Brussels Airlines in 2018

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba » 11 Feb 2018, 12:20

nordikcam wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 11:59
lumumba wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 11:47
nordikcam wrote:
10 Feb 2018, 11:35
Tomorrow flight SN 1359 will fly Brazzaville Maya Maya and Luanda...
This flight was cancelled today!!!!!!!!
Flight SN1359 is flying !!
Ha ok my apologies.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Boavida
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Boavida » 11 Feb 2018, 12:29

sn26567 wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 10:25
brusselsairlinesfan wrote: And why did they chose Brussels Airlines instead of Belgian Airlines at that time ?
Belgian politics! Some people in the North of the country dislike anything that carries the name "Belgian". That's also why the TV broadcaster BRT changed its name to VRT for example.
Talking about politics... Let's not forget that the 'south' blocked the combination KLM-Sabena because it was 'too Dutch-speaking'... If KLM-Sabena existed today we wouldn't have all this troubles in the first place...

LT3
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by LT3 » 11 Feb 2018, 13:02

Why not create a W schedule between a city and both long haul hub DUS and BRU
Ex
DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS MIA DUS 4 weekly from DUS and 3 for BRU
You can repeat that for others city , with a 24 hours rotation

crew1990
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by crew1990 » 11 Feb 2018, 13:08

This is the problem when we have a country with two main languages (yeah yeah I know German as well) and with two culture witch both have good and bad thing as any culture in the word. Let's make it an asset instead of being always negative.

We should keep our energy to fight for our country, our economy, our industry and thing as one unit. Instead of keeping a selfish way of thinking and criticising each other all the time. Being half Flemish, half Walloon, I can tell you it's sometimes really annoying.

By the way, how can you say that the KLM scenario would have been different from the Swiss one? Nobody knows, of course we are not happy of what happened with Swissair but how can you tell it would have been different with KLM. May I just remind you a small peace of our history with Guillaume d'Orange?

If we want a strong home carrier, we have to fight for it, as Belgian. There is truly a potential in Belgium, we have a very high population density, meaning a very nice catchment area, we are in the middle of the main economic business center of Europe, London, Paris, Amsterdam and Frankfurt. We have plenty of international institution, NATO, European Commission, etc. We have some very important seaport, Antwerp being number 2 in Europe and number 17 in the world, the diamond sector, we have excellent university, we excel in medical research... In aviation we have some good airport growing quickly, we are even now building airplanes (Sonaca 200)! There are so much thing we can be proud of! Don't tell me an airline cannot be a stand alone one.

What we need is a Belgian pride and devotion for our national industry! At least this is my point of you. And all this start with a good education when you are really young!
Last edited by crew1990 on 11 Feb 2018, 13:16, edited 2 times in total.

convair
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by convair » 11 Feb 2018, 13:08

Boavida wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 12:29
sn26567 wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 10:25
brusselsairlinesfan wrote: And why did they chose Brussels Airlines instead of Belgian Airlines at that time ?
Belgian politics! Some people in the North of the country dislike anything that carries the name "Belgian". That's also why the TV broadcaster BRT changed its name to VRT for example.
Talking about politics... Let's not forget that the 'south' blocked the combination KLM-Sabena because it was 'too Dutch-speaking'... If KLM-Sabena existed today we wouldn't have all this troubles in the first place...
[Out of topic, sorry:
Maybe true...However, I don't think there is (was?) that much love between the "north" and NL.]

Boavida
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Boavida » 11 Feb 2018, 14:33

@ crew1990: I completely agree.

About the name 'belgianwings': I don't believe in this. It sounds as cheap as eurowings and there's too little difference between the 2 names to make it work. If they really want to have a sort of reference to eurowings, you can do it in the baseline of the new brandname.

