Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

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737MAX
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Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by 737MAX » 13 May 2018, 08:49

Passenger wrote:
13 May 2018, 00:24
You know what I would do if I would work for such a bad employer? I would quit. I would go to a competitor like KLM or Ryanair, who apparently pay sooooo much more and where pressure (werkdruk) is sooooo much lower.
Yep. And that’s why everybody here with a bit of knowledge in aviation (other than pax rights) calls you an onion too...

sean1982
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sean1982 » 13 May 2018, 10:08

737MAX wrote:
13 May 2018, 08:49
Passenger wrote:
13 May 2018, 00:24
You know what I would do if I would work for such a bad employer? I would quit. I would go to a competitor like KLM or Ryanair, who apparently pay sooooo much more and where pressure (werkdruk) is sooooo much lower.
Yep. And that’s why everybody here with a bit of knowledge in aviation (other than pax rights) calls you an onion too...
I concur. And I wonder why the moderators keep tolerating this consistent lack of respect and derogatory term from passenger

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luchtzak
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by luchtzak » 13 May 2018, 10:42

sean1982 wrote:
13 May 2018, 10:08
737MAX wrote:
13 May 2018, 08:49
Passenger wrote:
13 May 2018, 00:24
You know what I would do if I would work for such a bad employer? I would quit. I would go to a competitor like KLM or Ryanair, who apparently pay sooooo much more and where pressure (werkdruk) is sooooo much lower.
Yep. And that’s why everybody here with a bit of knowledge in aviation (other than pax rights) calls you an onion too...
I concur. And I wonder why the moderators keep tolerating this consistent lack of respect and derogatory term from passenger
We don't ! Next time a message doesn't comply with our forum rules we will remove it in full !!

jan_olieslagers
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by jan_olieslagers » 13 May 2018, 10:58

And I wonder why the moderators keep tolerating this consistent lack of respect and derogatory term
Myself wonder why they keep tolerating your systematic consistent offensive against this one contributor. Even if some of his postings show a serious lack of education/good manners, we have seen far worse, about which you never uttered a word.

Well, it's not easy to be a moderator, I suppose ...

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sn26567
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by sn26567 » 13 May 2018, 11:03

Gentlemen, please, could we remain courteous and polite. Unions are not onions: they defend the rights of their members, perhaps not always in the most suitable way, but that does not justify insults. Pilots have been put under pressure and there are certainly good reasons for their anger. And management in Brussels is probably also under pressure from Germany and does not have a free hand.

Thus let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity.

Most important: no personal attacks! You may fight against ideas, not against other members.

Thanks to all for keeping this forum a nice discussion place.
André
ex Sabena #26567

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by jan_olieslagers » 13 May 2018, 11:36

Fair words, André, but when will you finally act upon them? Personal attacks between those two have been posted since as long as I can remember, I have repeatedly reported them but was systematically ignored.

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luchtzak
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by luchtzak » 13 May 2018, 11:47

I have split a part of this topic viewtopic.php?f=7&t=62807&p=367554#p367554 and posted it here.
jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:36
Fair words, André, but when will you finally act upon them? Personal attacks between those two have been posted since as long as I can remember, I have repeatedly reported them but was systematically ignored.
Those reports have been taken very seriously, with a discussion among the members of the team. Disciplinary actions have been taken in the past, and may follow in the future.

Now let's enjoy Sunday ;-)

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu » 13 May 2018, 11:48

jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:36
Fair words, André, but when will you finally act upon them? Personal attacks between those two have been posted since as long as I can remember, I have repeatedly reported them but was systematically ignored.
Once again Jan is speaking wise words!
One person in particular seems to be protected by some moderators, as soon as a post contains an insult, please remove the whole post, don’t moderate it, that is the only way to stop it.

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luchtzak
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by luchtzak » 13 May 2018, 11:52

Poiu wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:48
jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:36
Fair words, André, but when will you finally act upon them? Personal attacks between those two have been posted since as long as I can remember, I have repeatedly reported them but was systematically ignored.
Once again Jan is speaking wise words!
One person in particular seems to be protected by some moderators, as soon as a post contains an insult, please remove the whole post, don’t moderate it, that is the only way to stop it.
As I have said: we WILL remove the entire post.

Poiu
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Poiu » 13 May 2018, 11:55

luchtzak wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:52
Poiu wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:48
jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 11:36
Fair words, André, but when will you finally act upon them? Personal attacks between those two have been posted since as long as I can remember, I have repeatedly reported them but was systematically ignored.
Once again Jan is speaking wise words!
One person in particular seems to be protected by some moderators, as soon as a post contains an insult, please remove the whole post, don’t moderate it, that is the only way to stop it.
As I have said: we WILL remove the entire post.
You didn’t in the past, they were only partly moderated. This problem is ongoing for months.

DIBO
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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by DIBO » 13 May 2018, 13:04

jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 10:58
Myself wonder why they keep tolerating your systematic consistent offensive against this one contributor. Even if some of his postings show a serious lack of education/good manners, we have seen far worse
+1

Passenger
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by Passenger » 13 May 2018, 15:06

A ticket is not a promise. A ticket is a valid contract that has to be respected. Once the ticket is sold, the passengers have rights. Everyone working in the travel & tourism industry respects that basic principle.

