Boeing 787 news

[KriVa]

JetairFly should be getting the first of two 787's in the first half of 2013, the second should be coming in 2014.

[bollox]

I've seen that Boeing have taken off the 787 CEO and replaced him with the 777 CEO. Let us hope that he can get more birds flying without so many rework delays

[RoMax]

I've seen that Boeing have taken off the 787 CEO and replaced him with the 777 CEO. Let us hope that he can get more birds flying without so many rework delays

They swapped places, Scott Fancher was the vice president and general manager of the 787 program, now he has the same title in the 777 program. Same for Larry Loftis which is now on the 787 program.

But watch out to blame Fancher for the 787 program problems...he was on the program since December 2008...Actually the worst moment in the whole program. Back in 2008 Boeing changed a big part of their managers because of the company wide problems (not only on the 787 and 748). Fancher got a poisoned gift with the 787 program. He did make his mistakes himself, but overall, he handled the program quite well. The things that went wrong were mainly the result of the faults made in the previous years.

If Boeing wouldn't trust Scott Fancher they would give him a small job inside the company, they wouldn't make him the head of the 777 program. That is currently the most profitable widebody program of Boeing and they are comming close to a new crucial phase in this program. The job of Fancher is to allign the current 777 production system to that of the new generation 777's. Together with Lars Anderson he will work on the next generation 777 (777-8X and 777-9X). This 777NG versions are essential for the future of this extremely succesfull program. So I wouldn't say they don't think Fancher has its qualities.

About the 787 program, of course he will succeed in getting more 787's delivered with less rework... That is already happening. The first 787's had about 5000 to 7000 jobs to be done after final assembly, currently it is at about 500-1000 and they plan to have no need for rework around the middle of this year. The 787 program has come from so far that it can only become better. That will not only be thanks to the new head of the program. But of course he will try to do some good things, especially on the 789 production. The 788 production may have been the best lesson Boeing learned in the last decades. The way they handle the 787-9 is totally different 'thanks' to the lessons they learned from the 788. Same goes for the 737MAX, the 2017 EIS is all but optimistic. Boeing said they prefer to delivery too early and/or give better performance than to deliver too late and with bad performances.

[sn26567]

United to seek payment for Boeing 787 delays

United Continental is looking for compensation from Boeing for its late 787 deliveries. The airline has orders for 50 of Boeing’s new 787s.

A filing by United Continental earlier this week said it is “currently in discussions with Boeing over potential compensation related to delays in the 787 aircraft deliveries.” The filing added that United “is not able to estimate the ultimate success, amount of, nature or timing of any potential recoveries from Boeing over such delays.”

United Continental was supposed to get six new 787s this year, but that has been reduced to five. Boeing has been working to get production of the new planes up to speed. It has built more than four dozen planes so far and every one of them has needed additional work after coming off the assembly line.

Several airlines have sought compensation for the delays. In October, China Eastern Airlines said it would use penalties from a late 787 order that it canceled to pay for part of a new order of Boeing 737s.

More from Aviation News

[RoMax]

Hainan Airlines, considers to swap (some of) their 787 orders to orders for the 748i. 'Suprisingly', they are backed by the Chinese government for this (Hainan is a private company, but of course, in Chine you are never completely 'free' from the government).

They said that if it's a good airplane, they may swap orders for the 787 to the 748i, partly because of the serious delays in the 787 program.
They said they intent to grow their fleet with at least 10/ year and the 748i may fit in this growth as it's a much larger aircraft.
They said about their relation with Boeing: "We're loyal customers and we're promoting the development of Chinese-US economic relations".

btw, last year there was a MoU signed for 15 748i's, it's being said that this is from Hong Kong Airlines (partly owned by Hainan). But this is still not confirmed, though it seems very lickely as even on the Boeing website (on the page of 748 customers) a render of a 748i in Hong Kong Airlines colors appeard, it was removed shortly after this came in publicity).