For example:

Sabena - Wings of Belgium

Just like Qantas - Spirit of Australia

Image

ps: I'm really pleased that even Davignon recognises that Sabena is a more known brandname. I hope this is taken seriously.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sn26567 » 11 Feb 2018, 14:36

LT3 wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 12:00
A solution to create Maybe moreLong haut from Bru , it’s share the schedule between DUS an d BRU.
Ex: a new link between Bru and MIA
4 weekly from DUS and 3 weekly from BRU
DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS MIA DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS MIA BRU MIA DUS....why NOT?
This solution can help everybody , eadjusted also between 4/3, 5/2, 3/4....
A new challenge between TUI and SN, and to Many others destinations possibles with a 24 h retire off course.
Welcome to Aviation24.be, LT3. Good idea indeed, but the decision will be taken in Dusseldorf, and you may guess in which direction the balance will fall...

Sorry you had to repeat your message twice. New members need their first post to be approved in order to avoid spam.
André
ex Sabena #26567

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travellover
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by travellover » 11 Feb 2018, 14:48

So every one has his own sensibility about our so called flag carrier and its predecessor.
One can say objectively that in 2001/2002 the main concerns were the same than today, about the economy, jobs, and to keep the connectivity of the whole Belgium with Europe and Africa. Much more important than political reasons. Wasn't the choice of the name "SN brussels airlines" itself due to the relatively limited financial means.

Myself originally as a mix of the three regions of Belgium (and even the eastern part), I feel respectful and looking for any constructive dialogue at any time - if it is possible - in Belgium and all over the world.

An airline like SN needs pragmatism to develop itself more and more in the direction of a strong and valuable player.
What is still the use in 2018 to incriminate each part of the country of being a brake while the general interest is to advance. The swiss context and history isn't exactly the same than the belgian but they succeed manage to transcend their language differences in many fields.
So, in this beginning of the year 2018, LH/EW officially has announced (after a psychodrama in the medias) that SN will develop itself in a larger group called EW. Seeking for synergies and enhancing the EW long haul product with SN know how.
The germans will keep developping SN in BRU with its african network. Reasons can be the importance of the BRU catchment area, the high yields and leisure markets, not to leave the market to AF/KL, IAG...
As read precedently in this forum, the germans are aware that the belgian anchor is a sensitive question in Belgium.

Good luck to the future "brussels airlines". The politics are not the key players anymore and its better so.
(For other reasons India is thinking about privatizing AI).
SN is not condemned by the fate to become definitively a kind of low cost airline. And beyond that for Belgium BRU can continue to keep growing as a premium passenger hub. And there is many vitality in the "regional" airports.
Cheers

Sai
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Sai » 11 Feb 2018, 15:16

brusselsairlinesfan wrote:
10 Feb 2018, 23:31
Finally, my bet on belgianwings !!!
Wouldn't that go against the vision of 'integration into EW'?
Germanwings as a name also dissapeared in favor of Eurowings.
Germanwings actually still exists and wet-lease aircraft for EW, but as "Eurowings operated by Germanwings"
I'm afraid the Belgian touch could be limited to a Belgian AOC and OO- registered aircraft and "operated by Brussels Airlines".
In regard to the African long-haul and its bilateral agreements it would still be possible to respect these agreements.

Those in favor of SABENA, because it would still be a recognised and respected brand in certain parts of Africa... It seems to me this is a kind of nostalgic, neo-colonial vision.
As if Africans aren't yet living in 21st century and don't know better. There's a huge potential of a growing lower middle class that will be traveling and booking and comparing tickets on the internet (café) or via small travel agencies. They will choose the cheapest ticket and won't mind if it's Etihad, Turkish Airlines, EW or SN. The upper class will still prefer a Business Class, lounges and all the bling-bling, all that could still be offered by EW. Regardless of the reasons marketing-wise why not to use an old brand that went bankrupt as stated by others.
Just an opinion...

nordikcam
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by nordikcam » 11 Feb 2018, 17:02

Sai wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 15:16

Those in favor of SABENA, because it would still be a recognised and respected brand in certain parts of Africa... It seems to me this is a kind of nostalgic, neo-colonial vision.
We may wish for the return of the emblematic Sabena name of an era, by nostalgia that's true, but without being accused or having a neo-colonialist vision of Africa and Africans...

