Social actions at air navigation service provider skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

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mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 12:24 Phoenixx and SR20, one more question:

It appears that last week there was a proposal on the table from the social mediator where management agreed to introduce a 32-hour working week instead of the current 35-hour week.

But I heard that the trade unions have rejected this because management only wanted to admit on the condition that a time registration of the exact hours worked would be introduced.

That also happens in most other companies. Why is this not accepted?

Thanks for your answer
Hi B767copilot,

Imagine that you have to work 5 days per week and 7 hours per day, so 35 hours per week. Almost each day you are able to leave 1 hour early (no control on your hours) and it’s counted as working time but you are not at work anymore. So you work 30 hours but you are paid 35.
Would you accept such proposal?
Management has been trying for years to stop those early leaves but they know that if they put “prikkloks/pointeuses” they will be facing a strike immediately. Here they are just trying in another way to avoid having to pay the hours that are not worked.
It will never be accepted without compensation because it’s part of the “package” that Atcos have been getting for years.

Boeing767copilot
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Boeing767copilot »

mvg wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 14:24
Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 12:24 Phoenixx and SR20, one more question:

It appears that last week there was a proposal on the table from the social mediator where management agreed to introduce a 32-hour working week instead of the current 35-hour week.

But I heard that the trade unions have rejected this because management only wanted to admit on the condition that a time registration of the exact hours worked would be introduced.

That also happens in most other companies. Why is this not accepted?

Thanks for your answer
Hi B767copilot,

Imagine that you have to work 5 days per week and 7 hours per day, so 35 hours per week. Almost each day you are able to leave 1 hour early (no control on your hours) and it’s counted as working time but you are not at work anymore. So you work 30 hours but you are paid 35.
Would you accept such proposal?
Management has been trying for years to stop those early leaves but they know that if they put “prikkloks/pointeuses” they will be facing a strike immediately. Here they are just trying in another way to avoid having to pay the hours that are not worked.
It will never be accepted without compensation because it’s part of the “package” that Atcos have been getting for years.
That is clear to me now. Can Phoenixx and other atco’s confirm this?

It is gradually becoming clear to me how many benefits the atco’s have.
They don't want anything to change. They are the boss. And the boss must do what they want. And the passenger must bear the consequences.

mvg
Posts: 139
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

Hi Phoenixx,

About what you mentioned about the training I would like to mention a few things:
- it doesn’t take (or at least it should not) take 9 months to train an Atco on the job in Canac. For an ab-initio, yes, but not for an Atco who has worked Tower before and is already used to working.
Training on west sectors means training on one, maximum two positions (sectors are 99% of the time collapsed). If training takes 9 months, that is around 150 days (taking some leave into account). If you train 4 hours per day that is 600 hours of training 🙄 for two sectors! That is way too much in my opinion... I’d rather say that training takes max 6 months.
That being said, it should also be possible to train more people at the same time. 2 per shift on east, two on west and two for approach is realistic. One works one hour and the second one the other hour and it goes on like that for the day. That’s already 12 Atcos training at the same time in CANAC. And that doesn’t take the nights into account where a few could train too.
12 Atcos every 6 months, take 9 that pass, that’s 18 per year (and it could be more if you roster them correctly using weekends and nights).
Of course this means a lot of trainees and training, and efforts for the OJT-Is but that’s a solution without penalizing anyone. Atcos will still have time to work by themselves if you allocate 2 OJT-Is per trainee.
Towers are all totally full (people are losing hours) except in Liege, so it’s possible to send Atcos to training. It would also be easy to train Ab-Initios straight to radar. I know we already talked about all this and remember your arguments.
But at some point you will have to make concessions and accept that rules like seniority only make the situation worse. That’s unacceptable. If you accept the rule that the best fit person gets the job, you will have a company that runs much better! And if you are good, which I know you are, you don’t have to be scared because you will have opportunities.

mvg
Posts: 139
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 14:46
mvg wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 14:24
Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 12:24 Phoenixx and SR20, one more question:

It appears that last week there was a proposal on the table from the social mediator where management agreed to introduce a 32-hour working week instead of the current 35-hour week.

