Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

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Bralo20
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Re: Trivia 2018 (miscellaneous news)

Post by Bralo20 » 14 Jan 2018, 11:51

It will be quite an achievement to recover the plane from it's position.

Giving a weight of somewhere around 40 to 45 tons, the fact that the center of the plane is approximately 70 to 80 meters located from the center of the runway (you can maybe retract a few meters depending on the stability of the edge and thus being able to position the crane closer to the edge) it will be a very hard recovery since there's no hydraulic crane in the world that can lift that weight at that radius, not even the 1.200 ton Liebherr LTM 11200 is capable of lifting it. (hydraulic cranes are preferred due to the time it takes to make them operational, depending on the needed configuration of the crane it can de done in hours versus days with a lattice boom crane) Even a tandem lift isn't likely to be achievable due to the lack of positioning space for lifting. I can see a lift happen with a so called lattice boom crane but those cranes take a while to construct which will likely stop airport operations for up to 2 weeks. From the sea side I don't see a crane barge being able to come close enough due to lack of depth and the height where the plane is positioned (and thus also needing a very long boom to achieve the radius).

Another option might be using some heavy winches but I'm not sure a modern plane is strong enough to withstand the forces generated during the winching (not only the weight but the suction of the mud, the drag of the plane,...)

In short, it will be interesting to see how they are going to recover it.

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by luchtzak » 14 Jan 2018, 12:42

I wrongly wrote that the incident/accident was a runway incursion, changed now ;-)

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 12:47

Recovery from the runway would be quite an enterprise indeed. Crane(s) on ship/barge? Could the Antwerp port rent out their "Grote Gust" floating crane? :)

Or helicopter? But even a Mi-26 has a payload of "only" 20 tons so at least two would be needed.
Last edited by jan_olieslagers on 14 Jan 2018, 14:08, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by sn26567 » 14 Jan 2018, 13:30

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by luchtzak » 14 Jan 2018, 14:08

pitrixplanespotting wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 13:52
Little bit strange position, wondering how they did that!
Ice and rain.


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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 14:25

wondering how they did that
Have you spent much time piloting?

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by Bralo20 » 14 Jan 2018, 15:42

jan_olieslagers wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 12:47
Recovery from the runway would be quite an enterprise indeed. Crane(s) on ship/barge? Could the Antwerp port rent out their "Grote Gust" floating crane? :)

Or helicopter? But even a Mi-26 has a payload of "only" 20 tons so at least two would be needed.
A barge isn't an option due to the shallow depth and the curvature of the shoreline (unless they dredge the location). Also, the crane you mention, "Grote Gust", has been scrapped in 2006. It's successor, Brabo, with a theoretical capacity of 800 tons is available but has a limited boom of 65 meters which isn't even slightly as long as it should be to be able to lift it from the sea side. Also, if you lengthen the boom (which isn't possible with Brabo) you'll decrease the capacity of the crane (same applies to every type of crane). There are bigger barge cranes available around the world but the same issues apply: depth near the shore, curvature of the shoreline to be able to get a decent lifting position, the lack of length of booms of set barge cranes and the limited lifting capacity with increasing radius.

If the ground is stable enough (stability can be increased by ground plates which are spreading the weight and thus decreasing the pressure) the crane can be positioned close to the edge and of the concrete. However, this all depends on the ground, if the ground is made of of rock then it shouldn't be a big problem to have the necessary ground stability but if the ground is made of of dirt (like it suggest due the plane being stuck in a muddy substance) then it's something else.

It all depends on the ground stability and the ability of the crane(s) being able to set up near the edge, the closer to the edge the lesser the radius will be for the crane to be able to lift, the lower the radius, the higher the lifting capacity of the crane(s).

And if nothing works and the insurance deems the plane to be an economic loss (can be when you include the recovery costs) they can always leave it there for now and part it out later.

Anyway, first steps will be to drain the plane of all fluids, any leak can cause further environmental damage.

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by luchtzak » 14 Jan 2018, 16:05

luchtzak wrote:
13 Jan 2018, 23:21
Pegasus Airlines runway incursion at Trabzon, Turkey. No injuries.

http://www.aviation24.be/airlines/pegas ... n-trabzon/

Image
Extra movies and pictures in the article!

Weather at the moment of accident:

Landed RW11 at 143 knots (via Mode C). Weather: LTCG 132050Z 25001KT 2800 -RA BR BKN004 BKN025 08/07 Q1021 BECMG TL2100 3200

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 16:10

Landed RW11 at 143 knots
¿¿¿ 143 knots what ???

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by DeltaWiskey » 14 Jan 2018, 16:26

Mode C = ground speed

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by KriVa » 14 Jan 2018, 16:54

Pedantic, I know, but that would be Mode S. Mode C doesn’t support a speed readout ;-)
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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by sn26567 » 14 Jan 2018, 16:56

Bralo20 wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 15:42
And if nothing works and the insurance deems the plane to be an economic loss (can be when you include the recovery costs) they can always leave it there for now and part it out later.
From all the pictures I could see, the plane incurred significant damage. I fear indeed that it will be a hull loss.
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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 16:57

Pedantic, I know, but that would be Mode S. Mode C doesn’t support a speed readout
In that case, I am pedantic, too... :)

But frankly, I was more confused by the "143 knots" being in the "weather" paragraph so I could only imagine 143 knots wind - which would take a lot of believing ... All clear now, thanks.

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by luchtzak » 14 Jan 2018, 17:05

jan_olieslagers wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 16:57
Pedantic, I know, but that would be Mode S. Mode C doesn’t support a speed readout
In that case, I am pedantic, too... :)

But frankly, I was more confused by the "143 knots" being in the "weather" paragraph so I could only imagine 143 knots wind - which would take a lot of believing ... All clear now, thanks.
1 knot wind will most likely not be the reason for going off the runway :roll:

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 17:09

Agreed :) But 143 knots wind would be a good reason to not try landing - not even to think about it :)

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by Passenger » 14 Jan 2018, 17:25

sn26567 wrote:
14 Jan 2018, 16:56
From all the pictures I could see, the plane incurred significant damage. I fear indeed that it will be a hull loss.
Indeed. And we cannot see yet what damage the landing gears have caused.

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Re: Pegasus Airlines off the runway at Trabzon; Boeing 737-82R registered TC-CPF

Post by jan_olieslagers » 14 Jan 2018, 18:47

Yes indeed, looking more and more like a write-off. According to wikipedia, one engine broke off to drop into the water - a severe loss, economically.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegasus_A ... light_8622 - but that article has been nominated for deletion.

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