Reopening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

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sean1982
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by sean1982 » 30 Mar 2016, 20:09

Very true. And sometimes I still fall into that trap as well. When I got the email on tuesday 22/03 from FR saying: tomorrow full operation out of CRL my first reaction was: impossible. Answer from Ireland was: impossible or not, it will be done. That's the attitude other countries have.

Flanker2
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Flanker2 » 30 Mar 2016, 20:33

Adding to Flymd11, Sean, to Bralo20: pax don't care about regulations, laws, BRU being 25% owned by the Belgian State, etc... There really aren't that many rules governing over how a check-in area should be managed and as anything at and after the connector is intact...

Like I said, if managing it at a BRU level is a problem, airlines need to start to do damage control TODAY, at their own initiative and with (financial) support from BRU in any form, ie discount on fees, making empty facilities available, etc...

I think that this project is one of a massive scale and it should thus be treated as such.
I don't think that SN is in peril yet, but over 1 week has passed and noting has happened. Even if they restart tomorrow, the prospects for them don't look too rosy for the next several months. But give it 3 more weeks of this and the prospects of the next several months will be the least of their concerns.

Many airlines have already given up on restarting BRU ops within the next week.


Fyi, aanbesteding is generally called a request for tender, RFT.

Jetter
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Jetter » 30 Mar 2016, 20:39

Bralo20 wrote:It is indeed more than a week ago those tragic events happened, from those 8 days 4 of those were used by forensics to collect evidence.
Was the space now used for the temporary check-in used by forensics? BRU shouldn't think what can't be done, but what CAN be done.
And lets not forget all the red tape that can appear with the biggest issue being the government is 25% owner of BRU so there is still a chance that the contract has to be publicized (Aanbesteding, I think it's equivalent in English is a RFP, a request for proposal), maybe even on EU level which means that there will be an additional delay of at least a few weeks, probably even months if it is decided that they can't just order any contractor they want (downside of being partly government owned).
There are very clear exemptions for urgent matters, this definitely qualifies so that won't be needed.

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RoMax
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by RoMax » 30 Mar 2016, 20:51

People at BAC have been working day and night since last week Tuesday. Plans for the temporary check-in were established very fast with the first works for the tents starting on Thursday. But they couldn't finalise the scenarios until very much into the weekend as BAC couldn't get the needed confirmations from the authorities about which buildings would be released (and I'm not talking about being released by the forensics, but being released for commercial operations). It was not until late Saterday that they could inspect the most critical parts of the buildings and testing the structural integrity of for example the baggage reclaim area (in the meantime they continued with the building 5 scenario). They had to plan a huge trial with 800 'passengers' and hundreds of employees working/observing in a matter of days. The trial showed it works, some additional things needed to be done but nothing huge. Except for the pre-check by fedpol, they are the huge bottleneck and BAC can't solve that for them, that's beyond their responsibility and their power.

Pretending as if they didn't do anything for days, I'm simply disgusted. Despite these extremely difficult circumstances these people have worked extremely hard and working extremely long days, day and night.

Go on living in your ideal dream world, but reality is a lot harsher and much more difficult than you might think.

flymd11
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by flymd11 » 30 Mar 2016, 21:11

I am not saying the problem is with the BAC and its staff. A lot more should have been done at a political level to get the ball rolling quicker.

I for example have not heard of a Task Force on the re-opening of the airport.

flightlover
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by flightlover » 30 Mar 2016, 21:26

RoMax wrote:People at BAC have been working day and night since last week Tuesday. Plans for the temporary check-in were established very fast with the first works for the tents starting on Thursday. But they couldn't finalise the scenarios until very much into the weekend as BAC couldn't get the needed confirmations from the authorities about which buildings would be released (and I'm not talking about being released by the forensics, but being released for commercial operations). It was not until late Saterday that they could inspect the most critical parts of the buildings and testing the structural integrity of for example the baggage reclaim area (in the meantime they continued with the building 5 scenario). They had to plan a huge trial with 800 'passengers' and hundreds of employees working/observing in a matter of days. The trial showed it works, some additional things needed to be done but nothing huge. Except for the pre-check by fedpol, they are the huge bottleneck and BAC can't solve that for them, that's beyond their responsibility and their power.

Pretending as if they didn't do anything for days, I'm simply disgusted. Despite these extremely difficult circumstances these people have worked extremely hard and working extremely long days, day and night.

