Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

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Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Passenger »

There is a much cheaper solution: Alexander De Croo (junior) invites the Ambassador of Congo (and partner) to a dinner in the Comme Chez Soi. Alexander De Croo then tells the Ambassador that he apologizes for his statement that Belgium demands more results from its cooperation aid. De Croo explains that he only wanted to say that improvement is possible with new technology like solar power and robotics. And De Croo asks that the Ambassador transmits his apologies to Kabila. The next day, the traffic rights are reinstalled.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:03 There is a much cheaper solution: Alexander De Croo (junior) invites the Ambassador of Congo (and partner) to a dinner in the Comme Chez Soi. Alexander De Croo then tells the Ambassador that he apologizes for his statement that Belgium demands more results from its cooperation aid. De Croo explains that he only wanted to say that improvement is possible with new technology like solar power and robotics. And De Croo asks that the Ambassador transmits his apologies to Kabila. The next day, the traffic rights are reinstalled.
It's more complicated than that,Kabila is a bloody dictator killing and plundering the country....
Last edited by lumumba on 18 Feb 2018, 13:17, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:03 There is a much cheaper solution: Alexander De Croo (junior) invites the Ambassador of Congo (and partner) to a dinner in the Comme Chez Soi. Alexander De Croo then tells the Ambassador that he apologizes for his statement that Belgium demands more results from its cooperation aid. De Croo explains that he only wanted to say that improvement is possible with new technology like solar power and robotics. And De Croo asks that the Ambassador transmits his apologies to Kabila. The next day, the traffic rights are reinstalled.
Cheap solution indeed!!!

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Passenger »

lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:52
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:03 There is a much cheaper solution: Alexander De Croo (junior) invites the Ambassador of Congo (and partner) to a dinner in the Comme Chez Soi. Alexander De Croo then tells the Ambassador that he apologizes for his statement that Belgium demands more results from its cooperation aid. De Croo explains that he only wanted to say that improvement is possible with new technology like solar power and robotics. And De Croo asks that the Ambassador transmits his apologies to Kabila. The next day, the traffic rights are reinstalled.
It's more complicated than that,Kabila is...
No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.

Brussels Airlines won't get it landing rights back before De Croo apologizes.

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24 No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel
It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
I would hope thar in 2018 these times were gone.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24
lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:52
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:03 There is a much cheaper solution: Alexander De Croo (junior) invites the Ambassador of Congo (and partner) to a dinner in the Comme Chez Soi. Alexander De Croo then tells the Ambassador that he apologizes for his statement that Belgium demands more results from its cooperation aid. De Croo explains that he only wanted to say that improvement is possible with new technology like solar power and robotics. And De Croo asks that the Ambassador transmits his apologies to Kabila. The next day, the traffic rights are reinstalled.
It's more complicated than that,Kabila is...
No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.

Brussels Airlines won't get it landing rights back before De Croo apologizes.
I'm not sure you now what you are speaking about that's why I apologise you and will not react on this one....

Just to let you now I grew up in Zaire and I now the situation there.
And Belgium had no choice to do what they did they had to do it even before, the geopolitical problem here is that the EU is not reacting for the moment.

But please Passengers don't say stupid things when you speak about human beings and living....
Hasta la victoria siempre.

convair
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Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

Post by convair »

lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:50
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24
lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 12:52

It's more complicated than that,Kabila is...
No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.

Brussels Airlines won't get it landing rights back before De Croo apologizes.
I'm not sure you now what you are speaking about that's why I apologise you and will not react on this one....

Just to let you now I grew up in Zaire and I now the situation there.
And Belgium had no choice to do what they did they had to do it even before, the geopolitical problem here is that the EU is not reacting for the moment.

But please Passengers don't say stupid things when you speak about human beings and living....
I agree with you. Unfortunately every reaction to Kabila finally falls down to his people. :( :x

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Passenger »

Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24 No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.
It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
I would hope thar in 2018 these times were gone.
OK, let's preveal human rights above aviation company profits. And without hypocrisy of course. Let us forbit all flights to/from China and to/from Cuba until these dictatorships apply multi-party elections. Let us forbit all flights to/from Middle East countries were basic human rights don't apply for women.

