Jet Airways out of Brussels

[crew1990]

One A330 was already confirmed, now finger crossed for 2 A330, but it seem it will be the case...

[sn26567]

"tolipanebas" (btw, where does your nick' come from?!)

Make an educated guess! It's not that difficult, play a little with the letters in his name...

[tolipanebas]

we're "urgently" waiting for the news regarding the expansion plans!

As said: things were ready to be announced, and then the unique opportunity from 9W pulling out of BRU suddenly presented itself, so everything had to be redone to take benefit from it, hence the delay.

There have been coordinated talks with LH to get their support for the expansion first, and currently things are being finalized with with A++ members UA and AC, so a little bit more of your patience is needed.

[brusselsairlinesfan]

"tolipanebas" (btw, where does your nick' come from?!)

Make an educated guess! It's not that difficult, play a little with the letters in his name...

OK thanks... I finally got it! And I am impressed...

[convair]

As said: things were ready to be announced, and then the unique opportunity from 9W pulling out of BRU suddenly presented itself, so everything had to be redone to take benefit from it, hence the delay.

There have been coordinated talks with LH to get their support for the expansion first, and currently things are being finalized with with A++ members UA and AC, so a little bit more of your patience is needed.

Thanks for the info, Tolip!
9W and friends seem to have waited as long as possible in order to give others only little time to react. However, everyone saw this coming, as a strong possibility at least, and I assume there were already preliminary talks within the A++ members and the new plan should be confirmed quickly.

This is a unique opportunity and it would be a shame not to seize it! I hope for a bold move from SN with the full support of the LH group.

Still, I don't understand that the 9W operation at BRU, with their 4 daily flights always well filled, was not profitable...or was it brainwashing and the decision to move was taken for other (political, alliances...) reasons.

[Jetter]

Still, I don't understand that the 9W operation at BRU, with their 4 daily flights always well filled, was not profitable...or was it brainwashing and the decision to move was taken for other (political, alliances...) reasons.

It doesn't really matter if it was profitable, what matters is if the alternative option (AMS) is more profitable. While SN could offer decent European connections, the advantage of the 11 NA destinations DL/KL can offer in AMS is obvious, when comparing that with BRU.

[Airbus A330]

One A330 was already confirmed, now finger crossed for 2 A330, but it seem it will be the case...

Great! I also cross my fingers for a 2nd A330 next year...

On a side note, the "?" of the title of the topic can now be removed.

[convair]

Still, I don't understand that the 9W operation at BRU, with their 4 daily flights always well filled, was not profitable...or was it brainwashing and the decision to move was taken for other (political, alliances...) reasons.

It doesn't really matter if it was profitable, what matters is if the alternative option (AMS) is more profitable. While SN could offer decent European connections, the advantage of the 11 NA destinations DL/KL can offer in AMS is obvious, when comparing that with BRU.

I agree with that, and it is was I was hinting at, but if the operation in BRU WAS profitable, it's easier for someone else to step into their shoes.

[Conti764]

Sad to see them leaving.... That will be weird not to see any Jet airways aircraft after 9 years at BRU. But ok after the partnership between Etihad and Air France-KLM this was foreseen. Let's hope BRU is doing their job good! And find some other carriers for this lost routes..

SN/AC to Toronto?
SN/UA to Newark (2x daily)?
SN/AI to Mumbai?

I think we will lose Delhi

Grtz9W

Ps: flights after 27mar16 still bookable

I'd say goodbye Jet Airways and so long...

It all looked very promising back in 2007 and at some point I heard things like 50+ flights a week from BRU, 2 million passengers. Rumours even were 9W considering a stake at Brussels Airport, including their own pier and buying (!) SN for a European subsidiary...

It all seemed too ambitious and over time it was shown that Naresh Goyal and the likes overstepped their limits. In the meanwhile, SN getting in the basket of LH, which was in bed with Air India, SN getting stronger and stronger at BRU and the BRU management shifting more attention to the home carrier again forcing 9W out of the BRU market and into the hands of another...

It's up to SN and their A++ partners to react for the transatlantic flying. India will probably leave a void, except for AI maybe taking over one or more of the routes.

It creates a great opportunity for SN to even have more market share at BRU, so if all goes well both the airport and the airline can profit from a more healthy relationship now the second biggest full service carrier is leaving BRU.

However, I can't stop to wonder what if would have meant for SN if they were bought by IAG in stead of the Lufthansa Group. IAG wasn't commited to any Indian airline and was really kean of getting SN into both their group and Oneworld alliance. It might have been more advantageous for all parties (BRU, SN, 9W) if both SN and 9W would have gotten into Oneworld. But it is what it is and it's up to SN to react in a proper way, putting its foot more firmly into BRU...

Can anyone shed some light what will/might happen with the fancy 9W-lounge at the B-pier? Is it still BRU's property and did 9W only invest in it with the risk of losing its investment or does BRU have to pay 9W to retain the lounge?

About flights, my best guess:

Short term:
One Canadian flight on AC.
One Canadian flight on SN.
An extra flight to EWR, on UA.

Longer term:
One or two Indian flights on AI.

With a possible second EWR-rotation and the excisting EWR, ORD and IAD flights UA might bring the number of daily rotations to BRU to four, does this make them the second network carrier at BRU, right after SN? Or is LH number 2?

[Conti764]

This creates quite some opportunities in BRU, most certainly transatlantic: the airport may not like it too much, but I can think of quite a few airlines which may be wrubbing their hands right now over this news.
Wonder how long it takes for them to announce filling the void(s)?

I guess any TATL flying has to come from the A++ joint venture and both SN and UA have already requested slots, for respectively Toronto and Newark.

[Conti764]

This might be seen as the result of the stupid Star Alliance decision to go after Air India rather than Jet Airways.

