Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

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sean1982
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sean1982 » 16 May 2019, 12:32

Did everyone who was on weekend days and holidays alo come to that meeting that is so important that it justifies shutting down a countries airspace?. I dont think any of you still understands the implications of such an action from your ivory towers.

Because if not, it cant have been that important no? Then its just selfish childish behaviour.Zum kotzen.

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Atlantis
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Atlantis » 16 May 2019, 12:42

Exactly. This shows now who is not willing to find a solution but only to hurt the economy, image of Belgium, but only thinking about their own profit.

If the management wants to offer meetings with smaller groups then they offer you something. But you just ignored that and going on a wild cat strike. In other major multinational companies are also meetings in smaller groups bcs a meeting in all cannot be. And they do like that. ATC is not that flexible?? You think your are united??? you just made yourself impossible now and if no solution then you can count this on your own disconto.

Go back to your chair and work like everybody has to do. At no single place you can have everything that you want. We all have to work hard, longer and with overtime without more money

mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg » 16 May 2019, 13:49

It is time to end this circus.

We can expect their comments like “You don’t know what you are talking about” and “you don’t understand our job”. It’s all about safety and they are professionals. Those poor workers feel bashed. We feel so sad for them.

They work 3 hours per day (sometimes less) for 6500€ per month after tax, they leave work before the end of their shift (confirmed on this forum) and find it normal, nobody cares if they are efficient or not, they can have incidents, respond to their managers as they feel like: nothing will ever happen to them because they are State employees!
As a reward for their brilliant career they will be paid 80% of their salary during more than 5 years (and stay at home) before their pension and finally get a 3500€ pension (after tax).
We all feel pity, we understand that they block a country to go to an information meeting.

Good luck guys! From now on I’ll fly out of Amsterdam, Paris or Düsseldorf but Brussels never again!

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sn26567 » 16 May 2019, 14:14

It's time for the Government to act and impose a minimum service rule, like at the Belgian Railways and the Walloon TEC (which just got a 1M euro fine because it did not carry out that minimum service in some regions on 14 May).

And in case of a wildcat strike (= illegal), the strikers (or their unions) should be held personally responsible for any costs incurred by inconvenienced airlines and passengers.

I had some comprehension for the demands of the ATCOs expressed in this forum and I realised that skeyes management bears a big responsibility in the degradation of their working conditions over the years. But ATCOs have lost all credibility in one single morning.
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mvg
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg » 16 May 2019, 14:19

They say they don’t care or ask for money. Maybe they can all give a few thousands euros from their small salaries to give a compensation to the stranded passengers

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Airbus330lover » 16 May 2019, 14:21

Matt wrote:
16 May 2019, 09:08
Look, I get why they strike today, I get why they are disgruntled. It get the why.

But the way HOW they strike now baffles me.

A spontanious action, right in the busyest period of the day, leaving thousands of passengers stranded at BRU airport, to me that is inexcusable. This way atco's just bully people who have nothing to do with the matter :!:

Holidays ruined, business trips on hold etc etc etc... People and airliners coulnd't even take precautions ( like they can with the NMBS who announce it weeks beforehand )

Sorry. The Atco's lost A LOT of respect now from me and from the public opinion.

They better watch out or they will have less jobs if people start avoiding BRU more and more and go to DUS, AMS or CDG!

#VeryDisgruntled
#verydisgruntled.... me too

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Matt » 16 May 2019, 14:28

I see planes landing at 07L...

IT'S OVER

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by jan_olieslagers » 16 May 2019, 14:37

Once again I must agree with André: wildcat strikes are never acceptable, never, whatever the grounds.
Make them pay for the damage, yes! YES!

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 » 16 May 2019, 14:40

On the RTBF TV news (13h) they said an agreement was reached between ACV and skeyes CEO to renegociate last week's agreement (the one only approved by ACOD/CGSP) An official statement from skeyes is expected !

https://www.rtbf.be/auvio/detail_arret- ... wsource=cl

https://www.rtbf.be/info/societe/detail ... d=10221931
Last edited by SR20 on 16 May 2019, 15:27, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg » 16 May 2019, 14:56

They will have to renegotiate and give the spoiled workers what they want like always because there is NO CHOICE. That’s why they feel so strong and dare to put a country upside down! There is no possibility to replace them unless you stop the traffic for two years! (Time needed to train new motivated guys).

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Boeing767copilot » 16 May 2019, 15:18

mvg wrote:
16 May 2019, 14:56
They will have to renegotiate and give the spoiled workers what they want like always because there is NO CHOICE. That’s why they feel so strong and dare to put a country upside down! There is no possibility to replace them unless you stop the traffic for two years! (Time needed to train new motivated guys).
skeyes:

Pas de renégociation de l'accord, la concertation prévue aura lieu
Jeudi 16 mai 2019

Lorsque l'accord social de skeyes a été conclu le 10 mai dernier, il a été convenu que l'accord serait élaboré en concertation entre la direction et les syndicats.

