VLM Airlines news 2016

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convair
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Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by convair » 29 Jun 2016, 23:25

sn26567 wrote:
carllegein wrote:Our light plan will be 1 or 2 Fokker 50, or other aircraft, on a AOC of an existing airline.
Great to see that at least something will be left from what used to be a great independent airline before it fell in the hands of Air France.

Thank you, Carl, for keeping us informed of your plans and aspirations. We really do appreciate.
I fully agree. All the best for his endeavor!

Passenger
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Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Passenger » 29 Jun 2016, 23:47

FLYAIR10 wrote:In 2001 with the start-up of VG-airlines, the BCAA was also asking for a 'businessplan'. and that was also one of the major problems for FVG at that time. (next to Finding the funds for the deposit with bcaa for his 3 A330's). I don't understand why FVG went to Brussels another time without a businessplan knowing that the BCAA will for sure ask again for one. It can not be too difficult to make at least a 30-40 page document or ppt with a title 'VG-businessplan' and describing a scenario for start-up and expected financial statement for the first 12-18 months? Or is that too simplistic? Full of assumptions and estimates probably ,but at least the criterium 'to submit a businesplan' would be fulfilled.
I witnessed that 2001/2002 start up from very closeby. At that time, VG Airlines' US plans were a direct competitor for SN Brussels Airlines, successor of Belgium's state carrier Sabena. It's impossible to proof that this Sabena link was the reason why the Belgian CAA was extremely hostile, but the way Freddy Van Gaever was treated by them was really a disgrace for a public service.

Let me give a straight example: the third A330 was a backup, with a lease contract paid-by-the-hour. The business plan for this third A330 included "charter flights for Belgian soccer clubs and their fans for their European matches". Reply from the Belgian CAA: "please advise us the exact dates and exact routes of those flights". Whilst these draws hadn't been organized by the UEFA yet?! On top, the Belgian CAA demanded that all conversation was done courier (Belgian Post), and not via mail. Next letter from the Belgian CAA: "please advise us the names and addresses from all your cockpit crew and cabin crew, and give us a copy of their contracts".
FLYAIR10 wrote:IMO he is throwing the towel too early this time after all the optimism he showed last week.
When you want to restart a route after a sudden stop, it's important that it's done very soon. Otherwise, your clientele has settled to a new airline and/or a new route. Plans were to start VG as from 11th July. However, the CAA made it clear yesterday that this will not be possible.

Xavi
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Joined: 25 Jan 2016, 20:29

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Xavi » 05 Jul 2016, 21:50

In todays German newspaper Schwäbische Zeitung:
"Whether the efforts of the liquidator of the bankrupt Regional Airline VLM to restart successful, could be reflected in the current week. "There are currently around ten prospects for the company," said Jan Loyens, a liquidator of the company, on Monday to the Swabian newspaper."
http://www.schwaebische.de/region_artik ... d,310.html

Surprised to read that, because I thought only FVG and Carl Legein are interested???

saratoga
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Joined: 04 Apr 2006, 00:00

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by saratoga » 13 Jul 2016, 21:25

http://www.gva.be/cnt/dmf20160712_02381 ... -tot-niets

In a nutshell: so far no new potential buyers to buy VLM and in Flanders nobody is interested.

Grts

Passenger
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Passenger » 13 Jul 2016, 21:49

saratoga wrote:http://www.gva.be/cnt/dmf20160712_02381 ... -tot-niets

In a nutshell: so far no new potential buyers to buy VLM and in Flanders nobody is interested.
Liquidator Frans De Roy negociates with a foreign candidate.

De Roy: ...I call upon successfull Flemish enterpreneurs to invest in their airport. The knowhow is here, the aircraft are here, the destinations are there... When Flemish enterpreneurs invest, we should be able to start up with 50 staff... I don't understand why nobody steps in. Antwerp Airport is a valuable opportunity and Hamburg and London have proven their success... VLM Airlines went bankrupt because of mismanagement and wrong strategic decisions... I want to know by this weekend what's going to happen; I could sell the six own aircraft, but I want to wait with that decision because it would mean a loss of all employment...

PttU
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by PttU » 14 Jul 2016, 00:11

"The knowhow is here, the aircraft are here, the destinations are there... "
The knowhow: probably, I don't know how good theirs is, but I assume that's indeed an asset.
The aircraft: only about 5 of them after the last sale-and-lease-back? 5 rather dated Fokker 50's which are hardly used by any other European company?
The destinations: yes, ANR-LCY is successful, but I guess most of the profit goes to CityJet? And other destinations (HAM, GVA,...) combined had less passengers than the ANR-LCY line.
So, although I enjoyed the VLM services before, I'm afraid their package isn't too interesting for someone to take over.

FLYAIR10
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by FLYAIR10 » 14 Jul 2016, 10:59

The destinations: yes, ANR-LCY is successful, but I guess most of the profit goes to CityJet? And other destinations (HAM, GVA,...) combined had less passengers than the ANR-LCY line.
So, although I enjoyed the VLM services before, I'm afraid their package isn't too interesting for someone to take over.
and what about the Friedrichshafen business? and the charter activities? Vizionair-link? They could also start-up/resume Antwerp-Luton-Waterford,assuming the bills are paid overthere...

Shengenzone
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Shengenzone » 14 Jul 2016, 19:33

FLYAIR10 wrote:
The destinations: yes, ANR-LCY is successful, but I guess most of the profit goes to CityJet? And other destinations (HAM, GVA,...) combined had less passengers than the ANR-LCY line.
So, although I enjoyed the VLM services before, I'm afraid their package isn't too interesting for someone to take over.
and what about the Friedrichshafen business? and the charter activities? Vizionair-link? They could also start-up/resume Antwerp-Luton-Waterford,assuming the bills are paid overthere...
No they had outstanding debt with both airports...

saratoga
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Joined: 04 Apr 2006, 00:00

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by saratoga » 22 Jul 2016, 08:15

http://www.gva.be/cnt/dmf20160721_02393 ... -overnemen

A dutch taxi company wants to take over VLM airways in addition to their activities.