Well, AI was set to joing Star Alliance well before SN. The only reason why SN is in Star Alliance the first place is it being bought by Lufthansa. *A chose AI well before and couldn't get out of the talks without turmoil from the GOI...

I'd rather say it's a shame IAG wasn't founded earlier so they could have taken up SN, in stead of the stand alone BA which was heavily interested in SN, but got outpowered by LH...

[Conti764]

Still, I don't understand that the 9W operation at BRU, with their 4 daily flights always well filled, was not profitable...or was it brainwashing and the decision to move was taken for other (political, alliances...) reasons.

It doesn't really matter if it was profitable, what matters is if the alternative option (AMS) is more profitable. While SN could offer decent European connections, the advantage of the 11 NA destinations DL/KL can offer in AMS is obvious, when comparing that with BRU.

They only have 11 destinations? I always had the impression it was far more than that... So BRU isn't even trailing that far behind with 7 (seasonaly 8) destinations...

[RoMax]

They only have 11 destinations? I always had the impression it was far more than that... So BRU isn't even trailing that far behind with 7 (seasonaly 8) destinations...

These are only the ones 9W will codeshare on, there are more.
Delta: Atlanta, Boston, Detroit, Minneapolis, JFK, Newark, Portland, Seattle and Salt Lake City (seasonal)
KLM: Atlanta, Calgary, Chicago, Edmonton, Houston, Los Angeles, Montreal, JFK, San Francisco, Toronto, Vancouver and Washington
So quite some more routes than just the ones 9W will codeshare on.

[Jetter]

They only have 11 destinations? I always had the impression it was far more than that... So BRU isn't even trailing that far behind with 7 (seasonaly 8) destinations...

These are only the ones 9W will codeshare on, there are more.
Delta: Atlanta, Boston, Detroit, Minneapolis, JFK, Newark, Portland, Seattle and Salt Lake City (seasonal)
KLM: Atlanta, Calgary, Chicago, Edmonton, Houston, Los Angeles, Montreal, JFK, San Francisco, Toronto, Vancouver and Washington
So quite some more routes than just the ones 9W will codeshare on.

That's right, 1 more even; Dallas (seasonal). In the Americas KL has 37 destinations, probably the highest number out of all Europeans/Asian airliners. Quite impressive, and that leaves a lot of room for expansion of the KL/9W cooperation, with only 11 out of them having 9W code in the current plan.

[LJ]

Still, I don't understand that the 9W operation at BRU, with their 4 daily flights always well filled, was not profitable...or was it brainwashing and the decision to move was taken for other (political, alliances...) reasons.

You do know that 2.5 years ago EY already mentioned this? 9W does what EY wants (though officially it doesn't control EY). AFAIK the idea (at the time) was also to increase BRU - AUH to compensate for the loss of 9W.

BTW if 9W will be getting local rights on AMS - YYZ, I wonder what the victim will be. Either the number of KLM flights (currently 12 weekly in peak season for S16), AC or Air Transat (I don't think AMS can absorb 7 additional weekly A330-300 flights). Maybe AC can move its YYZ - AMS to BRU?

I'd rather say it's a shame IAG wasn't founded earlier so they could have taken up SN, in stead of the stand alone BA which was heavily interested in SN, but got outpowered by LH...

I don't think IAG would make a difference. It's essentially BA whose behind IAG. Moreover, how would the world looked like if Sabena World Airlines would have materialised?

[White Light]

both SN and UA have already requested slots, for respectively Toronto and Newark.

This would mean that SN would fly to YYZ ? and UA perhaps an additional flight to EWR and SN switching its JFK flight to an evening departure from BRU ? Just guessing.

I don't think AI will fly to BRU. It would be nice (and probably profitable, no ?) if SN could fly to BOM.

[sn26567]

Arnaud Feist, CEO of Brussels Airport, said on Twitter that the departure of Jet Airways represents hundreds of direct and indirect jobs and 650,000 passengers/year lost. The airport is examining with a.o. Brussels Airlines how routes can be resumed when Jet Airways stops flights at Brussels Airport in March.

[Conti764]

both SN and UA have already requested slots, for respectively Toronto and Newark.

This would mean that SN would fly to YYZ ? and UA perhaps an additional flight to EWR and SN switching its JFK flight to an evening departure from BRU ? Just guessing.

I don't think AI will fly to BRU. It would be nice (and probably profitable, no ?) if SN could fly to BOM.

It was mentioned in the summer '16 topic. It was a little surprising SN would be taking over (English) Toronto while Air Canada would retain (French) Montreal... Or might the SN flight come alongside the AC flight? Giving the stronger competition from the KL/9W tandem at AMS, might AC consider moving (part of) its YYZ-AMS operations to BRU?

Maybe that's a strategy BRU is to follow? Concentrate heavily on Star Alliance and try to convince Star Alliance airlines to shift ops from other (secondary) airports in Europe to Brussels? SN has quite an interesting portfolio on European flights, so it might be an option for those airlines...

[Conti764]

Arnaud Feist, CEO of Brussels Airport, said on Twitter that the departure of Jet Airways represents hundreds of direct and indirect jobs and 650,000 passengers/year lost. The airport is examining with a.o. Brussels Airlines how routes can be resumed when Jet Airways stops flights at Brussels Airport in March.

Yes well... A little drama always sells well

[White Light]

It was a little surprising SN would be taking over (English) Toronto while Air Canada would retain (French) Montreal... Or might the SN flight come alongside the AC flight? [/quote]

I don't find any AC flights between YYZ and AMS for S16. Will AC pull out of AMS ?

If SN would fly to Eastern Canada, it would somehow make sense for SN to fly to YUL and for AC to fly nonstop between YYZ and BRU.

I presume all flights would be codeshared.