25-31/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

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Airpocket
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Airpocket » 27 Oct 2018, 23:52

lumumba wrote:
27 Oct 2018, 23:42
Somebody knows the profit numbers of Brussels Airport?
They made about 70 million € profit in 2017 and grow about 15% per year.

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lumumba
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by lumumba » 28 Oct 2018, 00:03

Airpocket wrote:
27 Oct 2018, 23:52
lumumba wrote:
27 Oct 2018, 23:42
Somebody knows the profit numbers of Brussels Airport?
They made about 70 million € profit in 2017 and grow about 15% per year.
And how much is their turnover?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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lumumba
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by lumumba » 28 Oct 2018, 00:16

Airpocket wrote:
27 Oct 2018, 23:52
lumumba wrote:
27 Oct 2018, 23:42
Somebody knows the profit numbers of Brussels Airport?
They made about 70 million € profit in 2017 and grow about 15% per year.
Anyway everything is said!!!!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

sean1982
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by sean1982 » 28 Oct 2018, 05:47

No it’s not. It’s not Brussels airport that needs to do anything about workers that pay for aviapartner. Aviapartner needs to negotiate a contract which allows them to do their business properly. That’s not Brussels airport’s responsibility.

Airpocket
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Airpocket » 28 Oct 2018, 08:21

sean1982 wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 05:47
No it’s not. It’s not Brussels airport that needs to do anything about workers that pay for aviapartner. Aviapartner needs to negotiate a contract which allows them to do their business properly. That’s not Brussels airport’s responsibility.
Ok, but then you get situations like these. For example: if you want to buy a car to transfer your customers from point a to b and let carmanufacturers give you offers for their cars. The manufacturers know you always are going to make a decision based on price. What do you think is going to happen? If you buy the cheapest car, chances of it going out of service and needing repairs are bigger then when you choose a more expensive and more reliable car. Btw, Brussels airport is responsible for the equipment that has to be used. Off course they cheap out on this. Apparently the aquipment is outdated em sometimes dangerous. This is also 1 of the arguments for the strike.

ttubbie
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by ttubbie » 28 Oct 2018, 09:30

Anyone able to explain Why there are never strikes at Aviapartner Schiphol ?

Passenger
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Passenger » 28 Oct 2018, 09:43

ttubbie wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:30
Anyone able to explain Why there are never strikes at Aviapartner Schiphol ?
Dutch mentality. Other trade unions behaviour ("let's try our upmost not to screw the passengers"). No internal competition between trade unions: FNV rules (FNV = Federation of Dutch Trade Unions).

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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Passenger » 28 Oct 2018, 10:08

With Aviapartner, labour costs represent 60% of your their costs. So there is no room for a price war (other example: a car dealer can regain a huge discount at the purchase with highier costs for maintenance afterwards). And that is what prof. Van de Voorde stated: ground handlers have to increase their tariffs, enabling them to make profit and to give a better service. Even when a tariff increase would mean that airlines leave.

Sure, when the product is about the same, airlines make their decision based upon the tariff. And here both Aviapartner and SwissPort accept the airlines' demands, though they know it will be very hard to make a profit then. Why? Because both Aviapartner and SwissPort have hundreds of staff on their payroll, and they need the income to pay them. At this moment, they have a duopoly. So when both handlers do the same, airlines have to accept the tariff increase.

Transport professor Van de Voorde stated they must end contracts that don't allow to make a profit. And with the contracts left, at a decent margin, their service will improve so the airline will be happier at the end. When airlines switch to Swissport: good luck to them there (by the way: Swissport nv/sa is also a sick patient).

Given the terrible figures from their annual account, it's sad to read so much leftist populism: "priest Daens", "equipment is unsafe", "loaders earn 1.400 nett/month", "loaders are not allowed to take a toilet break", "management only looks at the profit". Sure, management and owners have made some mistakes/errors. But it was not to enrich themselves.

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lumumba
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by lumumba » 28 Oct 2018, 10:14

Passenger wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:43
ttubbie wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:30
Anyone able to explain Why there are never strikes at Aviapartner Schiphol ?
Dutch mentality. Other trade unions behaviour ("let's try our upmost not to screw the passengers"). No internal competition between trade unions: FNV rules (FNV = Federation of Dutch Trade Unions).
Thanks for the explanation....please be honest here are you sure it's only that!
So you still think all the fault goes to the employees can you imagine there is also a management problem or is the leading management never on the wrong side!
Is there a human side in you can you understand the years of frustrations do you really think they strike to hassle the passengers.....
Please open the debate here !

And yes they will have to make there services more expensive looks there is no choice here.
And the airlines will not go,another choice could be that Brussels Airport lower there price they have enough profit to do so and to give less to there shareholders and more to the employees working on the site!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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luchtzak
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by luchtzak » 28 Oct 2018, 10:39

In newspaper De Tijd, the Aviapartner management said that its employees gain €2,200 net average, the eldest more than €3,000 net average.

The employees say they earn €1,400 net average...

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luchtzak
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by luchtzak » 28 Oct 2018, 11:26

Passenger wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:43
ttubbie wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:30
Anyone able to explain Why there are never strikes at Aviapartner Schiphol ?
Dutch mentality. Other trade unions behaviour ("let's try our upmost not to screw the passengers"). No internal competition between trade unions: FNV rules (FNV = Federation of Dutch Trade Unions).
Ahum ... 29 January 2018 and 28 March 2018, hence this year ...