Go on living in your ideal dream world, but reality is a lot harsher and much more difficult than you might think.
I'll second that RoMax, but for non participants in the test or other people closely involved it seems not much is happening. They don't really care about ICAO and other international regulations about airport safety and security. The only time they think about that is when they are victim to an event that could not have happened if all regulations where met.

It's not as if there is an 'emergency terminal package', ready to be deployed. And even if there would be, all certifications will take some time to be obtained.

On the other hand, BRU is going to be best prepared for any similar event. I just hope they will never ever have to use that experience again though.

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Tompompier
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Tompompier » 30 Mar 2016, 21:59

never mind....

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sn26567
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by sn26567 » 30 Mar 2016, 22:38

From the last news release of Brussels Airport, it appears that the conclusions of yesterday's tests could be drawn by noon tomorrow. And Bernard Gustin has said that after receiving the authorisation to start, Brussels Airlines could do so in half a day. That's what I call a fast reaction: the planes coming back from abroad tomorrow evening could already fly to BRU instead of ANR or LGG and be ready to fly from BRU Friday morning.

But BRU doesn't want to reopen if there is not a possibility to handle 800 pax/hr, and the roadblock seems to be the authorisation from the police, or rather the difficulty that the police has to control that number of people BEFORE they get into the provisional check-in area.

Oh, and by the way, the reopening of metro station Maelbeek is even further away...
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Acid-drop
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Acid-drop » 30 Mar 2016, 23:05

Tompompier, please share your view and if its hard its hard. Its a forum to discuss, if everybody agrees, its boring.
My messages reflect my personal opinion which may be different than yours. I beleive a forum is made to create a debate so I encourage people to express themselves, the way they want, with the ideas they want. I expect the same understanding in return.

flymd11
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by flymd11 » 30 Mar 2016, 23:23

sn26567 wrote: Oh, and by the way, the reopening of metro station Maelbeek is even further away...
It would first be nice to get the metro opening hours back to normal, and the service itself not skipping every second station.

sean1982
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by sean1982 » 30 Mar 2016, 23:32

sn26567 wrote:
Oh, and by the way, the reopening of metro station Maelbeek is even further away...
Cause the whole station and track is destroyed. Its like the whole airport building and runways in comparison

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Conti764
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Conti764 » 31 Mar 2016, 00:15

sean1982 wrote:
sn26567 wrote:
Oh, and by the way, the reopening of metro station Maelbeek is even further away...
Cause the whole station and track is destroyed. Its like the whole airport building and runways in comparison
The track isn't, because metrocars are passing Maalbeek.

koja78
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by koja78 » 31 Mar 2016, 08:53

Seems there was a second possible bomber for the metro... which is still at large.
So together with the dude with the white hat... we have two possible looneys at large.. of which one still might have his paradise-device.
Last edited by koja78 on 31 Mar 2016, 09:22, edited 1 time in total.

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euroflyer
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by euroflyer » 31 Mar 2016, 09:12

guys, of course it would be great to have the airport open again, and yes, I have flights to/from BRU scheduled next week Tuesday and would love to know asap if they will take place or not, but I think we need to be realistic here ... everybody who has seen only a few pictures of the terminal after the attacks will soon understand, given the complexity of modern buildings and technics, that air condition, electricity, heating, water supply, waste water management, fire control management, not to mention the IT systems, will need to be completely rebuild. And all those are connected to the rest of the airport and the buildings which are still fine, so you have to work out how and where to connect them again. And you might not be able to simply rebuild the old system, as crucial parts might not be available anymore after several years or new rules e.g. on fire protection do not allow to still use the old materials and parts, you have to check all this first for each area, than to bring this knowledge together. Because new materials for fire protection purposes might mean new type of cables which in turn might be a need for changes to the whole central building management system, for the size of cable channels and so on - hey, they do not even manage to build a complete new airport in Berlin for years now because of exactly such problems, so I guess we all have to give them some more time here at BRU as well to figure out how to best rebuild the terminal, as had been said before, this is not about rebuilding a hut in the garden ... and by hte way, all those regulations do apply to the temporary facilities as well of course ... they need to follow the fire protection regulations, they need to be fit for higher temperatures than we have right now, for stormy weather, the workplaces in thiose facilities need to be in line with health and safety basics and so on; of course flexibility is great and it is needed in such a situation and yes, a innovative work-around for one or the other issue needs to be found as well, but still there are reasons for certain rules and they need to be followed; this will simply take more time ... and even I do not like it, I can understand it
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koja78
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by koja78 » 31 Mar 2016, 09:26

I think we all want to give BRU the time it needs to rebuild.
The only real question is... will the economy give it the necessary time.
The longer it is closed the more chance that airlines will not return.
The longer it is closed the bigger the losses for SN. (and possible failiure)
The longer it is closed the bigger the general economic impact. (loss of jobs...)

