Lufthansa acquiring Brussels Airlines

[euroflyer]

Question :
Can OW let it without reaction....
Not for B.air but well for a contaniental base in the centre of europe (MAD is excentred!)
IMO the best solution remain BA and OW.
LH has enough hubs within 900 km of BRU.

Might be the case, but

(1) BA has not really shown any interest, have they? And that not only goes for BruAir but the same for AZ or Austrian. They simply do not seem to be interested (or aible?) to take over a continental European Airline, except for the merger with Iberia of course.

(2) London is not really that far away from BRU as well, so the location of BRU would not really be that helpful for OW. From BA's point of view Austrian would make much more sense than BruAir actually.

So I think we should not expect BA to do anything about BruAir, but I might be totally wrong of course

[itami]

Question :
Can OW let it without reaction....
Not for B.air but well for a contaniental base in the centre of europe (MAD is excentred!)
IMO the best solution remain BA and OW.
LH has enough hubs within 900 km of BRU.

Indeed Airbus330lover, I cannot imagine LH is the only interested group. Look at OS who has 12 potential investors at this moment. Will 9W, OW and Brussels Airport simply let this happen ? Pressure is growing. Maybe still some surprise(s) to come soon ?

[sn26567]

Oh no, this will be the end to any somewhat decent priced tickets between Germany and Brussels ... Expect 600 Euro as minimum for a fully flexible eco return from FRA, MUC or TXL in the future just as it is today for all other nearly *Alliance-only-routes from Germany (Scandinavia, Austria, Switzerland, Poland, ...).

Well, you can already forget about decent prices to Frankfurt now. I have to fly there in three weeks, and apart from the very reasonable price offered by SN (but at impossible times), I have to pay 657 euros to LH for a non-flexible, non-refundable ticket! I only can change my return flight for an additional cost of 75 euros.

No wonder LH is so profitable and can grab all the opportunities that are appearing in neighbouring countries.

[sn26567]

A comment from a well-informed source: The merger with Lufthansa is a done deal. It will be announced soon, but the main clauses of the contract have been approved already. The press gets the news only drop by drop in order to keep the suspense.

[euroflyer]

Oh no, this will be the end to any somewhat decent priced tickets between Germany and Brussels ... Expect 600 Euro as minimum for a fully flexible eco return from FRA, MUC or TXL in the future just as it is today for all other nearly *Alliance-only-routes from Germany (Scandinavia, Austria, Switzerland, Poland, ...).

Well, you can already forget about decent prices to Frankfurt now. I have to fly there in three weeks, and apart from the very reasonable price offered by SN (but at impossible times), I have to pay 657 euros to LH for a non-flexible, non-refundable ticket! I only can change my return flight for an additional cost of 75 euros.

No wonder LH is so profitable and can grab all the opportunities that are appearing in neighbouring countries.

I know these prices just to well, I am doing FRA-BRU-FRA at least once a week now for 4 years ... But I tell you FRA-CPH or FRA-ARN is even worse .... There you do not even have the option with SN (or any other cheaper airline ...). And given the slot situation at FRA the only hope from a customer point of view is the competition authorities will require LH/SN to give a few slots on the FRA-BRU and TXL-BRU routes to Easy or Air Berlin or whoever might be interested.

And indeed LH has a number of those routes all across Europe which must make quite a lot of money.

[BrightCedars]

Well, it was the second best option in my humble opinion but I guess if the management team has decided in favor of LH it must mean that this is truly the best option for SN in the long run.

Indeed I do see SN becoming the strong African arm of the group, benefiting from some transfers from LH and LX, less from TP but they are focused on ethnic markets anyway. BRU is very well located to compete with AFKL on that market and SN does have the experience on their side. I still do not see much cooperation with SA although I'd love to be mistaken and see BRU-JNB or even BRU-CPT in the future by either SN or SA.

On the Atlantic, so we'd have a code-share with UA to IAD and perhaps something new on ORD replacing the AA service (SN metal?), a codeshare with CO to EWR and perhaps a second flight or a flight to HOU (SN metal if 2nd EWR?). And a codeshare is possible with US on PHL as well depending what they are planning in the future, will they remain in Star Alliance after CO joins?

The rest I already mentioned in a previous post.

As far as fleet renewal is concerned, I guess there will be A319/A320 to replace some of the B733/B734 and some smaller planes (CRJs, ERJs) to replace the older BAe's and some B733/B734 and provide a smaller module in the fleet (70 seats or so). Maybe newer A330s will join (would they replace the early MSNs with newer ones as well?), and whatever the LH group will choose in the future between B787 and A350 (both may end up in LH's basket but I don't think both would be needed by SN).

If fares are reasonable, I'm looking forward to use my dust collecting Privilege card anew on the BRU-FRA-BEY, BRU-LHR-BEY and BRU-IST-BEY routes now that it would all be Star Alliance, I was rather keeping the dust off my Flying Blue card since end 2001. I guess Privilege would be fully integrated into Miles&More, despite Brussels Airlines retaining its brand, as it makes much sense.

[Airbus330lover]

(2) London is not really that far away from BRU as well, so the location of BRU would not really be that helpful for OW. From BA's point of view Austrian would make much more sense than BruAir actually.

So I think we should not expect BA to do anything about BruAir, but I might be totally wrong of course

The problem with OW and BA is not the distance but the slot restrictions at LHR !.. and with a goof HST connection (< 2 hours!)....

