Brussels Airport (BRU) infrastructure: future

Join this forum to discuss the latest news that happened in the world of commercial aviation.

Moderator: Latest news team

Post Reply
Passenger
Posts: 7263
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Passenger »

The Flemish government has agreed on a legislation change for taxis. The government will now ask judicial advise, and then ask Parliament to vote.

Uber will have to follow some rules, and a basic knowledge of Dutch will be implemented for all taxi drivers picking up clients in the Flemish Region. Thus also outside Brussels Airport.

At this moment, there isn't much official info available yet, except this press release:

Beslissingen van de Vlaamse regering. Individueel bezoldigd personenvervoer.
Op voorstel van minister Ben Weyts: "...De Vlaamse Regering hecht haar principiële goedkeuring aan het voorontwerp van decreet over het individueel bezoldigd personenvervoer. Het decreet moet zorgen voor de actualisering en modernisering van de taxiregelgeving, met een evenwicht tussen innovatie en flexibiliteit enerzijds en normering anderzijds. Over dit voorontwerp van decreet wordt het advies ingewonnen van de MORA en daarna van de Raad van State..."

User avatar
Vic Diesel
Posts: 330
Joined: 06 Feb 2018, 10:10

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Vic Diesel »

Homo Aeroportus wrote: 19 Apr 2018, 14:11Maybe a way to express one's dissatisfaction would be similar to the common practice in the USA : banners alongside the road "Honk if you want Senator X to leave office".
May I suggest "Fart if you don't like waiting".
:mrgreen:
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Best regards,
Viktor

(Budapest-born, Vienna-raised, Brussels-based)

jan_olieslagers
Posts: 3049
Joined: 24 Jun 2006, 08:34
Location: Vl.Brabant
Contact:

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

@Passenger: thanks, but didn't I understand the new law (or "ruling"?) specifically excludes Brussels Airport, where taxi operations are controlled by (one or other) Brussels authority?

User avatar
Conti764
Posts: 1891
Joined: 21 Sep 2007, 23:21

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Conti764 »

jan_olieslagers wrote: 20 Apr 2018, 17:25 @Passenger: thanks, but didn't I understand the new law (or "ruling"?) specifically excludes Brussels Airport, where taxi operations are controlled by (one or other) Brussels authority?
Brussels has no authority at all. Flemish taxi's can only pick up from BRU and Brussels taxi's from the city. The other way around is forbidden for both.

User avatar
sn26567
Posts: 40815
Joined: 13 Feb 2003, 00:00
Location: Rosières/Rozieren, Belgium
Contact:

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by sn26567 »

Conti764 wrote: 20 Apr 2018, 17:52Flemish taxi's can only pick up from BRU and Brussels taxi's from the city. The other way around is forbidden for both.
This makes taxis between Brussels and its airport so expensive: they are empty on half of their itinerary. Is it so difficult for the Brussels and Flemish regions to come to an agreement in order to solve that problem?
André
ex Sabena #26567

Passenger
Posts: 7263
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Passenger »

I haven't found the text of Flemish government yet - only this press release from minister Weyts:
https://www.benweyts.be/nieuws/iedereen ... sche-taxis

When the government indeed is going to amend the current legislation for all Flemish cities, I don't think that the Raad van State / Conseil D'Etat will accept an exception for Zaventem / Brussels Airport.

sean1982
Posts: 3260
Joined: 18 Mar 2003, 00:00
Contact:

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by sean1982 »

Part 6547 of the saga:

Electronic passport gates closed again in arrivals. Current waiting time about 1 hour, for non-european passports: 1 desk for a queue as far as the eye can see :roll:

Only one word for this airport: incompetent.

Jetter
Posts: 480
Joined: 06 Nov 2015, 21:07

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Jetter »

sean1982 wrote: 21 Apr 2018, 15:48Only one word for this airport: incompetent.
I'd like to add a second word: ignorant.

User avatar
Conti764
Posts: 1891
Joined: 21 Sep 2007, 23:21

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Conti764 »

sn26567 wrote: 20 Apr 2018, 18:44
Conti764 wrote: 20 Apr 2018, 17:52Flemish taxi's can only pick up from BRU and Brussels taxi's from the city. The other way around is forbidden for both.
This makes taxis between Brussels and its airport so expensive: they are empty on half of their itinerary. Is it so difficult for the Brussels and Flemish regions to come to an agreement in order to solve that problem?
It is... The same with public transportation. Why still no subway or at least trams to BRU? The old trainstation would be ideal for it...

User avatar
Atlantis
Posts: 4912
Joined: 12 Apr 2005, 00:00

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Atlantis »

There is again and again a lot of BRU bashing the last couple of weeks. And this mostly from people who have completely no idea how modern airports are working nowadays and who have a very, very conservative and negative way of thinking about life.

