Security chaos at Brussels last night

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zteven
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by zteven » 18 May 2009, 19:04

More security staff at BRU please.

You can't imagine how many delays are caused by this.

Greetz!



Steven

Jipe
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Jipe » 18 May 2009, 20:19

zteven wrote:More security staff at BRU please.
You will be very disappointed. BAC is thinking about a reduction of the peoples working for the security control.

b720
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by b720 » 19 May 2009, 13:13

A total mess, I flw out of BRU saturday 16th of may.. everyone was beeping at security check.. I suspect security personnel heightened sensitivity of the machines on purpose.. and when someone bleeps.. the whole line waits (3-5 min) untill security personnel found to body search ... body search takes for ages, as they also open the hand luggage and search item by item..even though the handluggage was CLEARED by X-RAY..
all while hundreds of people are linning up..It seemed like the personnel where working slowly, delibrately as a kind of protest.. This is utterly unacceptable..

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zteven
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by zteven » 19 May 2009, 18:11

Jipe wrote: You will be very disappointed. BAC is thinking about a reduction of the peoples working for the security control.
What? Are they serious?

:lol:

If this is true; poor passengers...

Greetz!



Steven

Jipe
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Jipe » 19 May 2009, 19:12

Hello,

BRU received a bad report from the audit about the security. The consequence was that the security employee are now respecting point to point the rules --> longer delay to pass the security control.
I hears some info about the project from BAC to reduce the cost of exploitation :
Now, you have a team of 6 peoles to do the service by security gates. they want to reduce it to 4 peoples by security gate.
Add those two facts and it will be recommended to the passenger to arrive at the airport 3 hours (minimum) before their flights.

regi
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by regi » 19 May 2009, 22:38

let's talk about money, because that is where it goes about - and not security.
If a passenger knows that he has a big chance to loose a lot of time at security, he will come well beforehand to the airport and check in and go through the slow security. He will not spend time at the bar or restaurant or in the shops.
You get my point?
How much money is lost in revenue if they save money on security personnel by closing down some gates?
Nobody seems to have thought about this.
Thank you for reading, you don't have to approve my opinion, but a little applause is always welcome.
:)

Air Key West
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Air Key West » 19 May 2009, 23:36

You're probably right, regi, but that is where the shop owners who pay rent to BRU will have to come in. More time spent at security means, indeed, less time to do shopping (at least for those who want to shop at the airport, which I sometimes do, but not very often). So, let's hope the shop owners come to the rescue of the pax....
In favor of quality air travel.

Fubar
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Fubar » 20 May 2009, 11:07

Indeed, the portals have been set sensitiver. But this was also obliged by the european inspections. In fact a trial was running on B pier from novermber last year till februari.

They cant follow procedures. the quality of the security will not be better. image you know your pauses are gonna be in danger (to smoke a sig, drink a coffee, eat...), you see allot of people in qeue, you re been yelled at, the contempt of the pax towards you is inimaginable. you think you're still motivated to do your best?

the bags you have seen openend even when people did not bleep, thats one of the new rules. this meens that someone before him had an alarm, but did not have carry on luggage, then the pax behind him has to open up...

The new security rules and the cuts which were made in januari, are biting bac in the ass now. I can assure you, the claims allready made are substantial. and the wurst ist yet to come

LX-LGX
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by LX-LGX » 20 May 2009, 12:05

Fubar wrote:...
you see allot of people in qeue, you re been yelled at, the contempt of the pax towards you is inimaginable. you think you're still motivated to do your best?...
Contrary to what you say, we - the passengers - still remain calm, compared to the way you are playing down with us, for the way you are harassing us.

Take your coffee breaks and your smoking breaks and your lunch pauzes at a moment when there aren't many people queuing. And stop fooling around with us - like searching in hand bags from 70-plus passengers for those forbitten tiny nail cutters.

Because last days, it's a shame what you're doing. You want to give us hell because you have a problem with your superior? OK, we have to submit us because you are in charge. But then, don't expect us to be friendly. Or worse: don't expect us to be polite anymore.

b-west

Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by b-west » 20 May 2009, 12:26

@LX-LGX: you're venting your anger towards the wrong persons. Security staff aren't responsible for this, they're following their guidelines. It's not like they enjoy doing these extensive controls, and harassing grannies, but they're being forced to do it. I suggest you state your remarks in a strongly worded letter to the airport authorities.