But I heard that the trade unions have rejected this because management only wanted to admit on the condition that a time registration of the exact hours worked would be introduced.

That also happens in most other companies. Why is this not accepted?

Thanks for your answer
Hi B767copilot,

Imagine that you have to work 5 days per week and 7 hours per day, so 35 hours per week. Almost each day you are able to leave 1 hour early (no control on your hours) and it’s counted as working time but you are not at work anymore. So you work 30 hours but you are paid 35.
Would you accept such proposal?
Management has been trying for years to stop those early leaves but they know that if they put “prikkloks/pointeuses” they will be facing a strike immediately. Here they are just trying in another way to avoid having to pay the hours that are not worked.
It will never be accepted without compensation because it’s part of the “package” that Atcos have been getting for years.
That is clear to me now. Can Phoenixx and other atco’s confirm this?

It is gradually becoming clear to me how many benefits the atco’s have.
They don't want anything to change. They are the boss. And the boss must do what they want. And the passenger must bear the consequences.
For once I won’t be that negative about Atcos: I would say that they have a very good package (not working their hours, roster at their discretion, nights that count for two days and so on and so on).
We would not have talked about all this if there had not been so much damage to passengers, airlines and companies.
I am only mentioning what is happening so that everyone can have an idea about what an Atco’s professional life is. They have been working too much for years, that’s for sure and that’s not normal. Management isn’t doing well at all. But they aren’t like they are describing themselves either. With such conditions you make efforts (to a certain extend) and you accept solutions that do not suit you completely (like the seniority rule being banned).
On the other hand, management has to accept that some reasonable restrictions are put on the traffic when there is less staff.
After all management is managing and controllers are controlling. The problem is that controllers think that they would be good managers... We see what happened because of the seniority rule: former controllers are in the management and it’s a mess... The CEO is of course part of the problem but it seems that none of the former controllers has had the power to explain him enough how things are... why? Because they are not managers but controllers. You don’t become a manager without proper training and not everyone is able to do such a job.

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 14:46
mvg wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 14:24
Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 12:24 Phoenixx and SR20, one more question:

It appears that last week there was a proposal on the table from the social mediator where management agreed to introduce a 32-hour working week instead of the current 35-hour week.

But I heard that the trade unions have rejected this because management only wanted to admit on the condition that a time registration of the exact hours worked would be introduced.

That also happens in most other companies. Why is this not accepted?

Thanks for your answer
Hi B767copilot,

Imagine that you have to work 5 days per week and 7 hours per day, so 35 hours per week. Almost each day you are able to leave 1 hour early (no control on your hours) and it’s counted as working time but you are not at work anymore. So you work 30 hours but you are paid 35.
Would you accept such proposal?
Management has been trying for years to stop those early leaves but they know that if they put “prikkloks/pointeuses” they will be facing a strike immediately. Here they are just trying in another way to avoid having to pay the hours that are not worked.
It will never be accepted without compensation because it’s part of the “package” that Atcos have been getting for years.
That is clear to me now. Can Phoenixx and other atco’s confirm this?

It is gradually becoming clear to me how many benefits the atco’s have.
They don't want anything to change. They are the boss. And the boss must do what they want. And the passenger must bear the consequences.
You are asking someone (not pointing at Phoenixx at all) who doesn’t respect the rules to admit it on a forum... That would be like committing suicide...
They won’t do it and if you and me were them we wouldn’t do it either.
If you really want to check if it’s true, there are ways to do so for anyone who isn’t an Atco. But that’s gonna be via PM only and let’s wait first if there is an answer...

convair
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by convair »

Looking at this from the outside, it seems more obvious every day that Belgocontrol is a circus where there is no discipline and everyone is playing games.
Working 35 hours is already a privilege (maybe justified by the job), but working 30 hours and be paid 35 is stealing the company and its shareholders, of which we belgians are indirectly part of.
Strike for strike, the management shoud install these time clocks asap and make sure everyone uses them correctly. How come that in such a sensitive activity as air traffic control the management cannot know for sure who is present and who isn't?
The employees are sitting on their rights and privileges of other times; in all types of activities, people have been required to increase their productivity.
A European air traffic control system should be put in place asap, and with strict rules, in order to get rid of that nuisance (I mean management AND employees).