[Atlantis]

It will be announced soon,

I guess you have 15 September in your mind

[lumumba]

I don't understand why BA is not interested in Brussels but it's good news.
I fly a lot with BA because of Privilege points but the service from BA(lounge,help-desk etc...) was always very very bad.
As SN passenger you always had to fight for your rights,in 6 years(SN and after Brussels Airlines)I never had good and friendly service from them.
As Privilege Platinum I'm very happy.
Good luck to them.
Patrice

[HighInTheSky]

It will be announced soon,

I guess you have 15 September in your mind

What did i miss about 15 September?

[fc82091]

so what does this mean for jet airways ?

[itami]

This morning I heard from a reliable source that American Airlines isn't happy neither with the 'LH-news'.

[Conti764]

It is now official and the press release is up on the Lufthansa website

http://konzern.lufthansa.com/en/html/pr ... 52/HOM&s=0

I suppose the alliance will thus be STAR and the transatlantic code shares with AA replaced by flights from UA/US... Also expect serious network reshuffles: new codeshares with SK, LH, OS, BD etc are in the pipeline, whereas BA and AY may be dumped...

If it comes trough, Continental will replace AA for flights between BRU and NY and UA will step in the BRU - ORD market, aside AA, or totally replacing it.

Well, although I am not convinced *A is a better option then OW for SN, it is positive for me to see some more CO-material in Brussels. I expect them to start operating a second daily (752?) flight to NY, since their own planes, whether it is 764 or 772 currently are pretty full and bringing in the pax of SN and a better connection to Africa, almost forces them to get more capacity on the BRU - NY market. Besides that, I can see CO starting BRU - IAH in the future as well.

Maybe US can upgrade its flights to a 332 or even 333 for BRU-PHL and UA can introduce BRU - LAX or SFO or maybe both in the longer term.

So with New York, Houston (CO), Washington, Chicago, San Fransisco, Los Angeles (UA) and Philadelphia (US) the US market would be pretty good covered from Brussels, maybe allowing SN itself to start some transatlantic flights to non-*A-airports, like Boston and an airport in the midwest.

The only question which remains is what is going to happen with Jet Airways if SN joins Star Alliance (Air India). The codeshare between both companies will certainly end and maybe 9W will pull out for BRU completely.

But of course, it's too early to jump to conclusions.

[Conti764]

Indeed Airbus330lover, I cannot imagine LH is the only interested group. Look at OS who has 12 potential investors at this moment. Will 9W, OW and Brussels Airport simply let this happen ? Pressure is growing. Maybe still some surprise(s) to come soon ?

Why would Brussels Airport care? They will be all to happy to start receiving more long haul destinations from Star Alliance and, on the other hand, encourage OW-members to maintain or maybe even expand their Brussels operations.

Although two alliances making BRU their continental Europe hub seems a little to much for a small airport as BRU.

[itami]

Why would Brussels Airport care? They will be all to happy to start receiving more long haul destinations from Star Alliance.

Have sweet dreams !

[Conti764]

Have sweet dreams !

So Brussels Airport would openly choose the side of one of the alliances (Oneworld), not caring about the alliance of their home carrier (SN) while all possible OW-connections have an alternative with *A?

[BrightCedars]

As far as the SN fleet is concerned, I identify two decisions that will be taken more or less rapidly:

1. Retirement of the 4 x BAe 146-200s that are around 20 years old

I don't see them being replaced one-on-one by a aircraft of similar size, I rather believe SN will try to get its hands on a smaller but capable twin regional jet seating around 70 to offer more frequency on some business routes.

2. Retirement of the 4 x B737s (3 x 400 and 1 x 300) that are around 18 years old

I see these being replaced by more of what will replace the BAe 146-200s and a couple B737/A319.

Rationalization around either the Boeing family or the Airbus family would seem beneficial but I don't see this happening now. So there will still be a relatively high number of types in the SN European fleet with A319, B737, Avro's and the new smaller jet I introduce. Eventually the fleet should total just 2 families that span the 70-150+ seat count.

The long-haul fleet is anybody's guest, at 14 years of age and not being the latest off the shelf specs, I do wonder whether they will be quickly replaced and/or supplemented by some newer models.

I just thought also, on a side-note, that LG being under the umbrella of LH, might we also see the reopening of the BRU-LUX route by either LG or SN?

[EBBR]

You guys are amazing! Already talking about a b.air fleet replacement

[Sparrow]

As far as the SN fleet is concerned, I identify two decisions that will be taken more or less rapidly:

1. Retirement of the 4 x BAe 146-200s that are around 20 years old

I don't see them being replaced one-on-one by a aircraft of similar size, I rather believe SN will try to get its hands on a smaller but capable twin regional jet seating around 70 to offer more frequency on some business routes.

...

Eventually the fleet should total just 2 families that span the 70-150+ seat count.

Maybe a good fleet mix for SN will be a fleet exist of:
- Airbus A319s
- Embraer E170 or E175

But I think that a fleet with planes with 150+ seats are aircrafts which are too big for SN.
Or,... Has LH ordered a lot of new CSeries of Bombardier? IMO this can be also a good airplane for the SN fleet. For longhaul SN will stay with their A330-300. Also Lufthansa ordered some for them and for LX. Maybe some options on their order for SN

Hope the best for SN

Kind regards
Bavo

[NCB]

Embraer E170 or E175

Unlikely. LH has 30 orders, 30 options for the C-series.

Great developments for SN!