I think it is in everybodies best interest that the airport reopens as soon as humanly possible.
Even limited operations might be very symbolic here to regain trust with your economic partners.

Anybody have an idea how the cargo operations are going btw. This does not need the terminal.. so I would hope they are back at 100% at least!

flightlover
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by flightlover » 31 Mar 2016, 09:45

Cargo is quite linked to passenger traffic these days, so it is hurt also. Carriers have upped security measures and a lot more cargo gets trucked.

A lot of flights have been cancelled. No idea about the schedule for the coming days though.

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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by Acid-drop » 31 Mar 2016, 10:51

It will take time fix years of laxism.
The biggest cleaning has to be done on the security level.
http://m.lalibre.be/actu/belgique/atten ... a2d40f6dab

Those who would like to see BRU reopening, do you feel safe to walk there ?
Because I'll need to fly soon and I really dont trust belgian security. I know how flexible we can be (culture wide)
Its a huge advantage when things go well and a disaster when it doesnt.
My messages reflect my personal opinion which may be different than yours. I beleive a forum is made to create a debate so I encourage people to express themselves, the way they want, with the ideas they want. I expect the same understanding in return.

b720
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by b720 » 31 Mar 2016, 11:02

I don't trust Belgian security either, the attacks have exposed everything that is wrong in our system.
The police (in Antwerp) is corrupt, and seems to get away with it, the Federal police threatens to strike at the most critical time in our recent history, our intelligence is as good as non existent. I do not feel safe in Antwerp, Liege, CRL, or Ostend airports because I do not feel that the security apparatus has my back! and those airports are open..The only reason an attack is not taking place today is because the terrorists have chosen not to send a bomber on this specific day. But, life goes on, we try to fix the issues with security and we need BRU to open! The security and system fix need years.We shall need help from other countries, we can not do it alone. We are the "Greece" of security malfunction, we are in desperate need of outside help.

pitrixplanespotting
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by pitrixplanespotting » 31 Mar 2016, 11:08

Brussels Airlines OO-SFW, OO-SFM, OO-SFU and jetairfly 787 are back in BRU

koninckske
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Re: Re-opening Brussels Airport after the 22/03/2016 terror attacks

Post by koninckske » 31 Mar 2016, 11:32

Having worked in many countries I need to say that Belgium is a very safe place. People that think different should open their eyes. We have problems, but it is not different in other countries. If someone wants to do something bad nothing will stop them.

The problem of Belgium is the political system. This has been for many years and will not change if some of them don't accept reality. For too many years some politicians have blocked changes with the excuse that it was racist or whatever they could come up with. I think the Flemish and Walloon regions are doing what they can, but the Brussels region itself is a mess. Too many diffrent levels involved ... Anyway we all know that, I should not discuss that here...

BRU is trying to get started again. They should have said that it would be closed for a week or a fixed time... not delay day by day. That is a big mistake they made. For passengers, for airlines, for .... everyone. Nobody can make a planning. If they were able to open earlier everyone would have been happy about their performance... now it looks very unprofessional even when they are doing a great job.

At BRU priority should be given to airlines that have their main and/or only base there and are not holiday airlines. So for me clearly SN would be the first back. Jetairfly and Thomas Cook can continue to use OST and LGG. Ryanair being point to point only will put a lot of stress on the check in area (security checks, not so much actual check in) and has a big base in CRL so sorry for some people, but I think they should not be allowed back to BRU for an extended time.

If I was Brussels Airlines I would bring back long haul first together with the most important European destinations for connecting passengers. Those people stay inside the terminal so don't need to enter the airport from the outside. At the same time accept a limited number of passengers from Belgium on those European destinations. After that slowly start adding more point to point traffic.

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