Air Antwerp in 2020

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sn26567
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Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by sn26567 »

André
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Passenger
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by Passenger »

Air Antwerp had VIP visitors yesterday (Friday 03/01/2020):

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TLspotting
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by TLspotting »

Air Antwerp traffic figures nicely on track after 4 months of flying
https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/air- ... of-flying/
Hi. I'm Thibault Lapers. @ThibaultLapers & @TLspotting

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sn26567
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by sn26567 »

A nice trip report:

https://runwaygirlnetwork.com/2020/02/0 ... nostalgic/

But one sentence at the end is not very reassuring: "A handful of friends have also flown the route in recent months, each reporting loads well under 50%. If that trend holds across each of its flights, its future might be in question". In the reported trip above, there were only 15 pax!
André
ex Sabena #26567

AAI
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by AAI »

i was on a friday afternoon flight with 30 pax
and on a sunday return flight with 36 pax

larsV
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by larsV »

If you look at the figures of Antwerp airport, I don't think they are doing bad on the London city route.
Every month the increase in passengers is announced they mention its partly because of Air Antwerp's route to London City.

VLM_Antwerp
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by VLM_Antwerp »

In November they had an average load factor of 56%. I’ve heard December was already higher, but no exact figures to confirm this are released yet.

Passenger
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by Passenger »

Just Planes video, 16 minutes:

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saratoga
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by saratoga »

Very nice footage. Tx

I am really wondering what future Air Antwerp has in mind. Ok the ANR-LCY is back. Good load factors, enough freq’s, again stability. Like the old days. All nice, but i am wondering what their vision is. You don’t start a new company just to operate 1 single route and that’s it. As we all know the ex-VLM tried many different routes without big succes. So i am perhaps a bit pessimistic, but is there a future for air antwerp to grow in one way or the other?

ironspan
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by ironspan »

VLM grew too fast and was not always ‘clever’ in selecting destinations. It is not true that all their routes failed, for example Aberdeen. Southampton, Manchester and Zurich had good load factors and high yields. But others (Maribor, Munchen, Cologne) were not successful. Also they had no codeshare partner, KLM’s booking system and loyalty program make a big difference for Air Antwerp.
For AA’s expansion, they should continue to look at niche markets such as Aberdeen (soon Loganair stops flying to BRU since they need their aircraft to take over the more lucrative routes from FlyBe in the UK), or Manchester, or Lublin (TUI was having a load factor of +90%!), or Milan/Berlin (the TUI’s EMB190 was too big, but they had regularly 60-70pax to these destinations). In the beginning these cities should also not be served on a twice-daily basis, but for example they could start with 3x per week.
Obviously they cannot fly to a hub of a KLM competitor (e.g. Zurich), and of course the expansion would require newer and different planes (ATR/Q400).
But first they need to survive the corona-panic...

AAI
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by AAI »

the 2 first destinations they have to start are MAN and ZRH

b720
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by b720 »

AAI wrote: 07 Mar 2020, 12:40 the 2 first destinations they have to start are MAN and ZRH
I think that Hamburg was a good route for VLM

SLM
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by SLM »

I flew from ANR to Hamburg, twice, 3 pax, 16 pax, 7 pax, 4 pax, this was a bad joke.

VLM_Antwerp
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by VLM_Antwerp »

Aberdeen was actually a short-lived, but good selling route.
But then again, maybe air antwerp shouldn’t be doing the same routes that already failed 2-3 times with VLM.
At the other hand, they are backed by KLM, so if they look for good niche markets it will be a success for sure.

saratoga
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by saratoga »

VLM_Antwerp wrote: 07 Mar 2020, 18:25 Aberdeen was actually a short-lived, but good selling route.
But then again, maybe air antwerp shouldn’t be doing the same routes that already failed 2-3 times with VLM.
At the other hand, they are backed by KLM, so if they look for good niche markets it will be a success for sure.
But KLM is flying to ABZ and INV, so it is not likely to happen.

lucas
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by lucas »

saratoga wrote: 07 Mar 2020, 22:41
VLM_Antwerp wrote: 07 Mar 2020, 18:25 Aberdeen was actually a short-lived, but good selling route.
But then again, maybe air antwerp shouldn’t be doing the same routes that already failed 2-3 times with VLM.
At the other hand, they are backed by KLM, so if they look for good niche markets it will be a success for sure.
But KLM is flying to ABZ and INV, so it is not likely to happen.
What's your reasoning behind this? KLM has more than 120 weekly flights to the London area (LHR and LCY, where Air Antwerp is also operating).

saratoga
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by saratoga »

Well, my reasoning is, since AMS is just a milestone away from ANR and easy reachable by train, why would you allow your ‘partner, to compete with you going to the same destination?

But that is just me reasoning like that.

Just curious how all this will evolve.

ironspan
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by ironspan »

saratoga wrote: 08 Mar 2020, 10:11 Well, my reasoning is, since AMS is just a milestone away from ANR and easy reachable by train, why would you allow your ‘partner, to compete with you going to the same destination?

But that is just me reasoning like that.

Just curious how all this will evolve.
1. The capture area of ANR is not only the city of Antwerp but also the central part of Flanders and the South of the Netherlands.
2. Please try to catch a flight at 8am in AMS or arrive there at 10pm —> no trains (so day return trips are out of the question). Also during the day, frequency of trains is limited and if you travel by car, Dutch highways are always traffic jammed (takes 2hrs from Antwerp)
3. KLM said they participated in AA because they want to gradually also get pax from Breda, Tilburg etc on KL flights (and compete with SN)
4. In summer AMS is overloaded, long queues at passport and security. ANR no waiting time, 30 mins from parking to plane.
5. Finally, if you follow your reasoning, then there is no future for any regional airport in the Benelux, since BRU and AMS are ‘easily’ reachable. What about ‘passenger convenience’ then? Unlike the ‘green’ parties, I still believe the passenger is ‘king’...

Stij
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by Stij »

I would feed CDG...
Yes, there're (just) 2 Thalys trains a day, but the hassle with your luggage on trains is legendary.
I think there's a market...

Cheers,

Stij

PttU
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Re: Air Antwerp in 2020

Post by PttU »

I wouldn't feed anything... Most far-away destinations are reachable from CDG, AMS, LHR, FRA, MUC or more of them. If CDG isn't easy to reach from the greater Antwerp region, you can still reach that destination for instance from FRA and take feeder flight from BRU.
I don't think there's a big opportunity for Air Antwerp there. I think they should focus on closer by business destinations.
But as I lack a few millions to be relevant for Air Antwerp, I guess my opinion will be limited to ramblings on this forum.

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