Air Belgium in 2018

Join this forum to discuss the latest news that happened in the world of commercial aviation.

Moderator: Latest news team

Post Reply
Poiu
Posts: 749
Joined: 14 Nov 2015, 09:38

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Poiu » 29 Mar 2018, 21:11

convair wrote:
29 Mar 2018, 20:55
I assume the cabin crew for the Paramaribo flight will be half Air Belgium, half Surinam.
Impossible, as both airlines have different procedures. The minimum legal crew will be AB, whilst there will probably be extra Surinam crew with a commercial function only, they are not allowed to execute any safety related tasks.

JVSpotter
Posts: 58
Joined: 05 Feb 2017, 11:27
Contact:

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by JVSpotter » 29 Mar 2018, 21:30

Not the most successful first flight. Due to some technical issues (probably with the flaps) and a bagage related issue, it departed with 3 hours delay.

https://www.luchtvaartnieuws.nl/nieuws/ ... -dure-grap
Last edited by JVSpotter on 29 Mar 2018, 21:52, edited 2 times in total.

Boavida
Posts: 446
Joined: 14 Sep 2010, 23:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Boavida » 29 Mar 2018, 21:36

Already technical issues with the aircraft? :-?

User avatar
sn26567
Posts: 36311
Joined: 13 Feb 2003, 00:00
Location: Rosières/Rozieren, Belgium
Contact:

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by sn26567 » 29 Mar 2018, 22:09

JVSpotter wrote:
29 Mar 2018, 21:30
Not the most successful first flight. Due to some technical issues (probably with the flaps) and a bagage related issue, it departed with 3 hours delay.
As long as the delay on arrival is less than 3 hours, Air Belgium will avoid paying 600 euros to each of the 300 passengers. It will be a close call! (STA 19:45, ETA 22:49 at this moment)
André
ex Sabena #26567

Boavida
Posts: 446
Joined: 14 Sep 2010, 23:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Boavida » 29 Mar 2018, 22:34

According to some reports on twitter, the problem was 'no hydraulic pressure in the flaps'.... Oh dear.

jan_olieslagers
Posts: 3085
Joined: 24 Jun 2006, 08:34
Location: Vl.Brabant
Contact:

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by jan_olieslagers » 29 Mar 2018, 23:15

"Oh dear" ? pfff, what an expert!

lucas
Posts: 152
Joined: 01 Feb 2017, 15:06

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by lucas » 29 Mar 2018, 23:22

The aircraft landed with a little bit over one hour delay. So no big costs for them!

Amavro
Posts: 37
Joined: 24 Jan 2017, 20:41

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Amavro » 29 Mar 2018, 23:34

The aircraft is still flying, Lucas. ETA 22:45 local at the moment.

Passenger
Posts: 6578
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Passenger » 30 Mar 2018, 00:12

sn26567 wrote:
29 Mar 2018, 22:09
JVSpotter wrote:
29 Mar 2018, 21:30
Not the most successful first flight. Due to some technical issues (probably with the flaps) and a bagage related issue, it departed with 3 hours delay.
As long as the delay on arrival is less than 3 hours, Air Belgium will avoid paying 600 euros to each of the 300 passengers. It will be a close call! (STA 19:45, ETA 22:49 at this moment)
Yes, but it's not the arrival time that matters, but the time that a first door opens. It seems they won't make that.

So they will have to go for "extraordinary circumstances" - unforeseen techical problems on an aircraft that has just been delivered by its manufacturer.

convair
Posts: 1811
Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by convair » 30 Mar 2018, 00:37

Even though they hired an AB aircraft, Surinam is still the official operator and bears the responsibility of the delay towards the pax imho.

Same as when SN calls for a CS-xxx 767 to fly its pax to Dakar.

Still, I bet the pilot has been ordered to "step on it". :)

Passenger
Posts: 6578
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Passenger » 30 Mar 2018, 01:05

convair wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 00:37
Even though they hired an AB aircraft, Surinam is still the official operator and bears the responsibility of the delay towards the pax imho. Same as when SN calls for a CS-xxx 767 to fly its pax to Dakar.

Still, I bet the pilot has been ordered to "step on it". :)
There is probably a clause in the lease contract, dealing with this indemnity.

But let's be honnest: they should have left Brussels earlier. They arrived at the gate at Amsterdam at 14h28. For a flight that was scheduled for 15h15.

convair
Posts: 1811
Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by convair » 30 Mar 2018, 01:35

Passenger wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 01:05
convair wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 00:37
Even though they hired an AB aircraft, Surinam is still the official operator and bears the responsibility of the delay towards the pax imho. Same as when SN calls for a CS-xxx 767 to fly its pax to Dakar.

Still, I bet the pilot has been ordered to "step on it". :)
There is probably a clause in the lease contract, dealing with this indemnity.

But let's be honnest: they should have left Brussels earlier. They arrived at the gate at Amsterdam at 14h28. For a flight that was scheduled for 15h15.
There might be a penalty for AB to Surinam (although they can argue technical problem) but the (probably much bigger) penalty to the pax should be on Surinam as they are the ones who are supposed to make money on the flight.
And, yes, they should have left BRU earlier.

Now, they could both escape penalties: a few minutes ago, the AB plane crossed a KLM 747 bound to AMS that left Paramaribo just 2 hours ago. Allowing for its lower speed, (920 i.s.o. 1040 km/h) the AB plane should still land at about 22:37 (! ;) ) local (my own best :) guesstimate).

crew1990
Posts: 1066
Joined: 29 Dec 2010, 21:46

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by crew1990 » 30 Mar 2018, 01:49

Passenger wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 01:05
convair wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 00:37
Even though they hired an AB aircraft, Surinam is still the official operator and bears the responsibility of the delay towards the pax imho. Same as when SN calls for a CS-xxx 767 to fly its pax to Dakar.