That is my guideline for my posts, even when that principle conflicts with corporate interests (the trade unions, the pilots).

Poiu
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by Poiu » 13 May 2018, 15:18

Passenger wrote:
13 May 2018, 15:06
A ticket is not a promise. A ticket is a valid contract that has to be respected. Once the ticket is sold, the passengers have rights. Everyone working in the travel & tourism industry respects that basic principle.

That is my guideline for my posts, even when that principle conflicts with corporate interests (the trade unions, the pilots).
NOBODY has a problem with that, quite the opposite, just do it without insulting people and without using strong language!

Passenger
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by Passenger » 13 May 2018, 20:23

Poiu wrote:
13 May 2018, 15:18
Passenger wrote:
13 May 2018, 15:06
A ticket is not a promise. A ticket is a valid contract that has to be respected. Once the ticket is sold, the passengers have rights. Everyone working in the travel & tourism industry respects that basic principle.

That is my guideline for my posts, even when that principle conflicts with corporate interests (the trade unions, the pilots).
NOBODY has a problem with that, quite the opposite, just do it without insulting people and without using strong language!
Maybe we can agree to disagree? I think that the insults and the strong language comes from the trade unions and the pilots, by going on strike.

jan_olieslagers
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by jan_olieslagers » 13 May 2018, 20:59

This thread has been split off from the SNBA and strike matter, and there was a good reason for that. This thread is about good manners on this forum. No pilot has posted gross language here, neither has any trade union.

Passenger
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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by Passenger » 13 May 2018, 21:40

jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 20:59
No pilot has posted gross language here, neither has any trade union.
Hard to discuss with you when you don't read my posts. I just wrote - so I repeat for you: "...I think that the insults and the strong language comes from the trade unions and the pilots, by going on strike..." If you would have just a tiny bit of knowledge of the tourism & travel trade, you would agree with me there. This strike causes voluntary damage not only to the airline but also to touroperators and passengers, and the trade unions and the pilots know this.

jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 20:59
This thread has been split off from the SNBA and strike matter, and there was a good reason for that. This thread is about good manners on this forum.
De pot verwijt de ketel dat hij zwart ziet. May I remind you to a post from you about me - and I quote you: "Even if some of his postings show a serious lack of education/good manners...".

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Re: Brussels Airlines in 2018

Post by Acid-drop » 15 May 2018, 19:03

jan_olieslagers wrote:
13 May 2018, 10:58
And I wonder why the moderators keep tolerating this consistent lack of respect and derogatory term
Myself wonder why they keep tolerating your systematic consistent offensive against this one contributor. Even if some of his postings show a serious lack of education/good manners, we have seen far worse, about which you never uttered a word.

Well, it's not easy to be a moderator, I suppose ...
I didnt follow the start of this, I don't care about the strike and I do beleive that once you reach that level of education and luxury, you shouldnt strike anymore, you should leave for better, if you beleive it exists.
Now, about the moderator thing, I personnally find it very concerning.
In what kind of banana republic do we demand moderation and censorship. Will you scream for a public burn on the main square too ?
It is a UTTER SHAME that some people are unable to listen or read other people opinion and demand censorship. Its about ignoring why our ancestors fighted for.
If you cant read or listen, YOU should leave.
I was once a moderator and had to resign simply because people cant figure how a moderator can have his own opinions, which differs from the political correctness of her magesty the self assigned propriety decorum.

We heard in the news today a form of liberty of expression. It hurts !
Its a shame, its digusting, its something that should change everybody opinion for good, if it wasnt the case already.
But its fair and good we heard them because everybody has the right to say what they have in their brains. Now you have all the cards to make your conclusions and if needed actions. But dont fight the words, fight the idea.
My messages reflect my personal opinion which may be different than yours. I beleive a forum is made to create a debate so I encourage people to express themselves, the way they want, with the ideas they want. I expect the same understanding in return.

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Re: Please let us respect all opinions and discuss with serenity, please no personal attacks

Post by jan_olieslagers » 15 May 2018, 20:07

<very careful>

Thanks for your comment, @Acid_drop. Much appreciated because you keep a distance. Still I am afraid I cannot totally agree: while "the idea" must indeed be prime, basic politeness is also required. In other words: while the content is most important, the packing ("emballage") must meet some minimum, too. May I offer the comparison to a bar or café or pub? Everybody are welcome, as long as they pay for their drink. But one must be polite towards other patrons too. Myself admittedly am even more demanding: I expect people to be dressed accordingly. For an extreme example, there is one restaurant that I no longer visit, in spite of their nice location and good cuisine, because they're infested with cyclists in their flashy outfits. I consider such patrons impolite, and where management tolerates impolite patrons there I will not go (and spend my money). In the same way, I will not visit (and contribute to) forums where moderators tolerate impolite opinions, and I will even consider careless spelling impolite. The management of this forum doesn't always follow me - I do realise I am quite demanding :) - but they do have insisted against personal attacks. That's a good beginning, at least.

PS not clear to what news item of today you are referring?

[[edited to add:]] May I also point out that, on this forum as on most, I find the most interesting postings coming from the most polite posters? With of course both "interesting" and "polite" being very personal appreciations.

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