VLM : still growing

Boeing767copilot · Post by **Boeing767copilot** » 05 Mar 2007, 18:51

The BAe 146 comes probably from Flightline, the AC is able to operate into airports such as London City, Florence and Monchengladbach, which are not accessible to larger aircraft due to runway and operational constraints.

Post by **Bruspotter** » 05 Mar 2007, 22:21

Hello

The livery indeed looks gorgeous , like we could expect.
I really would like to see it once. I hope it will visit EBAW once or from time to time. Really want to see this one.

Best regards: Yannick

blackbox · Post by **blackbox** » 05 Mar 2007, 23:02

blackbox wrote:

anyway, I would love to see some REAL planes in the VLM fleet in stead of those small Fokkertjes.

My wish has come true!

The livery looks great on the BAe 146 !

FlyA330 · Post by **FlyA330** » 06 Mar 2007, 09:28

anyway, I would love to see some REAL planes in the VLM fleet in stead of those small Fokkertjes.

You will not see any REAL planes in VLM if they start flying with a "146"

fokker_f27 · Post by **fokker_f27** » 06 Mar 2007, 10:04

Their fleet was perfect untill they added these clukkers. They ruined it all!

Seriously, I think it's a good choice, but the fuel burn may be a disadvantage.

jan_olieslagers · Post by **jan_olieslagers** » 06 Mar 2007, 11:16

FlyA330 wrote:
anyway, I would love to see some REAL planes in the VLM fleet in stead of those small Fokkertjes.
You will not see any REAL planes in VLM if they start flying with a "146" :lol:

Back to the days of "kleine luchtzakje" ??? Get a life!

A real plane is a plane that flies. A good plane is a plane that flies safely and reliably. The perfect plane offers safety, reliability, economical operation, and passenger comfort. That's all there is to it, boys, really all that matters!

blackbox · Post by **blackbox** » 06 Mar 2007, 16:44

FlyA330 wrote:
anyway, I would love to see some REAL planes in the VLM fleet in stead of those small Fokkertjes.
You will not see any REAL planes in VLM if they start flying with a "146"

With "real" planes I mean jet planes 8)

JAFflyer · Post by **JAFflyer** » 06 Mar 2007, 17:10

blackbox wrote:
FlyA330 wrote:
anyway, I would love to see some REAL planes in the VLM fleet in stead of those small Fokkertjes.
You will not see any REAL planes in VLM if they start flying with a "146"
With "real" planes I mean jet planes 8)

Just as I thought, another Helicopter powered high wing, 5 APU "jumbolino"
Still, I've got to admit, to operate into LCY, it's the best choice. At least VLM uses the aircraft for what it's built for: short rwy ops.

Brgds

@jan_olieslagers: Relax, let us have a laugh now and then. It'll make the world a better place

Buzz · Post by **Buzz** » 07 Mar 2007, 03:26

JAFflyer wrote:@jan_olieslagers: Relax, let us have a laugh now and then. It'll make the world a better place

You've hit the nail right on the head

summersso · Post by **summersso** » 07 Mar 2007, 09:33

JAFflyer wrote:At least VLM uses the aircraft for what it's built for: short rwy ops.

Can you indicate which aircraft VLM might be able to use for it's ops? Can't be a long list - 50-130 (?) seater category I imagine...

Would any Embraer jets work? Or Q400? Or Saab2000? These are all nice aircraft, perhaps VLM should consider a fleet renewal like Flybe have...

Comet · Post by **Comet** » 07 Mar 2007, 12:14

Any chance of VLM operating the jet on other routes? I would have thought that if they were successful on Rotterdam then it would make sense to bring them in on the BRU flights, which, in my experience, also get full.

I hope to see this jet in September at LCY, it would be even better if we could have a ride in it

burner737 · Post by **burner737** » 07 Mar 2007, 13:22

summersso wrote:
JAFflyer wrote:At least VLM uses the aircraft for what it's built for: short rwy ops.
Can you indicate which aircraft VLM might be able to use for it's ops? Can't be a long list - 50-130 (?) seater category I imagine...

Would any Embraer jets work? Or Q400? Or Saab2000? These are all nice aircraft, perhaps VLM should consider a fleet renewal like Flybe have...