[sn26567]

Air India mulls selling 787 Dreamliners

Cash strapped Air India is planning to sell off its 27 Boeing 787 Dreamliner planes. The sale will attract a substantial premium, compared to the price it was bought. Air India had bought the aircraft at Rs 703 crore apiece in 2005. The price of the aircraft has gone up by 37 percent since, at Rs 970 crore a plane.

After a delay of over three years, Boeing is expected to deliver seven Dreamliners this year. And even if the government decides to sell the seven expected aircraft, it would make Rs 1,800 crore.

[earthman]

Uh, a crore is apparently a unit in the South Asian numbering system which is equal to 10 million. Yes they have a word for 10 million.

[sn26567]

London Heathrow today received its first 787 flight!! The ANA jet was actually diverted from Frankfurt due to fog.

[Airbus330lover]

grrr.... why not BRU AMS or CDG ?

[sn26567]

grrr.... why not BRU AMS or CDG ?

I also thought that LHR was quite far away from FRA for a diversion. But maybe there was fog all over continental Europe.

[earthman]

It was indeed quite foggy around AMS last friday. I was on a highway in the general vicinity, and at times the visibility was perhaps 300m. It might have been worse than that at the airport.

[RoMax]

It was indeed quite foggy around AMS last friday. I was on a highway in the general vicinity, and at times the visibility was perhaps 300m. It might have been worse than that at the airport.

Flightglobal also mentioned fog at two other European destinations of ANA, CDG and MUC at the time of the diversion. So I suppose LHR was the best solution.

[RoMax]

Hainan Airlines confirmed they consider to order the 747-8i, but as addition to their 10 787 orders, not as a replacement like was said in the press last week.

[RoMax]

It seems a long time ago, but finally some good news about the 787 again:

- Final assembly rate increased from 2,5/month to 3,5/month last week, this is earlier than expected (it was planned for later this spring)

- Boeing finished GE 788 certification flights last month, they are now arranging the final paper work before certification. As from now, all certification testing of the basic modell of the 787 (the 787-8) is done. Further testing is for further development, just like every other previous program.

- The supply chain is running suprisingly smooth (resulting in a faster than planned FAL increase). Boeing still plans 5/month for late this year, but if supply chain keeps improving like this it may be faster

Though this still doesn't mean delivery rate is going to be much higher soon... The latest issue seem to delay the deliveries of new aircraft...

Planned for March:

- JA806A (L/N40) for ANA on March 21 (moved back from 16 March, due to the shim issue maybe?)
- JA822J (L/N24) for JAL on March 29(see next aircraft for comment)
- JA825J (L/N33) for JAL on March 29 (These are the two first GE powered 787's to be deliverd, earlier planned for 31 March, but it seems these are moved forward with two days)

These delivery dates are subject to change of course...

April will be a crucial month in 787 deliveries...parking space at Everett is becoming very scarce while the amount of 787's and 748's comming out of FAL is increasing (787 at 3,5/month and 748 is increasing to 2/month).
Currently parts for L/N 60 are arriving at FAL, as from L/N 70 it's planned to get the 787's out of FAL without rework. So in a few months 787's should be delivered quite fast after they exit FAL. This will release the pressure on the amount of aircraft that need rework, but there is so much that has to be done, so I don't expect to see miracles.

[regi]

- Final assembly rate increased from 2,5/month to 3,5/month last week, this is earlier than expected (it was planned for later this spring)

What is the use of making 2,5 airplanes ( just kidding)

[sn26567]

Japan Airlines will launch Tokyo Narita Boeing 787 service to San Diego (4X-weekly Dec. 2012; to daily March 2013) and Helsinki (4X-weekly March 2013, to daily in first-half of fiscal year 2013), codesharing with American Airlines and Finnair.