This topic is about Brussels Airlines, and their problems with the Kinshasa route. I'm willing to discuss human rights, but then in the Aviation Pub forum here. Very on topic here is that Brussels Airlines will only get the FIH frequencies back when Alexander De Croo acts (example: with a press statement like "apparently I was misunderstood").

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

convair wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:21
lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:50
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24
No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.

Brussels Airlines won't get it landing rights back before De Croo apologizes.
I'm not sure you now what you are speaking about that's why I apologise you and will not react on this one....

Just to let you now I grew up in Zaire and I now the situation there.
And Belgium had no choice to do what they did they had to do it even before, the geopolitical problem here is that the EU is not reacting for the moment.

But please Passengers don't say stupid things when you speak about human beings and living....
I agree with you. Unfortunately every reaction to Kabila finally falls down to his people. :( :x
A dark period will unfortunately come for Congo but there is no other solution.
The Congolese will have to take the power back,he will never leave peacefully.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:27
Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24 No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.
It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
I would hope thar in 2018 these times were gone.
OK, let's preveal human rights above aviation company profits. And without hypocrisy of course. Let us forbit all flights to/from China and to/from Cuba until these dictatorships apply multi-party elections. Let us forbit all flights to/from Middle East countries were basic human rights don't apply for women.

This topic is about Brussels Airlines, and their problems with the Kinshasa route. I'm willing to discuss human rights, but then in the Aviation Pub forum here. Very on topic here is that Brussels Airlines will only get the FIH frequencies back when Alexander De Croo acts (example: with a press statement like "apparently I was misunderstood").
But you can not compare Congo with China.....Congo has a special historical and economic history with Belgium.
That's why we are involved in this country not so long even or army was based in Congo.
Belgium is the first country to invest there with private companies and humanitarian etc...
Belgium was optimistic in the beginning with Kabila and offered a lot of help like I said before even with an army base etc....
But when you are involved you pay the price when the counter part is a bloody dictator at the end.
We are not involved in China!!!!!!

For the same reason Brussels Airlines was the only company to have the right to fly daily.
Last edited by lumumba on 18 Feb 2018, 14:49, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:27
Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41
Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:24 No, it is not more complicated than that. De Croo, federal minister of Development, caused the problems, so he has to solve it. The problems started few weeks ago, when De Croo announced that he terminates the Cooperation Belge = the official funding channel. Actually, those are people on the field doing a good job there. Kabila reacted with a number of counter measures: first the closure of Maison Schengen in Kinshasa, then the Belgian consulate in Lubumbashi, then the Congolese consulate in Antwerp. And because De Croo remained silent and still refused to apologize, Kabila added the landing rights issue.
It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
I would hope thar in 2018 these times were gone.
OK, let's preveal human rights above aviation company profits. And without hypocrisy of course. Let us forbit all flights to/from China and to/from Cuba until these dictatorships apply multi-party elections. Let us forbit all flights to/from Middle East countries were basic human rights don't apply for women.

This topic is about Brussels Airlines, and their problems with the Kinshasa route. I'm willing to discuss human rights, but then in the Aviation Pub forum here. Very on topic here is that Brussels Airlines will only get the FIH frequencies back when Alexander De Croo acts (example: with a press statement like "apparently I was misunderstood").
Please, don’t read things I didn’t write!
The only thing I wrote was that Mr De Croo should put human rights above profit of a private company and not give in to this blackmail.
SN has 4 weekly flights and can keep them, but we are 2018 and not 1950, so let Mr De Croo say what he has say and what he should have said a long time ago!

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sn26567 »

lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:37 Congo has a special historical and economic history with Belgium.
That's why we are involved in this country not so long even or army was based in Congo.
Belgium is the first country to invest there with private companies and humanitarian etc...
Belgium was optimistic in the beginning with Kabila and offered a lot of help like I said before even with an army base etc....
But when you are involved you pay the price when the counter part is a bloody dictator at the end.
We are not involved in China!!!!!!
Belgium WAS involved in D R Congo, but has since long been overtaken by China, France and Spain who are less cautious with human rights. When Belgium was insisting on new presidential elections, France and Spain looked in another direction: they refused to let the EU take sanctions against Kabila because Total wants to extract oil in the Congo and Spain is building electrical power stations there.

