at Brussels airport: so go from 5,2 million passengers to 6,8 million (if you take the current figures)
That's clear, it is an extension plan, although modest, it is careful, but ambitious at the same time (without 'dreaming') ... taking into account that this is a plan to be realised between now and 2010.
Some other issues are not yet clear (what happens with the code-shares after SN+VEX go together, what with the privilege programme, ...), but I guess this will become clear soon ...
Also the timing is indeed not very clear. My guess is that they finish integration by spring 2007. That long haul extension will start end of 2007 or beginning of 2008, and further development will be steps wise.
Regards,
Danny
I agree with tolipanebas in stating that the brand name is secondary (while 90% of the discussions is exactly on the name).
Personally I think you should not expect too much from 7/11. They've already indicated what their strategy will be:
- Streamline operations in Europe and drop non profitable routes (focus on 40 key routes - probably not including the code-share routes and summer specific routes)
- Extend long haul operations into Africa and start operations in the US
- Try to start one (or more) intra-african hub(s) with +/- 6 regional jets
- Extend the laung haul fleet from 3 to 5 or 6 planes depending on availability of aircraft at affordable rates
- Keep the AVRO's, A319 and B737, at least till 2010; extend with 3 medium haul planes
- Keep the people
- Try to get at least a 40% share at Brussels airport: so go from 5,2 million passengers to 6,8 million (if you take the current figures)
That's clear, it is an extension plan, although modest, it is careful, but ambitious at the same time (without 'dreaming') ... taking into account that this is a plan to be realised between now and 2010.
Some other issues are not yet clear (what happens with the code-shares after SN+VEX go together, what with the privilege programme, ...), but I guess this will become clear soon ...
Also the timing is indeed not very clear. My guess is that they finish integration by spring 2007. That long haul extension will start end of 2007 or beginning of 2008, and further development will be steps wise.
Regards,
Danny
heu :s : Sabena reborn: SN Brussels-Virgin Express merger 'set to take former Belgian flag carrier brand'
http://tinyurl.com/yk7uu8
(copy paste the bloody url)
Oh well, only 2 weeks to go ...
http://tinyurl.com/yk7uu8
(copy paste the bloody url)
Oh well, only 2 weeks to go ...
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Zenfookpower
- Posts: 158
- Joined: 25 Sep 2005, 00:00
- Location: The Great Lakes (USA)
I don't agree.. All my cross Atlantic experiences were "below" expectations.. Don't only take my answer but suggest you also visit http://www.airliners.net/discussions/ge ... n/3066027/Flybaboo wrote:Sabena's second home market was Africa and if you compare the former Belgian national carrier to most of the former and current African carriers, I'm pretty sure Sabena was not so bad after all!! Sabena only had a very bad reputation in Belgium…...............
Hi everybody.
BNinMSY From United States, joined Nov 2005, 97 posts, RR: 5
Reply 47, posted Sat Oct 28 2006 03:33:37 UTC+2 (14 hours 30 minutes 40 secs ago) and read 3820 times:
The Sabena name is already showing up in the CRS (Airline Reservations Systems) as of this week.
On Airliners.net this can be somthing?
Regards
patrice
BNinMSY From United States, joined Nov 2005, 97 posts, RR: 5
Reply 47, posted Sat Oct 28 2006 03:33:37 UTC+2 (14 hours 30 minutes 40 secs ago) and read 3820 times:
The Sabena name is already showing up in the CRS (Airline Reservations Systems) as of this week.
On Airliners.net this can be somthing?
Regards
patrice
Hasta la victoria siempre.
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b-west
Said it before and I'll say it again: Sabena would make sense.
If not for nostalgic reasons, then at least for commercial reasons.
All over the world, the name Sabena is still known. As I said here before, on my trip to Washington, the monitor at our gate in JFK had AA/Sabena on it, and that was in 2005! All over Africa there are still "Sabena" signs and even in Belgium, lots of people refer to SN Brussels Airlines as Sabena (or simply SN). And if they talk about SN Brussels in the news, almost always they'll ad something the likes of "the new sabena"...
Still... rumours... we're gonna have to wait a few more days.
If not for nostalgic reasons, then at least for commercial reasons.
All over the world, the name Sabena is still known. As I said here before, on my trip to Washington, the monitor at our gate in JFK had AA/Sabena on it, and that was in 2005! All over Africa there are still "Sabena" signs and even in Belgium, lots of people refer to SN Brussels Airlines as Sabena (or simply SN). And if they talk about SN Brussels in the news, almost always they'll ad something the likes of "the new sabena"...
Still... rumours... we're gonna have to wait a few more days.
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OrientThai
- Posts: 243
- Joined: 27 Aug 2004, 00:00
- Location: Belgium&Thailand
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Robin_Bamps
Exactly my point ! I'm also convinced that the fact that "people are still saying Sabena" is partly caused by the way of acting in 2002 : they applied a Sabena-alike name and Sabena-alike livery for the new company. If they had come with a new creative name and livery (without winks to the Sabena brand) at that time already, this would most probably not be the case anymore.OrientThai wrote:Yesterday it was Brussels Airlines, today it is Sabena...
I think a new and creative name will be the best for the beginning of an era of profitability, clear vision and moderate expansion for SNBA.
So I hope they take the right decision now. Rebranding SNV "Sabena" would be another big mistake in Belgian aviation (though, I'm already used to those mistakes). Even if you neglect the emotional damage caused with former Sabena employees and the (often) bad connotation abroad, you can't even compare the small airline with aged Avro-jets we have right now with the "big Sabena" from the past.
Just my €0,02...
Regards, Robin Bamps.
I understand that some people are against the name Sabena and I respect their opinion.
However, we should not forget two facts:
1) In its last years of existence, Sabena has made tremendous efforts to improve its product. Its fame had been increasing and service level had considerably improved, notwithstanding what some say about it. I have been flying Sabena several times shortly before its bankruptcy - both European and US flights -, and I can assure you that the quality of the flights was at par with the other big players in the field.
2) Sabena still has a lot of sympathy in African countries, the main cash cow for SN BA. A revival of the name would just be a continuation of the already existing situation.
Months ago, I was almost sure the new name of the merged company would be Sabena. The discussions in this forum and oter sources almost convinced me that Brussels Airlines would be the most likely candidate. But now I am hopeful and I would be over-happy to see the name Sabena used again.
However, we should not forget two facts:
1) In its last years of existence, Sabena has made tremendous efforts to improve its product. Its fame had been increasing and service level had considerably improved, notwithstanding what some say about it. I have been flying Sabena several times shortly before its bankruptcy - both European and US flights -, and I can assure you that the quality of the flights was at par with the other big players in the field.
2) Sabena still has a lot of sympathy in African countries, the main cash cow for SN BA. A revival of the name would just be a continuation of the already existing situation.
Months ago, I was almost sure the new name of the merged company would be Sabena. The discussions in this forum and oter sources almost convinced me that Brussels Airlines would be the most likely candidate. But now I am hopeful and I would be over-happy to see the name Sabena used again.
André
ex Sabena #26567
ex Sabena #26567
Sabena or Brussels Airlines are very clear and powerfull names...but this quoted message from EBBR concerns me... it's seems to be short and 'new'... (style TAP or Swiss)EBBR wrote:You can scratch these of your list > Sabena Brussels airlines Brussels express Bruairfly wrote:without saying the name what are your thoughts on it?
its a strange name for an airline, but its short. if advertising and marketing are good the new name could do well, yet I have my doubts.
Anyway I sincerely hope that EBBR is wrong or just trying to make a fool of us. I hope on the 7/11 there will be a resurrection of a beautiful name with an S-tail
Camel