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by jan_olieslagers »

How come that in such a sensitive activity as air traffic control the management cannot know for sure who is present and who isn't?
They can, or at least they could. Access control is rather strict in Steenokkerzeel, as it should be, everybody needs to "badge" to enter and to leave. It doesn't take a lot of programming to deduce from the badge readers' logging an overview of people on or off premises, for the present or for any earlier date/time. But perhaps, such programming might be forbidden by some anachronist laws.
The employees are sitting on their rights and privileges of other times; in all types of activities, people have been required to increase their productivity.
Yes.
A European air traffic control system should be put in place asap, and with strict rules, in order to get rid of that nuisance (I mean management AND employees).
At the contrary, competition between ATC services and the companies that offer them ought to be encouraged. I do not like the "race to the bottom" a la Ryanair et al but in this particular case it seems to be asked for, almost on bended knees.

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

jan_olieslagers wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 18:21
How come that in such a sensitive activity as air traffic control the management cannot know for sure who is present and who isn't?
They can, or at least they could. Access control is rather strict in Steenokkerzeel, as it should be, everybody needs to "badge" to enter and to leave. It doesn't take a lot of programming to deduce from the badge readers' logging an overview of people on or off premises, for the present or for any earlier date/time. But perhaps, such programming might be forbidden by some anachronist laws.
The badge system exists and the program to log the hours too BUT it is only used to count the hours of the administrative employees. It does not apply to controllers ;) (they would go crazy) but of course, management has all the data about all the employees who enter and exit the site in Steenokkerzeel.
They also have the details of each entry/exit in each building as there is a badge reader at each door (necessary to open it).

There is also a login system on each working position for licensing/currency purposes (a minimum of hours is required per position per certain period). Each controller can see how many hours he/she has effectively worked over the last months/year. It would be very interesting and it would put an end to a big part of this debate if an Atco would show how many hours he has effectively worked over the last year. I still bet on 3 to 4 hours per shift (nights included)...
Last edited by mvg on 22 Apr 2019, 19:01, edited 1 time in total.

jan_olieslagers
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by jan_olieslagers »

(they would just go crazy)
Some might say they have ... for quite a while now ...

Others might say it could take less outrage to make highly-qualified staff go crazy...
Last edited by jan_olieslagers on 22 Apr 2019, 19:01, edited 1 time in total.

convair
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by convair »

jan_olieslagers wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 18:21
A European air traffic control system should be put in place asap, and with strict rules, in order to get rid of that nuisance (I mean management AND employees).
At the contrary, competition between ATC services and the companies that offer them ought to be encouraged. I do not like the "race to the bottom" a la Ryanair et al but in this particular case it seems to be asked for, almost on bended knees.
Maybe this service should indeed be fully privatized and open to competitive bidding, but I don't see this happening in our belgian paradise of civil servants.

Poiu
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Poiu »

mvg wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 18:53
There is also a login system on each working position for licensing/currency purposes (a minimum of hours is required per position per certain period). Each controller can see how many hours he/she has effectively worked over the last months/year. It would be very interesting and it would put an end to a big part of this debate if an Atco would show how many hours he has effectively worked over the last year. I still bet on 3 to 4 hours per shift (nights included)...
I do hope they don’t work moer than 4 hours per shift, 1 hour on, 1 hour off is a minimum.
Do you suggest ATCOs should do 15 hour shifts in order to reach 8 hours in front of the screen?
Are the people at delivery ATCOs? That is a job which could easily be done by a trainee with a radio licence whilst waiting for further training.
Offering (part time) tower positions at the more quiet airports to newly retired ATCOs could free up some staff as well.