And Kabila did not reduce the number of flights of Air France "by lack of reciprocity", the official excuse used for SN.

When the economy is more important than human rights...
André
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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

sn26567 wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:52
lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 14:37 Congo has a special historical and economic history with Belgium.
That's why we are involved in this country not so long even or army was based in Congo.
Belgium is the first country to invest there with private companies and humanitarian etc...
Belgium was optimistic in the beginning with Kabila and offered a lot of help like I said before even with an army base etc....
But when you are involved you pay the price when the counter part is a bloody dictator at the end.
We are not involved in China!!!!!!
Belgium WAS involved in D R Congo, but has since long been overtaken by China, France and Spain who are less cautious with human rights. When Belgium was insisting on new presidential elections, France and Spain looked in another direction: they refused to let the EU take sanctions against Kabila because Total wants to extract oil in the Congo and Spain is building electrical power stations there.

When the economy is more important than human rights...
You are right about France and Spain I expressed it myself in my post.....
But Belgium is still very involved in Congo Chinese are far from taking over they had big contracts for big projects but on the field it's still a lot of or compatriots working because you need a lot of experience for that and we have it.
Put a Chinese in Tshikapa he will not survive 1 week!!!!!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Passenger »

Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41 It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
You have linked "human rights" to aviation - in this case for an issue about traffic rights Congo-Belgium. Apart from Congo, there are a lot of other countries where human rights are not respected. Examples: China and Cuba. But Decroo is silent and he doesn't insist on free and fair elections over there. Why not? Exactly for the reason you reject: business interests.

It was a stupid decision from Decroo to critisize human rights in Congo. Everybody already knows Kabila doesn't respect them. So Decroo should have left coments for the European Commission: the High Commissioner (an Italian lady) or the EU-Commissioner for Development (a Croatian guy). Kabila then probably would also have closed the Schengen House, but he probably wouldn't have sanctionned Brussels Airlines.

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 16:14
Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41 It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
You have linked "human rights" to aviation - in this case for an issue about traffic rights Congo-Belgium. Apart from Congo, there are a lot of other countries where human rights are not respected. Examples: China and Cuba. But Decroo is silent and he doesn't insist on free and fair elections over there. Why not? Exactly for the reason you reject: business interests.

It was a stupid decision from Decroo to critisize human rights in Congo. Everybody already knows Kabila doesn't respect them. So Decroo should have left coments for the European Commission: the High Commissioner (an Italian lady) or the EU-Commissioner for Development (a Croatian guy). Kabila then probably would also have closed the Schengen House, but he probably wouldn't have sanctionned Brussels Airlines.
But he criticized that's correct but the biggest problem is that he changed the way Belgium finance the humanitarian programmes.
And he could not leave it like it was it was corrupted by the Congolese government.
And now we finance directly....and that was the good thing to do .
I all started when they make it difficult for Belgium to repatriated or military equipment from Congo.
I mean like I said before Belgium is involved and for the same reason Brussels Airlines could fly daily.
But today for the same reason Belgium could not not react but you have to look to the complete story.
Stop looking self centered to Brussels Airlines Congolese people are dying everyday ...
Last edited by lumumba on 18 Feb 2018, 19:17, edited 2 times in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 16:14
Poiu wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 13:41 It is more complicated, do you really wan’t to put the profit of a private company above human rights?
You have linked "human rights" to aviation - in this case for an issue about traffic rights Congo-Belgium. Apart from Congo, there are a lot of other countries where human rights are not respected. Examples: China and Cuba. But Decroo is silent and he doesn't insist on free and fair elections over there. Why not? Exactly for the reason you reject: business interests.
Strange logic, to say the least.
Every day thousands of people drive whilst being way over the alcohol limit without being tested nor punished, so we should abolish testing for everyone? It would increase the profit of ABINBEV and their share price needs some good news...
A women was abused once and didn’t speak up, when she’s abused again and she goes to the police, you tell her to shut up?
Once again: we are in the 21st century not the 1950s!