Au début de cette semaine, la direction a pris l'initiative et une première réunion a été fixée pour le lundi 20 mai.

Il ne s'agit pas de renégocier l'accord, mais d'élaborer concrètement les détails de l'accord conclu.

Les réunions d'information qui étaient prévues tout au long de la journée d'aujourd'hui ont été annulées après qu’il s’est avéré que des actions non-annoncées auraient lieu. Toutefois, ces actions n'étaient assorties d'aucune revendication.

Les réunions d'information prévues à partir de demain auront lieu comme prévu.

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 » 16 May 2019, 15:34

Boeing767copilot wrote:
16 May 2019, 15:18

skeyes:

Toutefois, ces actions n'étaient assorties d'aucune revendication.
Has the CEO been on holiday for the past few months ? 😯😕

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by mvg » 16 May 2019, 15:40

@Boeing767copilot
That’s theory... Everyone has already understood the details. They are and they won’t be happy till they get what they want. Like for all the previous strikes.
Say no to a spoiled kid and he is gonna keep on asking till he gets what he wants...
Last edited by mvg on 16 May 2019, 15:43, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Airbus330lover » 16 May 2019, 15:41

@mvg.. right word : Kids.. and well paid kids

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sn26567 » 16 May 2019, 18:41

Boeing767copilot wrote:
16 May 2019, 15:18
skeyes:

Pas de renégociation de l'accord, la concertation prévue aura lieu
Jeudi 16 mai 2019

Lorsque l'accord social de skeyes a été conclu le 10 mai dernier, il a été convenu que l'accord serait élaboré en concertation entre la direction et les syndicats.

Au début de cette semaine, la direction a pris l'initiative et une première réunion a été fixée pour le lundi 20 mai.

Il ne s'agit pas de renégocier l'accord, mais d'élaborer concrètement les détails de l'accord conclu.

Les réunions d'information qui étaient prévues tout au long de la journée d'aujourd'hui ont été annulées après qu’il s’est avéré que des actions non-annoncées auraient lieu. Toutefois, ces actions n'étaient assorties d'aucune revendication.

Les réunions d'information prévues à partir de demain auront lieu comme prévu.
... which, in English, has been translated to https://www.aviation24.be/air-traffic-c ... continues/
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by sn26567 » 16 May 2019, 19:02

A judge has just ruled that Belgian ANSP skeyes will have to pay €10,000 per flight (or €20,000 for long-haul routes) to Brussels Airlines if the airline has to cancel, divert or delay flights by more than one hour due to ATC strikes between tomorrow and 26 May.

Brussels Airlines claims that it lost more than 4 million euros this year as a consequence of the social unrest at skeyes, without taking into account the loss in reputation and the fact that more and more passengers are opting for nearby foreign airports.
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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by jan_olieslagers » 16 May 2019, 19:14

... which is what should have happened much earlier. (the judgement, I mean, not SN's (claimed) losses).
We can only hope that government - still the controlling authority of Belgocontrol* as I understand - will finally take action, for example by putting in place an emergency manager. They ought to have acted much earlier, too, but it is a known fact that politicians will not act until they really must. In Belgium as in many countries.

* alias "skeyes" but that is only a commercial banner, invented by marketing girls and boys. Who paid them for that, by the way, and how much?

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by jan_olieslagers » 16 May 2019, 21:30

The request is understandable, but could it be met with? In a legal way? Surely any copy would be a breach of copyright?

That said, we are perhaps not missing much. The little bit of text copied includes, for just one example, " ... zeggen de luchtverkeersleiders... " ("as ATCO's say" , my free translation) without mentioning who or how many of the ATC staff state this. Cheapo generalisation, one hallmark of commercial "journalism".

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by Jetter » 16 May 2019, 21:41

It seems like not all atco’s are a problem, but mainly the Christian ones have a poor and selfish mentality. So much for looking not only after yourself as Christian value. :roll: It’s ACV that callled for the wildcat strike today, while the socialists already agreed on a deal. Maybe banning religious people from working as atco would be a long-term solution? :twisted:

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Re: Social actions at air traffic control service skeyes (Belgium) - possible air traffic disruptions

Post by SR20 » 16 May 2019, 22:03

Jetter wrote:
16 May 2019, 21:41
It seems like not all atco’s are a problem, but mainly the Christian ones have a poor and selfish mentality. So much for looking not only after yourself as Christian value. :roll: It’s ACV that callled for the wildcat strike today, while the socialists already agreed on a deal. Maybe banning religious people from working as atco would be a long-term solution? :twisted:
VSOA/SLFP supported today's actions too I believe !

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