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

Poiu wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 19:53
mvg wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 18:53
There is also a login system on each working position for licensing/currency purposes (a minimum of hours is required per position per certain period). Each controller can see how many hours he/she has effectively worked over the last months/year. It would be very interesting and it would put an end to a big part of this debate if an Atco would show how many hours he has effectively worked over the last year. I still bet on 3 to 4 hours per shift (nights included)...
I do hope they don’t work moer than 4 hours per shift, 1 hour on, 1 hour off is a minimum.
Do you suggest ATCOs should do 15 hour shifts in order to reach 8 hours in front of the screen?
Are the people at delivery ATCOs? That is a job which could easily be done by a trainee with a radio licence whilst waiting for further training.
Offering (part time) tower positions at the more quiet airports to newly retired ATCOs could free up some staff as well.
Extract from ICAO guidelines to reduce fatigue in operational environment:

The ratio of duty periods to breaks.
Breaks within a duty period should be planned according to workload, complexity of ATC provision, time of the day, type of rostering system.

The minimum duration of a break should be 30 minutes.

Maximum time providing ATC service without breaks:

The maximum time providing ATC service should be 2 hours for personnel providing ATC service working with visual terminals and/or radar displays. Intervals can be reviewed periodically or when an increase in traffic load was experienced.
ATSUs experiencing low traffic loads for prolonged periods of time may extend shift sessions to 3 hours.


Following ICAO guidelines, for a 7 hours shift, Atcos could work 2 hours, then have 30 minutes break, then work another 2 hours, take 30 minutes break, and finish by 2 hours of work.
That would mean 6 hours of work... That's a lot of course but foreign ATC providers make their Atcos work between 5h30 and 6 hours per shift (shifts usually last 8 hours).
Do not misunderstand: sitting as a planner next to an executive controller IS counted as work, being stand-by for a sector that might open IS counted as work. Working in ATC does not mean working high traffic (peak) constantly. Over a morning shift of 7 hours, peak periods last less than 2 hours in Brussels... O minute of peak in some airports...
During some shifts, depending on the rotation, it is perfectly possible not to work any peak period.
If you have been in an ops-room, you know what that means...

In the past, some people were working two shifts in a row (some even 3) with more traffic than now: how do you explain that they couldn't work one shift normally anymore now? Some years ago they were working (unofficially) 2 or 3 shifts in a row (3 shifts = 24 hours!)

Boeing767copilot
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Boeing767copilot »

Has anyone noticed that the Belgian airspace remains open for three consecutive nights. An extra reimbursement for those who are working on Sunday and public holiday (Easter)?

I also notice that it is very quiet at the moment with our friends atco's on this forum.

Poiu
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Poiu »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 20:38 Has anyone noticed that the Belgian airspace remains open for three consecutive nights.

I also notice that it is very quiet at the moment with our friends atco's on this forum.
Well if they are working, they can’t be here! (I hope!)

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg »

A night from Saturday to Sunday and one from Sunday to Easter Monday (considered as a Sunday as it is a bank holiday) are the best paid shifts... Just saying :)

Let’s hope they find solutions anyway. But with the same management and the same controllers, if the people are not changed, it’s just postponing the troubles...

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sn26567
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sn26567 »

Just one smile in this most serious topic:

Image

- And... what are you doing in life?
- Air traffic controller. But now, I am sick. It's very hard!
André
ex Sabena #26567

SR20
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 20:38 Has anyone noticed that the Belgian airspace remains open for three consecutive nights. An extra reimbursement for those who are working on Sunday and public holiday (Easter)?

I also notice that it is very quiet at the moment with our friends atco's on this forum.
Correct me if I'm wrong but there has been an airspace closure the night from saturday till sunday !
Capture+_2019-04-20-22-55-28.png

Phoenixx
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Phoenixx »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 20:38 Has anyone noticed that the Belgian airspace remains open for three consecutive nights. An extra reimbursement for those who are working on Sunday and public holiday (Easter)?

I also notice that it is very quiet at the moment with our friends atco's on this forum.
Nothing against you personally, but if this kind of posts keep coming, I'm done reacting here, and then I go back to reading while shrugging slightly and rolling my eyes.
I reacted twice this afternoon and do have a social and a rather busy worklife apart from everything else.
In case you hadn't noticed, I prefer to answer in full and properly, not half-assed.