AAI
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by AAI » 22 Jul 2016, 10:29

when i read they endeavour short connections from ANR of max 600 km
i give them max 4 weeks before failure!

saratoga
Posts: 220
Joined: 04 Apr 2006, 00:00

Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by saratoga » 22 Jul 2016, 10:48

I fully agree with you. I first thought it was a bad joke. Not really realistic and serious to take, i would say. Aviation industry is an industry on its own. I hope there are more serious potential buyers out there.

Avnu
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Avnu » 22 Jul 2016, 12:49

Regarding this Dutch taxi company and their 'plans' for VLM, consider this:

- How much does it cost them to talk to the curator? Pretty much 0 EUR, except maybe their transportation costs between Amsterdam and Antwerp.
- How much extra do they have to pay to get their name and a summary of their activities in both the specialized press AND one or two newspapers? Absolutely nothing
- How much would they have to pay to advertise in that same newspaper? Thousands of euros.

That is all.

Flanker2
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Flanker2 » 22 Jul 2016, 13:37

I have some idea's for a VG restart but I don't have 20 million Euro's laying around.
If it may inspire those who do have it:

1. It's a true shame that SN won't even take a look at it, it's perfect to launch regional operations out of BRU.
SN could virtually get it for less than free, if they take over part of the debt.

2. An operation that could definitely work is a Florence based airline flying domestic and international lines.
Operations and maintenance can stay in Antwerp if needed, flight crews can commute.

3. Another option is a Ciampino based domestic airline with some international routes that connect onto the domestic network but also connect Rome to tier 2 cities across Europe.

4. Go big with CDG, which hosts many longhaul airlines that aren't Skyteam and could use some feeding, domestic and international.

Out of Belgium, I can only see it operate as a feeder for SN or as an independent feeder for longhaul airlines operating in BRU. But if the latter choice is made, I would definitely prefer to do it in CDG, where there is much more volume and less seasonality.


The Dutch taxi company: the curator shouldn't even waste his time with this.
Actually, he should pretend that he's very interested in their proposal, so they can sh*t their pants.

jan_olieslagers
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by jan_olieslagers » 22 Jul 2016, 14:07

he should pretend
Even if you neatly admit to not having the funds to take real action for yourself, you do clearly show you have sufficient brains and knowledge to take over the curator's job, and perhaps even their business, perhaps in part. Or how you come and say what they should or shouldn't do? Go for it! Do show us you can actually achieve something, and know what you are talking about, as you keep implying, but never materialise upon!

jan_olieslagers
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by jan_olieslagers » 22 Jul 2016, 14:18

PS regarding Firenze: it used to be a major centre of financial business but that has been a couple of centuries now... Today it is a sleepy tourist destination, not unlike Brugge (BE), crowded with camera snappers in summer, quite dead at other times.

Flanker2
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Flanker2 » 22 Jul 2016, 17:51

jan_olieslagers wrote:PS regarding Firenze: it used to be a major centre of financial business but that has been a couple of centuries now... Today it is a sleepy tourist destination, not unlike Brugge (BE), crowded with camera snappers in summer, quite dead at other times.
I think that FLR has plenty of opportunities to offer to a carrier the size of VG.
If the idea is to grow to a fleet of 50 narrowbody jets, you can forget it of course.
Florence is not as seasonal as you suggest, nor is it in my opinion a sleepy tourist destination like Bruges.

Even if you neatly admit to not having the funds to take real action for yourself, you do clearly show you have sufficient brains and knowledge to take over the curator's job, and perhaps even their business, perhaps in part. Or how you come and say what they should or shouldn't do?
Go to sleep, friend. I'm just floating some suggestions, don't care if you don't like them.

Passenger
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Passenger » 22 Jul 2016, 18:22

I'm surprised that intelligent people follow Flanker in his surrealistic extra-galactic plan for a Brussels Airlines feeder flight ANR-BRU, undoubtedly his most stupid plan ever (though we don't know what is to follow).

On topic: Tinker is not "a Dutch taxi company". Actually, they don't have own taxis: they are a taxi broker. And they are approved by the Dutch leading travel group TUI, and many others in the travel trade.
http://www.tui.nl/tinker/

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Ozzie1969
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Ozzie1969 » 24 Jul 2016, 21:54

jan_olieslagers wrote:PS regarding Firenze: it used to be a major centre of financial business but that has been a couple of centuries now... Today it is a sleepy tourist destination, not unlike Brugge (BE), crowded with camera snappers in summer, quite dead at other times.
As an inhabitant of Brugge, I can assure you that this city is never dead, and definitely not in the winter months.

Inquirer
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Inquirer » 24 Jul 2016, 22:44

Since the airline has been shut down for quite some time now, chances of a (partial) restart are likely fairly slim; any first signs of the curators trying to make some money on selling individual bits and pieces, like for instance the planes? Are they still stored, or what has happened to them over the past few weeks?

Avnu
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Re: VLM Airlines news 2016

Post by Avnu » 25 Jul 2016, 15:16

Regarding the airplanes: as far as I can tell...

- 4 planes (OO-VLF, L, M & P) were flown to Saarbrucken (SCN) after the bankruptcy
- 1 plane (OO-VLS) was already stored at SCN after a repair job in April that VLM never paid for
- 1 plane (OO-VLO) has been stored in Antwerp for months but largely stripped for parts
- 5 planes (OO-VLI, J, N Q &Z) were in Antwerp when VLM stopped flying and haven't moved since

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