Klausenburg
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Klausenburg » 11 Feb 2018, 17:33

Sai wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 15:16


Those in favor of SABENA, because it would still be a recognised and respected brand in certain parts of Africa... It seems to me this is a kind of nostalgic, neo-colonial vision.
As if Africans aren't yet living in 21st century and don't know better.
Yes, we all know that Sabena name is racist and white-supremacist.

However, I see you're a bit behind. Drinking milk is now deemed a racist and white-supremacist thing. No worries, I will help you to be always updated with the last things, habits, and anything else that is deemed racist and white-supremacist.

And last, but not least, before making any appreciation regarding what should Africans feel about Sabena name, check your white privilege ;).

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travellover
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by travellover » 11 Feb 2018, 18:18

It's very puzzling to read that the name of sabena sounds neo-colonialist, racist etc.
I don't think at all that most african passengers, tour operators, hotels, taxis etc. today or even 20 and more years ago see sabena /brussels airlines as a neo-colonialist brand, but as an airline that was and always is implicated to them, due also to the mostly friendly and professional cabin and flying crew. Which also involve african staff aboard and on the ground. They all know how to deal with the african markets and customers for a while. Otherwise SN wouldn't be there anymore.
brussels airlines, belgianwings, sabena or another designation. The important is to get a catchy name ;)
Last edited by travellover on 11 Feb 2018, 19:35, edited 8 times in total.
Cheers

Klausenburg
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Klausenburg » 11 Feb 2018, 19:03

Let's not forget from where is started: Sabena si better known and respected in Africa then other brands... How couldn't be "more respected" if it would felt "oppressively neo-colonialist? It would imply that Africans are unable to decide with their mind what they respect and what not. And the marketing shouldn't cater to their wishes, demands and what they like.

Therefore @Sai has just plainly implied that Africans:
- are unable to think logically
- European companies should't shouldn't appeal to them anyway
- they should just ignore their preferences and start liking everything decided at HQ-s in Europe ("they should know better")

Sai
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Sai » 11 Feb 2018, 20:19

C'mon...seriously...I'm very sorry to see some are offended. I have the feeling my post is purposefully misinterpreted.
I never said or even implied SABENA is a racist name...??
Neo-colonialism is not the same as racist, some start talking about white supremacy :roll: , etc...I never said any of that. It's a wrong conlusion.

This is a forum where people exchange idea's, share opinions or expertise and where you should always question your own opinion and have an open mind for others and should have the courage to rethink...
Unfortunately sometimes it seems for some rather an emotional struggle or 'a battle' as if they are the protectors of the only 'truth' and that's a pity...because that silences a healthy debate...

I can understand SABENA is something emotional for some but no need to exaggerate or pull my words out of context
Thanks

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba » 11 Feb 2018, 21:10

Let's keep Brussels Airlines...basta!!!!
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Klausenburg
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Klausenburg » 11 Feb 2018, 21:47

@Sia, I apologize for having maybe an exaggerated reaction. However, branding is a sensible issue and has to be carefully handled. BTW, I found this (and it has no link to Africa, but to my country):

Image
lumumba wrote:
Let's keep Brussels Airlines...basta!!!!
At the moment, I believe this would be the best choice. However, as the name of the company is in the hands of the people who thought Eurowings is a good name for a company, I don't have high hopes. Really, how imaginative have one to be in order to come with something so lame as "Eurowings" ???

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by RoMax » 11 Feb 2018, 22:06

Klausenburg wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 21:47
At the moment, I believe this would be the best choice. However, as the name of the company is in the hands of the people who thought Eurowings is a good name for a company, I don't have high hopes. Really, how imaginative have one to be in order to come with something so lame as "Eurowings" ???
Let's not over-exaggerate here either... No Eurowings is not a sparkling and global name, but it's clear and simple: European and an airline.