And to answer your other remark, which is exactly the biased attitude I came here to disagree on, they have started "claiming" atcos and are forcing them to take or swap shifts short notice.
We are one step away from getting police at our door on our off day to take us to work because they can't find anyone to do it voluntarily.
Reactions are either "they can't do that, that's not legal?!" or "it's about time, that's only logical".
Well, forcing anyone to accept a different shift one or few days in advance is not legal either, they don't care either, why would they stop there? just another issue to add to the pile.
And to the other reaction; Really? What kind of dictatorship are we living in?

In 'short' to the rest:
Hours of training and number of positions don't matter, our on the job training is counted in days and when I say 9 months, this is an average based on reality. (min number of days + vacation days + possible resit of one or two parts)
Maximum number of trainees simultaneously is also determined by a procedure (as is everything for that matter), and it is closer to 2 per unit than 2 per shift. EBBR has 2 per shift and this is not workable for the atcos.
I understand the seniority rule comes from older times, but there are colleagues who have been waiting for over 8 years to take this course because of this rule. Whose future career also depends on this because of other rules.
Without any guarantees or clear and transparent transition measures, suddenly implementing things like direct entry ab initios is not something you can do in a government owned company without changing your whole system while you're at it. This urge to implement this fast-fast is not well thought out and will bring more problems than it solves.
Once again, these attempted new ways of working won't change anything since there are plenty of atcos waiting eagerly in the towers to start this training. Honestly, we are not preventing extra trainings from happening in any way, would be a win-win-win-win (tower controllers waiting, canac, management and the general public)

May I point out the seniority rule is being discarded SINCE ex-controllers are in the management and not the other way around? This rule has been around since 1989 if I'm not mistaken.
And again, we are open to change, but not the way the CEO is attempting to implement it.
"I don't like this rule, so we will simply discard it and go to court with anyone who disagrees. While we are in court on the issue, it is not up for any discussion or negotiation. Meanwhile, we claim we do everything right, even though it's the opposite of how the rule has been followed for 28 years. And now that I see I may have taken it too far (in following this logic on multiple topics), I might give back part of the rules and rights you have had for 28 years -and longer- IF you accept all these other things that you are all against"
Everybody his job, I agree. But a CEO has an obligation to follow the rules and laws, not make his own and force them onto everybody. (to answer your question in short, he is a very stubborn man) The whole management has the obligation to put safety above their numbers, not to publicly claim safety is in their blood but constantly make questionable decisions on that topic.
And atcos have the duty to control air traffic. We do. Clearly not as much as our CEO and everybody needs, but way more than we are expected to do normally.

Once again, have you not noticed how in 2017-2018 we had these same issues, but there were no airspace closures and no strikes? We worked with what we had and made it work. But then the CEO started taking away peoples motivations and incentives to go this extra mile while still expecting all this extra work and effort. I'm afraid that doesn't work.
No we are not the boss and no we don't get what we want. We haven't in a long time and we will not this time either. But we refuse to be massively screwed over AGAIN.
If you can't understand that, honestly, we're done discussing.

I do wish to clear up a misunderstanding that seems to be widespread here.
We have a 35 hour workweek, but our roster (if we worked 5/7) puts us at work for 37,5 hours.
If you work 6/7 (lets say this is pretty much reality in canac), the roster puts you at work for 45 hours (!), every week, week in week out, for years straight already and years to come.
Are you honestly shocked SOME (not all) atcos decide to go home to eat with their families at the end of their shift instead of eating unpaid at work? When all positions are manned and there is no staff shortage?
Nobody will walk away from position or canac if there is a shortage, there is always a buffer.
This is a touchy issue and I will not go into it further, but I'm still surprised how many people are just drawn to these lightning rods that are thrown in the media to spark outrage amongst the public and stare themselves blind on it.
To the same guy, you think we did not increase our productivity?
Have a look at some press releases and figures of the last few years regarding the topic before you claim skeyes is not productive.
And yes, we are a big fan of a system with rules, where the rules are followed.
A maximum number of days, hours, consecutive shifts, ...
We have rights, a package, rules, laws forcing us and laws protecting us, advantages, ... but all of them are subject to the will of the management at the moment. We KNOW we will lose some things either way, but this situation is not workable.
So sure, free up the market, but do so responsibly under a window of European laws and rules (instead of guidelines that are discarded whenever somebody sees fit to do so)