Aviapartner Schiphol employees have spontaneously stopped working

https://www.aviation24.be/ground-handli ... amsterdam/

https://www.nu.nl/economie/5197967/pers ... -neer.html

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KriVa
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by KriVa » 28 Oct 2018, 11:35

Strike seems to continue until at least tomorrow (29/10) morning 0500z, according to NOTAM:

Code: Select all

A3417/18 
From:28 OCT 18 09:10 Till:29 OCT 18 05:00 
Text:AVIAPARTNER HANDLING SERVICES NOT AVBL DUE TO INDUSTRIAL ACTION
Thomas

Jetter
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Jetter » 28 Oct 2018, 11:43

luchtzak wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 11:26
Passenger wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:43
ttubbie wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:30
Anyone able to explain Why there are never strikes at Aviapartner Schiphol ?
Dutch mentality. Other trade unions behaviour ("let's try our upmost not to screw the passengers"). No internal competition between trade unions: FNV rules (FNV = Federation of Dutch Trade Unions).
Ahum ... 29 January 2018 and 28 March 2018, hence this year ...
:roll: You’re basically proving his point: when Dutch workers want to bring attention to their issues they stop working for a short time so everyone can still reach their destination, Belgian workers on the other side stop working indefinitely without regard for other people’s interests when they have similar complaints.

BRU
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by BRU » 28 Oct 2018, 11:47

Airpocket wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 08:21
sean1982 wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 05:47
No it’s not. It’s not Brussels airport that needs to do anything about workers that pay for aviapartner. Aviapartner needs to negotiate a contract which allows them to do their business properly. That’s not Brussels airport’s responsibility.
Ok, but then you get situations like these. For example: if you want to buy a car to transfer your customers from point a to b and let carmanufacturers give you offers for their cars. The manufacturers know you always are going to make a decision based on price. What do you think is going to happen? If you buy the cheapest car, chances of it going out of service and needing repairs are bigger then when you choose a more expensive and more reliable car. Btw, Brussels airport is responsible for the equipment that has to be used. Off course they cheap out on this. Apparently the aquipment is outdated em sometimes dangerous. This is also 1 of the arguments for the strike.
1) handling licences are given based on a variaty of topics, but there is no price involved. So you do not have to “buy” a licence nor have you got to mention prices you will charge to the airlines. That is a commercial discussion between handler and airline.

2) Ground handling equipment is owned by the handler, not the airport.

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luchtzak
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Re: 25-26/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by luchtzak » 28 Oct 2018, 12:19

Passenger wrote:
26 Oct 2018, 13:52
Turnover 2017: 61.709.090
Operational loss 2017: 2.775.916 (-)
Final loss of 2017 (verlies boekjaar): 3.635.453 (-)
Cumulated loss (overgedragen verlies): 24.334.941 (-)
Own assets (eigen vermogen): minus 15.473.643 (-)
Capital (geplaatst kapitaal): 4.952.268
Total debts: 49.049.861
Debts one year max.: 26.296.218

Remark by Revisor pwc: “…Wij vestigen uw aandacht op toelichting 6.20 in de jaarrekening die wijst op een onzekerheid van materieel belang die twijfel kan doen ontstaan over het vermogen van de Vennootschap om haar activiteiten voor te zetten omwille van het negatief eigen vermogen, het verlies over het boekjaar en de liquiditeitsratio die aangeeft dat de korte termijnschulden hoger zijn dan de vlottende activa. Hierdoor is de voortzetting van de Vennootschap slechts verantwoord in de mate dat de Vennootschap een beroep kan blijven doen op de verschillende financieringsbronnen en dat het rendabiliteitsproject met succes kan uitgevoerd worden…”

I'm no accountant, revisor or lawyer, so I don't translate that. But Google.translate will tell you that it doesn't look good for them.
Looks like your research has been picked up by De Tijd.

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luchtzak
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by luchtzak » 28 Oct 2018, 12:30

Jetter wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 11:43
luchtzak wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 11:26
Passenger wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 09:43

Dutch mentality. Other trade unions behaviour ("let's try our upmost not to screw the passengers"). No internal competition between trade unions: FNV rules (FNV = Federation of Dutch Trade Unions).
Ahum ... 29 January 2018 and 28 March 2018, hence this year ...
:roll: You’re basically proving his point: when Dutch workers want to bring attention to their issues they stop working for a short time so everyone can still reach their destination, Belgian workers on the other side stop working indefinitely without regard for other people’s interests when they have similar complaints.
But they also go on strike.

Jetter
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Jetter » 28 Oct 2018, 12:52

luchtzak wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 12:30
But they also go on strike.
My English isn’t good enough to know if a 1 hour work stoppage falls under the meaning of strike, but at least in Dutch there are different words for it (staking vs werkonderbreking). Doesn’t really matter anyway, what matters is that our neighbors have a way to solve labor issues that causes way less issues for others: there have been dozens of strikes of ~1 hour in the last few years (if you can even call that a strike), while at BRU there have been dozens of strikes lasting multiple days.

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lumumba
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Re: 25-26-27/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by lumumba » 28 Oct 2018, 13:28

Jetter wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 12:52
luchtzak wrote:
28 Oct 2018, 12:30
But they also go on strike.
My English isn’t good enough to know if a 1 hour work stoppage falls under the meaning of strike, but at least in Dutch there are different words for it (staking vs werkonderbreking). Doesn’t really matter anyway, what matters is that our neighbors have a way to solve labor issues that causes way less issues for others: there have been dozens of strikes of ~1 hour in the last few years (if you can even call that a strike), while at BRU there have been dozens of strikes lasting multiple days.
But one situation is not the other you can not compare!!!!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Boavida
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Re: 25-26-27-28/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by Boavida » 28 Oct 2018, 16:23

It's time for Laurent Levaux (president Aviapartner Belgium) to go. He clearly isn't competent at all. Maybe it's time for a more Flemish/Northern European style management.

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luchtzak
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Re: 25-26-27-28/10/2018 Aviapartner strike at Brussels Airport

Post by luchtzak » 28 Oct 2018, 18:14

Still no agreement ...

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