1) Shops, restaurants, Duty Free is all needed in an airport and it will become even more. The revenue/profit from it is for those ones who invest in it, shareholders, personel of BRU and the pax. The first three ones I'm not going to explain in detail because this is private issue and not your business but the last one, pax, is why this airport can invest in renovation of the whole B-pier, extension of A-pier West, having a very modern luggage handling system, making Brucargo better, attracting new intercontinental carriers, etc etc.
On other European airports, ME or in the States, the shops and very loud commercials are much worser then here at BRU. So I can only assume that this is about people who don't travel much, jealousy and have no liberal way of thinking/business.
The issue of lack of security personel at the security check is a matter of that company itself. Brussels airport give a mandate for several years to handling, catering and security companies. How they fill in the people on the "floor" itself is a matter of that specific company.

2) Public transport: There is an agreement with MIVB to prolong the tramline from NATO to Brussels Airport. MIVB will start the construction works in some time.
Also De Lijn is going to connect the airport with a few Flemish cities around the airport. So this is all in the business plan and will be executed.

3) Real Estate: if you are really from this modern time then you should know that many years ago companies were eager to have their offices or HQ in the city center, to be in the middle. With all the traffic jams and difficulties they see that it is not possible anymore for their staff and clients to reach the office on time and that it is not attractive anymore to be in a city center.
Since a couple of years we can see at many airports around the world that good brands wants to have their office at an airport. Lately we can see the same with train stations. Years ago the environment of train stations were places to avoid bcs it was unsafe, dirty, etc. Now, companies are buying all ground around train stations to have the company close to public transport.
And this is the issue. First, visibility. Brands wants to be visible everywhere and second they want to be attractive and one of the ways is to offer close by public transport.

On a side note. Of course there are issues who can be better. Don't forget that an airport is a city on itself and that thousands of people are working there. It is normal that something can go wrong. Being perfect don't exist. The airport is very well aware of this and works daily on some pain points but never forget that an airport has to deal with a lot of governmental agreements/issues and companies and that it never can act on it's own.

So before you lose your time, energy and showing your conservative way of thinking if a shop should be at least 3 meters away from you so that you have a free way to your gate, think maybe how you can improve your time management. Maybe, and mostly, your arranging your time is not correct.

So, take some time to analyse this and if you still have the feeling to bash, there is always 24/7 the complaint service of BRU, but mostly people don't have the guts to do it and using social media.

I wish you all a very nice, warm and positive evening and enjoy your trip via our very beautiful Brussels Airport.

JOVAN
Posts: 488
Joined: 08 Jun 2006, 00:00

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by JOVAN »

Atlantis wrote: 21 Apr 2018, 21:00 There is again and again a lot of BRU bashing the last couple of weeks. And this mostly from people who have completely no idea how modern airports are working nowadays and who have a very, very conservative and negative way of thinking about life.

1) Shops, restaurants, Duty Free is all needed in an airport and it will become even more. The revenue/profit from it is for those ones who invest in it, shareholders, personel of BRU and the pax. The first three ones I'm not going to explain in detail because this is private issue and not your business but the last one, pax, is why this airport can invest in renovation of the whole B-pier, extension of A-pier West, having a very modern luggage handling system, making Brucargo better, attracting new intercontinental carriers, etc etc.
On other European airports, ME or in the States, the shops and very loud commercials are much worser then here at BRU. So I can only assume that this is about people who don't travel much, jealousy and have no liberal way of thinking/business.
The issue of lack of security personel at the security check is a matter of that company itself. Brussels airport give a mandate for several years to handling, catering and security companies. How they fill in the people on the "floor" itself is a matter of that specific company.

2) Public transport: There is an agreement with MIVB to prolong the tramline from NATO to Brussels Airport. MIVB will start the construction works in some time.
Also De Lijn is going to connect the airport with a few Flemish cities around the airport. So this is all in the business plan and will be executed.

3) Real Estate: if you are really from this modern time then you should know that many years ago companies were eager to have their offices or HQ in the city center, to be in the middle. With all the traffic jams and difficulties they see that it is not possible anymore for their staff and clients to reach the office on time and that it is not attractive anymore to be in a city center.
Since a couple of years we can see at many airports around the world that good brands wants to have their office at an airport. Lately we can see the same with train stations. Years ago the environment of train stations were places to avoid bcs it was unsafe, dirty, etc. Now, companies are buying all ground around train stations to have the company close to public transport.
And this is the issue. First, visibility. Brands wants to be visible everywhere and second they want to be attractive and one of the ways is to offer close by public transport.