No Embraer jets ... Why do you think Luxair is going to dump their embraers ? Because they can't do much with an embrear on LCY. so if the money is there maybe a Q400

Regards Tim

Post by **Bruspotter** » 07 Mar 2007, 18:44

Hello

As far as I know the Dash 8-Q400 was cancelled because of the bad demonstration that DHC did with the Dash 8-Q400 (no I don't mean flying display or something , just the professionality in wich they handled, and explaining why VLM should buy the Q400...)at EBAW.

But indeed it would be a nice replacement although this is not so much change in the fleet.

They would rather keep the F50 as long as they can but some day they have to operate another plane.

Replacement planes COULD be (just a guess , just a seizure from the offfer of available planes).

- Dornier Do 328 (either 200 or 300JET if they would go to 'Jets'.)
- Dash 8 (Q400, .... ?)
- Fokker F70 (if they switch over to jets) but personally this one has not a lot of chance I think.
- Avro RJ70 might fit , small , up to 70 places and short runway ops.
- ATR 42-500 but I don't think it's an improvement :s

I think that's quite a bit the offer they have right now , considering they have to operate sometimes from Runways of 1500m (or shorter if you calculate reserve space), example is EBAW.

The market of Biz-Jets between the 'Eclips' and 'Falcon' class is a lot bigger , but they are no good for VLM so:D

Best regards: Yannick

thofman2 · Post by **thofman2** » 08 Mar 2007, 08:50

Others solutions ... for Jet

A318 ... or Embraer 170 ?????

The question is to know which planes have the abilities to land on the favourite London VLM airport ?

JAFflyer · Post by **JAFflyer** » 08 Mar 2007, 10:48

thofman2 wrote:Others solutions ... for Jet

A318 ... or Embraer 170 ?????

The question is to know which planes have the abilities to land on the favourite London VLM airport ?

Not only to land, but can the small tarmac of LCY handle a couple of these aircraft?

summersso · Post by **summersso** » 08 Mar 2007, 11:18

Assuming VLM aren't intending to radically change their business model, which has been so successful thus far, namely flying (mainly) business passengers between small, central airports, if they are to replace the F50 then it would have to be with planes capable of landing at airports like LCY.

- Dornier Do 328 - possible but they're rare and probably too small.
- Fokker F70 - unlikely, old, no longer manufactured etc
- Avro RJ70 might fit , small , up to 70 places and short runway ops. - I agree but hardly an improvement, old Avro's, pff!
- ATR 42-500 but I don't think it's an improvement - I agree.
- Dash 8 (Q400, .... ?) - although not a jet, probably the best option available, seats c.78, fast, quiet turboprop. I like these aircraft, flown them a few times on SAS.

It appears that there is a lack of aircraft on the market suitable for a small regional airline which I find strange. Seems like the Dash 8 Q400 is the best option - shame the presentation was apparently so poor...

thofman2 · Post by **thofman2** » 08 Mar 2007, 14:20

summersso wrote: Runways are too short for the A318 and sadly, the (wonderful!) Embraer Jets.
(

It seems that Arbus was looking for the A318 certification for LCY. In may 2006 a A318 landed on LCY ... what's the rest of this story ?
Has somebody information about that ?

FlyA330 · Post by **FlyA330** » 08 Mar 2007, 16:43

The A318 is approved to fly a steep approach and they did two tests at LCY on 14th May 2006 and 29 October 2006 (see http://www.londoncityairport.com/index. ... ry&sId=960 and http://www.lcacc.org/aircraft/index.html )
The runway is not too short and in my opinion they will approve the A318 soon to operate into LCY.

summersso · Post by **summersso** » 08 Mar 2007, 17:40

Apologies meant the e-Jets, shouldn't have put A318 in that sentence! Would be a nice sight but we're unlikely to see VLM operating a fleet of A318's aren't we? Size/cost etc...

Post by **Bruspotter** » 08 Mar 2007, 22:44

Hello

Embraer EMB-175/190 is very unlikely the next coming years because they would be too expensive

and by the way already can carry more pax than needed, except when more VLM routes will have a healty grow in the next coming years.

But handling an EMB-170 isn't a problem at either of the VLM Airlines operated airports. The question is , take off with full payload :s
The same story for the A318 , the A318 is already a real 'airliner' and the capacity is also a bit high I think and certainly if you see this related to take off and landing weight. I don't see the A318 operating from let's say LIV , ANR , ...
The plane could never operate with any efficiency. It can only take off with very low payload at these runways so...even LCY could be a problem concerning safety (the plane needs to be able to have enough extra runway space and yet beeing able to fully operate safely).

Best regards: Yannick