HighInTheSky
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by HighInTheSky » 20 May 2009, 13:26

To all of you who work at the security control, you have my respect! I, and many others, know that you always did your job as good as possible, and yet, it doesn't seem enough. And instead of blaming the higher management, you guys recieve the sh*t....
Now, just a question, at the crew center I don't notice any real change to the procedures or checks, ok, when we beep we also have to open our luggage, but that's about it. I know that when I beep, it's a test, so the density of the scanner has not been increased to my knowledge. Is this correct?

regi
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by regi » 20 May 2009, 13:43

At least we are not yet in a London Heathrow situation where security staff ( BAA staff is not police dear members !) behaves very rude, loud, oppressive.
I got saved once by a real officer ( identifying himself ) after being searched too long by such a BAA creature. He first scolded that BAA thing and than excused for the useless behaviour of the civilian staff.
He was the only person of staff ( Terminal 4 I think ) who was properly dressed, spoke politely but also with authority without raising his voice.
The rest of the scum was shouting, throwing bags over the counter, saying irrelevant things to people who asked relevant questions, just name it. Their uniforms were dirty, smelly.
And if anybody of that staff complains about hard labour conditions: get another job ! By the way, do you remember why you took that job some years ago? Because you didn't finish your school and didn't get a proper degree. And you didn't want to work as a blue collar worker. Just get that security job and do your hours.
It was that stupid job or McDonnald's.
I have told this already before: even the airport police is friendlier than the security staff.

regi
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by regi » 20 May 2009, 13:46

But truth obliges me to say that I have no problems with Zaventem security people. From my last visits I just have to say you were working professionally, and we could even have a joke.
So, I don't know, I just hope that this silly situation will improve - or at least come back to the previous standard.
Jobs at McDonnald's might become stressful as well... ;)

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Conti764
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Conti764 » 20 May 2009, 18:55

LX-LGX wrote: Contrary to what you say, we - the passengers - still remain calm, compared to the way you are playing down with us, for the way you are harassing us.

Take your coffee breaks and your smoking breaks and your lunch pauzes at a moment when there aren't many people queuing. And stop fooling around with us - like searching in hand bags from 70-plus passengers for those forbitten tiny nail cutters.

Because last days, it's a shame what you're doing. You want to give us hell because you have a problem with your superior? OK, we have to submit us because you are in charge. But then, don't expect us to be friendly. Or worse: don't expect us to be polite anymore.
Passengers are a hassle at the security checkpoints, but actually overall in the airport. Just accept these people are merely doing their jobs the way they're supposed te do and if not, they are subject to repression from their superiors who, on their turn, are under stress with the client, BAC. It's not like they like to screw you over, but they have to.

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zteven
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by zteven » 20 May 2009, 20:47

I got myself a nice email today:

-----
Dear customer,
We realise that the situation with long queuing times at passenger screening during peak times causes a lot of frustration and problems for everyone, not just for you but for passengers as well. By now, you all know the background and the cause of these problems.

Together with our partner Securitas, we are doing the utmost to alleviate the pain. In order to increase the number of security agents in the shortest possible delay, Securitas moved a team from the Netherlands to Brussels, administrative staff from both our companies are reinforcing the passenger screening teams during peak hours, rerouting to transfer screening when available, airport staff are being asked to take other routes, etc. All this to assure you that we are very much aware of the problems.

One more thing: although difficult for everyone, please bear in mind that the security agents currently work under high pressure, because of the EU inspection and the confrontation with unhappy and sometimes aggressive passengers.

We hope to drastically improve the situation very soon, but in the meantime we ask for your patience and support in these difficult times.

Ruben Sicking
Director Operations
-----

Sounds good, right?
Let's hope this solves the problem.

Greetz!



Steven

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Atlantis
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by Atlantis » 20 May 2009, 21:25

It's confirmed by now that more security people will be present at Brussels airport the next coming days and this for an unknown period.

JoskeDR
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by JoskeDR » 20 May 2009, 22:31

You know
the only things we get from this insanely increased security measure is
A. mass paranoia
B. agitated pax
C. very agitated staff members (who are seriously more prone to error this way)
and most importantly
D. A VERY FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY
Face it people however strong you make your task force, however stringent you make your rules, there ARE holes in the net, will always be holes in the net and THEY WILL FIND THEM.
Accept it or stop living because you might aswell be blown up in a car bombing on the way to the airport too. Or do you want to start security screening people as they exit their homes too now?
Seriously, the comment about staff being screened, well I'm staff. I'm happy to be screened and happy that this way our lovely PAX think they are better off and still give us their business which is in the longer end what we need. But The moment people seriously think they 'are making a difference' this way ... sorry they are simply ignorant of the facts.
There is alot of very harmfull material to be found on the tarmac, in the hangars, in the airplanes and there are some very easy ways of getting that to the passengers too.
this security thing has become an obsession which is just plain wrong! But as I said, I'm happy to provide people that false sense of security this way if that means I can keep my job. Just don't expect me to be stupid enough to believe this security is actually going to change the safety of our airports. It won't! I won't.
On the long run we human beings thrive on trust. Once we stop doing that, all is lost. Unfortunately people are losing trust at massive rates these days...