On a side note. Of course there are issues who can be better. Don't forget that an airport is a city on itself and that thousands of people are working there. It is normal that something can go wrong. Being perfect don't exist. The airport is very well aware of this and works daily on some pain points but never forget that an airport has to deal with a lot of governmental agreements/issues and companies and that it never can act on it's own.

So before you lose your time, energy and showing your conservative way of thinking if a shop should be at least 3 meters away from you so that you have a free way to your gate, think maybe how you can improve your time management. Maybe, and mostly, your arranging your time is not correct.

So, take some time to analyse this and if you still have the feeling to bash, there is always 24/7 the complaint service of BRU, but mostly people don't have the guts to do it and using social media.

I wish you all a very nice, warm and positive evening and enjoy your trip via our very beautiful Brussels Airport.
Hello Atlantis,

I am a passenger, and a regular user of BRU and about 25 big airports I use, worldwide, in Europe, Asia and Latin America.
Sorry but BRU plays in a lower league; despite its location, the huge opportunities, relative good connectivity ,etc it remains an un-attractive airport.
Nothing changes for the better, or it goes very, very slowly. And invisible for the users.

Only the Connector and Pier A are international standard.

The rest, all the rest is SUB-standard, and actually a shame for Belgium.
I blame the BRU management for giving such a poor image of our country to PAX arriving here.
Please have a look at all the arrival places: taxis, parkings, buses,...

Sorry to see again and again that BRU has no ambition to become better.

Real estate and shopping are maybe the money makers, but what is wrong about making things more atractive for PAX, more user friendly,

Really it is time to ask the (free of charge) advise of the users; what they think of the airport .
Let a professional company do the job, publish the reesults and act accordingly.

I am not a BRU basher, but a progressive-thinking user.
Apparently you consider people with a different idea from yours as " conservative".
That is your right, but .... well

Good & warm evening to you as well.

jan_olieslagers
Posts: 3049
Joined: 24 Jun 2006, 08:34
Location: Vl.Brabant
Contact:

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by jan_olieslagers »

De Lijn is going to connect the airport with a few Flemish cities around the airport. So this is all in the business plan and will be executed.
From other sources I understand the proposed rail link (tram?) Heizel-Vilvoorde-Airport has been mothballed and will not begin implementation anywhere soon. De Lijn does operate buses, though, a good beginning; but more needs to be done.

Boavida
Posts: 585
Joined: 14 Sep 2010, 23:54

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Boavida »

Just for the record: after almost 1 YEAR, the works on the new ceiling + lights in the arrival hall ARE STILL NOT FINISHED. I repeat: for 1 entire year the arrival hall looks like a construction site. If this isn't incompetence in its purest form, I don't know what is.

Who is responsible for this mess? Who are the planners?

Poiu
Posts: 897
Joined: 14 Nov 2015, 09:38

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Poiu »

Atlantis wrote: 21 Apr 2018, 21:00 There is again and again a lot of BRU bashing the last couple of weeks. And this mostly from people who have completely no idea how modern airports are working nowadays and who have a very, very conservative and negative way of thinking about life.

1) Shops, restaurants, Duty Free is all needed in an airport and it will become even more. The revenue/profit from it is for those ones who invest in it, shareholders, personel of BRU and the pax. The first three ones I'm not going to explain in detail because this is private issue and not your business but the last one, pax, is why this airport can invest in renovation of the whole B-pier, extension of A-pier West, having a very modern luggage handling system, making Brucargo better, attracting new intercontinental carriers, etc etc.
On other European airports, ME or in the States, the shops and very loud commercials are much worser then here at BRU. So I can only assume that this is about people who don't travel much, jealousy and have no liberal way of thinking/business.
The issue of lack of security personel at the security check is a matter of that company itself. Brussels airport give a mandate for several years to handling, catering and security companies. How they fill in the people on the "floor" itself is a matter of that specific company.

2) Public transport: There is an agreement with MIVB to prolong the tramline from NATO to Brussels Airport. MIVB will start the construction works in some time.
Also De Lijn is going to connect the airport with a few Flemish cities around the airport. So this is all in the business plan and will be executed.

3) Real Estate: if you are really from this modern time then you should know that many years ago companies were eager to have their offices or HQ in the city center, to be in the middle. With all the traffic jams and difficulties they see that it is not possible anymore for their staff and clients to reach the office on time and that it is not attractive anymore to be in a city center.
Since a couple of years we can see at many airports around the world that good brands wants to have their office at an airport. Lately we can see the same with train stations. Years ago the environment of train stations were places to avoid bcs it was unsafe, dirty, etc. Now, companies are buying all ground around train stations to have the company close to public transport.
And this is the issue. First, visibility. Brands wants to be visible everywhere and second they want to be attractive and one of the ways is to offer close by public transport.