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Re: Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

Post by Homo Aeroportus »

According to the magazine Jeune Afrique of this week the origin of the last eruption came from

(free translation)

The adoption of these new sanctions (Closing the consulates, reduction of SN flights) comes after a heated in camera meeting of the Political Committee of the Assemblée parlementaire de la francophonie (APF), February 2, in Paris.
Belgian MP Jean-Charles Luperto read a four-page "plea" (an "anti-Kabila pamphlet", according to a member of the Congolese delegation) in which he advocates taking "measures against the DRC " further to the “disintegration of the State of law".

This is what would have caused Kinshasa going ape.
Whatever this “pamphlet” really contained it was not a smart move, coming after the January escalation.
Anyhow, too late to cry on the spilled milk.
I guess it is also too late to call back “Kabilou” now that he retired, officially, from political life but I’m afraid we are still way too early to gamble of a change of management in Kinshasa after the elections supposed to be held on 23 december (2018…).

H.A.

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Re: Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

Post by lumumba »

Homo Aeroportus wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 20:35 According to the magazine Jeune Afrique of this week the origin of the last eruption came from

(free translation)

The adoption of these new sanctions (Closing the consulates, reduction of SN flights) comes after a heated in camera meeting of the Political Committee of the Assemblée parlementaire de la francophonie (APF), February 2, in Paris.
Belgian MP Jean-Charles Luperto read a four-page "plea" (an "anti-Kabila pamphlet", according to a member of the Congolese delegation) in which he advocates taking "measures against the DRC " further to the “disintegration of the State of law".

This is what would have caused Kinshasa going ape.
Whatever this “pamphlet” really contained it was not a smart move, coming after the January escalation.
Anyhow, too late to cry on the spilled milk.
I guess it is also too late to call back “Kabilou” now that he retired, officially, from political life but I’m afraid we are still way too early to gamble of a change of management in Kinshasa after the elections supposed to be held on 23 december (2018…).

H.A.
That's just an excuse it was already very hot but they just use this last one ...And it's even not complete true because it started before Paris....
Don't look for somebody's responsibility what's happening in RDC is bad very bad....
I don't understand that people don't feel nothing about,you can not continue to work with them like nothing happens.
Sometimes we criticized politics because they do nothing now they moving and taking there responsibility and we blame them it's very sad...
Don't forget children and all families where killed not so long in the Kasai and you guys want to continue to give blind money....
How can you sleep.....
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Passenger
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Re: Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

Post by Passenger »

lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 20:57 That's just an excuse it was already very hot but they just use this last one ...And it's even not complete true because it started before Paris....
Don't look for somebody's responsibility what's happening in RDC is bad very bad....
I don't understand that people don't feel nothing about,you can not continue to work with them like nothing happens.
Sometimes we criticized politics because they do nothing now they moving and taking there responsibility and we blame them it's very sad...
Don't forget children and all families where killed not so long in the Kasai and you guys want to continue to give blind money....
How can you sleep.....
And that justifies that Kabila sanctions Brussels Airlines?

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines loses three of its 7 weekly frequencies to Kinshasa

Post by lumumba »

Passenger wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 21:17
lumumba wrote: 18 Feb 2018, 20:57 That's just an excuse it was already very hot but they just use this last one ...And it's even not complete true because it started before Paris....
Don't look for somebody's responsibility what's happening in RDC is bad very bad....
I don't understand that people don't feel nothing about,you can not continue to work with them like nothing happens.
Sometimes we criticized politics because they do nothing now they moving and taking there responsibility and we blame them it's very sad...
Don't forget children and all families where killed not so long in the Kasai and you guys want to continue to give blind money....
How can you sleep.....
And that justifies that Kabila sanctions Brussels Airlines?
I imagine he wants to hurt so he does where he can....
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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