Still, I bet the pilot has been ordered to "step on it". :)
There is probably a clause in the lease contract, dealing with this indemnity.

But let's be honnest: they should have left Brussels earlier. They arrived at the gate at Amsterdam at 14h28. For a flight that was scheduled for 15h15.
If the positioning flight was earlier then the crew could go over duty in case of delay.

Then it would have been better to position the aircraft the day before meaning a layover for the crew and then extra cost

SR20
Posts: 441
Joined: 17 Apr 2017, 09:14

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by SR20 » 30 Mar 2018, 05:14

Quite interesting procedures to accomodate the Air Belgium A343 in CRL !

A0818/18
From:24 MAR 18 16:00 Till:PERM
Text:CODE E ACFT WITH 4 ENGINES SHALL TAXIING ON TWY NORTH BOTH OUTER ENGINES ON IDLE TO AVOID FOD/STONES INGESTION DUE TO UNPREPARED TWY SHOULDERS

A0824/18
From:24 MAR 18 17:30 Till:PERM
Text:CODE E ACFT WITH 4 ENGINES MAY BE EXCEPTIONALLY ALLOWED ON TWY SOUTH VIA S1 AND S4 UPON PRIOR APPROVAL BY THE AIRPORT AUTHORIRTY, ONLY WITH FOLLOW-ME AND WINGMAN. BOTH OUTER ENGINES ON IDLE TO AVOID FOD/STONES INGESTION DUE TO UNPREPARED TWY SHOULDERS

Other notam's referring to A343 operations are also in force !

Patrick Alems
Posts: 5
Joined: 30 Mar 2018, 07:35

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Patrick Alems » 30 Mar 2018, 07:48

Flightradar24 says 3 hours and 16 minutes late on arrival. Scheduled arrival: 19:45 uur. Actual arrival: 23:01 uur. I have no idea who is gonna pay the pax compensation. Who is responsible? Whats in the contract? Fact is AB arrival on Schiphol was way to late for proper preparations.How can you prepare a aircraft in 45 minutes? I bet Surinam Airways gonna bring that up as an argument.

and 15https://www.dagonline.nl/suriname/air-belgium-m ... aramaribo/

FLYAIR10
Posts: 482
Joined: 08 Sep 2008, 22:05

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by FLYAIR10 » 30 Mar 2018, 09:12

by Patrick Alems » 30 Mar 2018, 07:49
Flightradar24 says 3 hours and 16 minutes late on arrival. Scheduled arrival: 19:45 uur. Actual arrival: 23:01 uur. I have no idea who is gonna pay the pax compensation. Who is responsible? Whats in the contract? Fact is AB arrival on Schiphol was way to late for proper preparations.How can you prepare a aircraft in 45 minutes? I bet Surinam Airways gonna bring that up as an argument.

and 15https://www.dagonline.nl/suriname/air-belgium-m ... aramaribo/
45 minutes is not much for such a plane and a load of approx 250 (?) pax.
Maybe catering was already onboard from Brussels,but they had to refuel for the trip to Paramaribo anyway and embarking also takes some time... Since it was their first commercial flight,maybe they also had to fulfill some extra paperwork/prepayments to obtain the fuel in AMS and catering ...How well was this organized upfront? Same remark for the 'problem with the flap'..who did fix that one?

TLspotting
Posts: 2138
Joined: 19 Mar 2017, 10:22
Location: Uccle/Ukkel,BE
Contact:

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by TLspotting » 30 Mar 2018, 09:23

IMG_20180330_092210.jpg
In L'Echo this morning : Air Belgium will launch flights on April 30 ! (Probably)
I'm Thibault Lapers, spotter in Belgium for now 3 years, but not yet across the world and a huuuuuge aviation geek ! Join me on Facebook & Twitter @TLspotting

Passenger
Posts: 6578
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Passenger » 30 Mar 2018, 10:11

TLspotting wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 09:23
IMG_20180330_092210.jpg
In L'Echo this morning : Air Belgium will launch flights on April 30 ! (Probably)
That loan is probably the one that is shown in their annual account 2016 (though it's 3,5m there, not 3m).
So not a new loan.

Passenger
Posts: 6578
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by Passenger » 30 Mar 2018, 10:26

There is no EU indemnity to be paid.

They arrived within the 261/2004 margin, which is 4 hours for a flight of + 3.500 kms...

Scheduled arrival time: 19h45
Actual arrival time (FR24): 23h01
https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/py993

That gave them 44 minutes to taxi to the gate and to open one door. It's the "door open" time, registered by the captain or by the ground handler, that matters for "arrival time".

TLspotting
Posts: 2138
Joined: 19 Mar 2017, 10:22
Location: Uccle/Ukkel,BE
Contact:

Re: Air Belgium in 2018

Post by TLspotting » 30 Mar 2018, 10:30

Passenger wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 10:11
TLspotting wrote:
30 Mar 2018, 09:23
IMG_20180330_092210.jpg
In L'Echo this morning : Air Belgium will launch flights on April 30 ! (Probably)
That loan is probably the one that is shown in their annual account 2016 (though it's 3,5m there, not 3m).
So not a new loan.
The €3mlns is from CPH bank, so more money for AB... Nothing about the annual account
I'm Thibault Lapers, spotter in Belgium for now 3 years, but not yet across the world and a huuuuuge aviation geek ! Join me on Facebook & Twitter @TLspotting

Post Reply