Source: ATW online

[RoMax]

United announced they'll take delivery of 6 787's during the last 4 months of this year. 6 was already the plan during a large part of 2011, but later that year this was revised to 5, now it's back up to six. First delivery will be in September, second in October, 3 in November and the last in December (the last will not enter service before 2013, but it should be delivered in 2012 says United).

United also gave som details about the 787 financing:
- N20904 and N26906 (first two) are valued at 120,8 million dollar each.
- The other four (N27901, N27903, N45905 and N26902) are valued at 121,2 million dollar each.
That's about 60-65% of the current list price for a 788. But these prices are no suprise anymore after we've seen simular prices for other early 787's...

About the first 787 for Air India. This aircraft is finished, has the full interior and paint and has been flown to Delhi (after a 14 hour non-stop flight)... Tough not for delivery, it will stay in Delhi on static display after which it will leave for the airshow in Hyderabad starting March 14.
As said in the topic of Air India/Star Alliance, their remain disputes between Air India and Boeing about the compensation for the delays and the Indian government hasn't decided yet if Air India will be allowed to use the aircraft (because of their debts).

[RoMax]

The Boeing Company/ the Boeing 787 won the 2011 Collier Torphy, one of the highest honors in the American aerospace industry. Boeing also won this award back in 1995 with the 777.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOLe6Rbo ... ure=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... Sl9Mf6KKMU

They also published a longer video about the 787 certification testing, the video includes the main testing points during the past years.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBmxFWfX ... ure=relmfu

[RoMax]

As the second 787 customer, JAL, is making final preperations for the delivery of their 2 first 787's later this month, a list of the other new customers for this year:

- Air India: May (could be earlier as their first 787 is 100% finished and waiting for delivery, but the financials and final preperations of AI are not OK yet...)

- Qatar Airways: June, Qatar wants to show their 787 at the Farnborough Airshow in the first half of July (they already said that it would be unacceptable if Boeing fails to deliver before the airshow), they'll start operations in the Middle-East region to train 787 crew, London will be the first 787 destination outside the Middle-East.

- Ethiopian Airlines: Also in June

- China Southern: First delivery in July

- LOT Polish Airlines: First delivery in November (wants to start flights to China/PEK late this year with the 787)

- United Airlines and LAN Airlines should get their first somewhere in the second half of 2012, exact month is not known. For United probably September/October, in total United will get 6 this year.

I found it a bit suprising RAM isn't mentionned yet...this is one of the airlines that has unfinished 787's out of the FAL. Either these aircraft need too many rework (as I think all of them are very early 787's) or they have no idea yet on when they'll get their first.

Further information:

- In June Boeing will launch final assembly in their surge line at Everett, which should be running at 1,5 787's/month by year-end. Eventually all FAL should be located at the main FAL in Everett and at Charleston. But this surge line is to avoid further production delays and to avoid problems when the 787-9 gets into FAL in early 2013.

- Boeing CEO Albaugh said the biggest problem in the supply chain is currently the Charleston's mid- and aft-fuselage facilities (this is not the 787 FAL in Charleston). They currently deliver on time and with 100% completion of assembly. But their production ramp-up seems to be slower as with other supliers. They'll probably get at a rate for 5 787's/month in mid-year. But Boeing has more than 15 center fuselages undergoing integration at the same time, so the Charleston production has to be running well in advance.

- But overall, the production is running quite smooth at this moment. Albaugh said that for the first time in 787 production their mechanics see planned work time after time after time and they'll learn when they can increase FAL rate instead of forcing it as in the previous years.

- L/N 66 is planned to be the first "right to pre-flight" 787. They're currently at final body join with L/N 61 (for LOT).

- Certification of the GE powered 787's and the ETOPS 330 certification (for both the GE and RR powered 787's) is planned for the comming days. Currently only the RR 787's are certified, with a ETOPS 180 certification.

[sn26567]

I am surprised that in your list of 787 deliveries for 2012 you do not mention Hainan: Hainan Airlines says it is expecting a first Boeing 787 delivery in September 2012.