PS: the airport owners are really stupid people because as said earlier, they pay peanuts and get monkeys yet are still surprised by that... Morons!

regi
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by regi » 22 May 2009, 17:07

a simple question:
are there statistics of how many possible terrorist attacks have been avoided - let's say after the 1970's hijackings - by screening ALL passengers ?
  • The shoe bomber got on board but failed to blow up his shoe.
    The Chechen suicide bomber on the Tu-154 got through security by bribing her way around control.
Some passengers have been found with hand guns in their hand luggage ( mostly in the USA) . But as far as I remember it was each time a matter of "Oh my got, I forgot to take it out of my purse !"
Can somebody guide me to websites with statistics? At this moment I am such a typical hyper critical civilian who thinks that the real number of avoided hijackings by screening 100% of the passengers is...ZERO %

So the reason of my question is: should we not better give up the 100% control and invest in sporadic screening? ( by real officials and not by underpaid, over stressed private contractors )
Somewhere somehow I have the feeling that the entire airline industry doesn't dare to change the actual procedures, nobody dares to ask the simple questions, and make the right decisions.

What narcotic trafficing concerns, this is another subject. The other passengers should not be paying high security prices because of the illegale trafficing activities of criminals. So again: different screening processes, just like at the Channel Tunnel.

SmilingBoy
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by SmilingBoy » 24 May 2009, 23:04

Was flying from BRU Pier A on Thursday (21 May 09) at 9am. I have never seen anything close to such a mess before at BRU (and I have flown from BRU on average twice a month in the last four years). The longest waiting I had before was less than 10 minutes. On Thursday, it took 43 minutes (I timed it), and I was lucky because I could use the fast lane (although it took 25 minutes to get to the fast lane entrance). The crowd filled approximately one third of the long corridor (i.e. more than half of the second moving walkway), on both sides and in the middle of the moving walkways. I would have missed my flight had it not been 20 minutes late (they were shouting my name at me while I was arriving at the gate...).

Most security checkpoints were open, except one at the very right (to the right of the fast lane). We were asked to take the shoes off. Is this a new rule or was this just done to reduce beeping?

A few things came to my mind while waiting:
  • The morons (sorry) that made up these "improved" rules probably decreased security. A massive crowd of 1000 people (maybe more, hard to estimate) before the screening seems like a much more attractive terrorist target than a chance to smuggle a concealed weapon through security.
  • If this situation will continue even only for a little longer, BRU Airport should create proper cordoned-off lines inside the long corridor, zigzagging forward and back.
  • Fast lane should have a separate line cordoned-off and policed at the entrance to that line (the scanner was ineffective because everybody just kept the gate open).
  • Ask the airlines to send out e-mails to their passengers asking them to arrive earlier than usual. I was caught by surprise by this, and could easily have arrived earlier had I known of this issue. (I usually arrive 50-60 minutes prior to departure and usually have enough time to spend 20 minutes in the lounge.)
  • Let me know if you think this situation will not change in the medium term. I will then rethink my "mobility strategy" and change to train or car if I can get to my destination in 5 hours or less.

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tolipanebas
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Re: Security chaos at Brussels last night

Post by tolipanebas » 25 May 2009, 16:45

SmilingBoy wrote:The morons (sorry) that made up these "improved" rules probably decreased security. A massive crowd of 1000 people (maybe more, hard to estimate) before the screening seems like a much more attractive terrorist target than a chance to smuggle a concealed weapon through security.
Indeed, if you're a terrorist today, why still bother trying to smuggle a bomb or a fire arm onboard a plane with a few tens or maybe hundred pax???? Better body-bomb yourself, stand in line at security during rush hour at BRU and blow yourself up amid 1,000+ waiting pax, all crammed into a small security checkpoint area! You'll sure make to to CNN!

FWIW, in the UK, there is a rule on the length the queues can have and the reason is exactly to avoid the scenario above; maybe BRU should take notice of it and massively hire extra staff to.. :idea:

The totally brainless way in which the rules in BRU are applied is a real joke!

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