As I stated before, roughly around 2/3 of the shift (the paid 7h) is work, 1/3 is off.
Clearance delivery is a non-licensed position and last I heard there are indeed waiting ab-initios doing shifts on this position after a short training. Does not solve a shortage in canac though.
Newly retired atcos either want to go home and retire or they sign up for a bit longer.
Sending them to a regional tower is a horrible idea as it requires retraining and it places them in an environment they are not or no longer used to. Wouldn't solve any shortage in canac either.

Am I claiming they can not work one shift normally anymore?
The days you are talking about had different views on safety, a smaller history of accidents and incidents (simply because aviation and safety evolved and the sector tries to learn from every incident or accident) and just in general a whole different mindset. The 'they' you are referring to was also more exception than rule. Either way, how focused do you think you will still be in your second consecutive shift? Or in the third?
Even when you avoid peak hours, this job requires constant attention.
There is a saying amongst controllers regarding safety and incidents; "you only need 2 aircrafts..."
Any moment can be the moment something goes wrong, peak or no peak, busy or calm environment (and calm moments are more dangerous for that matter)
What is the point in squeezing people out like lemons? Maximize your numbers? Reduce costs?
Force something down peoples throats and all you get back is what you forced down, nothing more.
This company can't provide the service it's meant to provide with 'nothing more'.
During multiple nightshifts this year I worked 4/5 hours straight, because it was needed.
What do you think will happen if they implement this ICAO rule and enforce it?
After two hours, some people will put their mic down and put their feet up for half an hour. And then there would be public outrage if that news came out too.
Honestly, who wins from this?
You need motivation, skill, passion, enthusiasm, but most of all; flexibility. Aviation is not a static or predictable sector.
Every rule they add, restricts one or both parties in their flexibility though, and that knife cuts on both sides.
That is the price of chasing absolute control. (something he does not realize yet, or something he is planning on dealing with by coming up with the most inclusive set of rules ever written. We're not sure which one it is.)
Last edited by Phoenixx on 23 Apr 2019, 05:14, edited 2 times in total.

Phoenixx
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Phoenixx »

Boeing767copilot wrote: 22 Apr 2019, 12:24 Phoenixx and SR20, one more question:

It appears that last week there was a proposal on the table from the social mediator where management agreed to introduce a 32-hour working week instead of the current 35-hour week.

But I heard that the trade unions have rejected this because management only wanted to admit on the condition that a time registration of the exact hours worked would be introduced.

That also happens in most other companies. Why is this not accepted?
I just read a few articles now and tried to get informed.
As I said, these negotiations and their content are confidential, but it seems like management once again broke their own rules by leaking this in the press. (One might wonder why?)
What they don't mention is the full offer involving the 32 hours, the other offers they made (which were hilarious) or the offers made by unions to create a temporary worksituation without closures and minimal delays.
This is another attempt to make them seem like the good guys, and I must admit that if I was not working for them, I would have probably chosen my side too already.

I can continue to try and put everything in (our) perspective, counter false information, defend my colleagues and myself against lies and judgement and honestly just try to inform you of the silent side of this story, but it's getting a bit exhausting dealing with this mess non stop (don't forget I'm in it 45 hours per week already).
So I will reduce my posts a bit, and their length.
Time will tell what is going to happen, and as much as I (and many of my colleagues) sincerely hope for this all to be fixed soon, I'm afraid we're nowhere near the end yet.

Boeing767copilot
Posts: 1385
Joined: 13 May 2004, 00:00

Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Boeing767copilot »

Phoenixx, thanks for your comprehensive answer.

All understanding that you also have to work. ;)

But I also can continue to try and put everything in another perspective, counter false information, and so on.
I wish you and your colleagues a good outcome of the negotiations. And that the customer/passenger can safely take his plane and arrive on time at his destination.

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