Btw, it might be interesting for some to look at the history of Eurowings and Germanwings in Germany (which after all is the home market on which it's all based). Eurowings already exists since the early 1990's as a regional airline operating under the Eurowings name (mainly regional aircraft like the ATR and later BAe/Avro, but also Airbus aircraft). They launched a LCC unit in 1997 which became a seperate company in 2002 under the brand of Germanwings. At that time Eurowings was an independent company operating under the Eurowings name/brand and with Germanwings as a LCC daughter fully owned by Eurowings.
Lufthansa entered the story of Eurowings in 2001 when they took an initial minority share in the company, which was gradually expanded to a majority share and eventually full ownership. The flipping point came in 2006 when LH expanded its share to (slightly) beyond 50% and Eurowings started operating under the Lufthansa Regional brand (but it always remained Lufthansa Regional operated by Eurowings - Lufthansa Regional was a virtual carrier). Lufthansa took over Germanwings from Eurowings in 2008 and developed it further as their own LCC and a full take-over of Eurowings itself followed in 2011. EW remained under the Lufthansa Regional brand until 2014 when the switch was made to the new strategy of redeveloping Eurowings.

Just to summarize, Eurowings wasn't founded by Lufthansa and even Germanwings was a Eurowings project before Lufthansa took the lead several years later. Both Eurowings and Germanwings developed into well known and respected brands in Germany before Lufthansa took full control of them and LH didn't do much more than using the old basis to launch a new pillar of their group strategy. The choice to fully go for Eurowings was caused by the Germanwings 'crash' some years ago. Until that point the whole concept was based on the common "Wings" name/element and not necessarily focused on 1 single brand/name. Even the Eurowings logo and company colors still resemble in a subtle way to the old Eurowings brand and logo. So indeed not much creativity there, but they have built it on names which were already very well known by the German market.

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lumumba
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by lumumba » 11 Feb 2018, 22:14

Klausenburg wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 21:47
@Sia, I apologize for having maybe an exaggerated reaction. However, branding is a sensible issue and has to be carefully handled. BTW, I found this (and it has no link to Africa, but to my country):

Image
lumumba wrote:
Let's keep Brussels Airlines...basta!!!!
At the moment, I believe this would be the best choice. However, as the name of the company is in the hands of the people who thought Eurowings is a good name for a company, I don't have high hopes. Really, how imaginative have one to be in order to come with something so lame as "Eurowings" ???
I like this poster do you have it?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sn26567 » 11 Feb 2018, 22:53

RoMax wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 22:06
Btw, it might be interesting for some to look at the history of Eurowings and Germanwings in Germany (which after all is the home market on which it's all based). Eurowings already exists since the early 1990's as a regional airline operating under the Eurowings name (mainly regional aircraft like the ATR and later BAe/Avro, but also Airbus aircraft).
Thanks for this historic reminder, RoMax.

Wasn't the initial name Nürnberger Flugdienst, later abbreviated into NFD? I fondly remember flying with them in what I believe was one of the first ATR aircraft: NFD served a small characteristic round bottle of their excellent regional wine to every customer on board! That was the time when flying was still a memorable experience...
André
ex Sabena #26567

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RoMax
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by RoMax » 11 Feb 2018, 22:56

sn26567 wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 22:53
RoMax wrote:
11 Feb 2018, 22:06
Btw, it might be interesting for some to look at the history of Eurowings and Germanwings in Germany (which after all is the home market on which it's all based). Eurowings already exists since the early 1990's as a regional airline operating under the Eurowings name (mainly regional aircraft like the ATR and later BAe/Avro, but also Airbus aircraft).
Thanks for this historic reminder, RoMax.

Wasn't the initial name Nürnberger Flugdienst, later abbreviated into NFD? I fondly remember flying with them in what I believe was one of the first ATR aircraft: NFD served a small characteristic round bottle of their excellent regional wine to every customer on board! That was the time when flying was still a memorable experience...
Eurowings was founded by the merger of 2 small airlines, but forgive me for not knowing these names myself, would have to look it up first ;)

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