On a side note. Of course there are issues who can be better. Don't forget that an airport is a city on itself and that thousands of people are working there. It is normal that something can go wrong. Being perfect don't exist. The airport is very well aware of this and works daily on some pain points but never forget that an airport has to deal with a lot of governmental agreements/issues and companies and that it never can act on it's own.

So before you lose your time, energy and showing your conservative way of thinking if a shop should be at least 3 meters away from you so that you have a free way to your gate, think maybe how you can improve your time management. Maybe, and mostly, your arranging your time is not correct.

So, take some time to analyse this and if you still have the feeling to bash, there is always 24/7 the complaint service of BRU, but mostly people don't have the guts to do it and using social media.

I wish you all a very nice, warm and positive evening and enjoy your trip via our very beautiful Brussels Airport.

Bashing???
Do you realise the people giving FEEDBACK here are your customers? Most of them are frequent flyers and know what they are talking about! The fact that the feedback is not positive for the airport doesn’t give you the right to insult the messengers!
- the shops: are they really needed? They are always empty, I honestly don’t understand how they can be profitable. Do you have to force people to walk through the shops? I use BRU 50 times a year and have never seen an arriving passenger entering a shop. It has been said here before: they way both arriving and departing passengers are pushed through the connector is a disaster waiting to happen in case of a fire or panic outbreak.
- lack of security: you remain responsible for your sub-contractors, if they do what they want you signed the wrong contract. So again, blame yourself not your customer.
- passport control: I am sure there must be way, can’t BRU pay the state to have more border police at the airport?

The airport is aware they have a de facto monopoly position, the proof is the way you just addressed your customers.
An airport is a public transport facility which should be cost neutral with the only objective to provide an efficient and fluent as possible service.

User avatar
lumumba
Posts: 2046
Joined: 04 Sep 2003, 00:00
Location: brussels Europe

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba »

Another big problem is that there is nothing for the visitors bringing or picking up the passengers.
Before you could go upstairs at least drink something the food was bad like in a school cafeteria but at least have a view on the traffic it was already poor compare to other airports but today there is nothing just some fast foods and one with a poor view.
Also when you arrive true this custom area can they not make it bigger and more friendly when you arrive on a crowded morning you have to do the queue that's crazy in no other airport in the WORLD it happens.
There are 3 doors use them no they just use one!
I was in Geneva last week and there it's fantastic you can really enjoy your time beautiful view nice dinner and services.

No for me Brussels Airport looks more like a prison today!

On the bright side for passengers arriving or going to a Schengen flight it's very very easy.
I often get my train after 15 minutes after landing,landing not disembarkation !
In fact after landing I'm in less than in one hour home with the train and metro so this is really good even very good and comfortable.
Another strong point is sushi bar in front of the tarmac nice food beautiful view but that for the travelers.
I also tried the Italian one but it's average.

Atlantis I think you better use what is said here it's like written before it's mostly frequent flyers with experience giving a opinion.
The feeling we got here is that Brussels Airport is very busy with making profit but is doing nothing to improve and it's urgent....

Is there no survey somewhere to compare what passengers think?
Hasta la victoria siempre.

sean1982
Posts: 3260
Joined: 18 Mar 2003, 00:00
Contact:

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by sean1982 »

Atlantis wrote: 21 Apr 2018, 21:00
So, take some time to analyse this and if you still have the feeling to bash, there is always 24/7 the complaint service of BRU, but mostly people don't have the guts to do it and using social media.
Oh believe me, I do, but always get the same answer that doesn't help anyone: It's the police's problem, not ours. Just shows a lot of unwillingness to help.

Passenger
Posts: 7263
Joined: 06 Dec 2010, 20:54

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by Passenger »

Amazing. We have someone here who really knows what he's talking about - Atlantis - and he took time to explain that every now and then, indeed, some things don't go as smoothly as was planned. Not because of cruel savings by Brussels Airport, but because of operational errors by contracted third parties.

But yet, Atlantis is countered by some here, as he's trying to defend the devil. Facts proof Atlantis is right: an airport with a lot competition cannot grow when it's that bad as some people here pretend. If so, passengers -and surely frequent flyers- would remember their worst experience ever, and never use Brussels Airport again. After all, Brussels Airport is no "public transport facility", but a private business.

Same for Atlantis' remarks about the shops: Brussels Airports has a % on their sales. So it's in the interest of the Airport that shops are doing good business.

JOVAN
Posts: 488
Joined: 08 Jun 2006, 00:00

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by JOVAN »

Passenger wrote: 22 Apr 2018, 11:04 Amazing. We have someone here who really knows what he's talking about - Atlantis - and he took time to explain that every now and then, indeed, some things don't go as smoothly as was planned. Not because of cruel savings by Brussels Airport, but because of operational errors by contracted third parties.

But yet, Atlantis is countered by some here, as he's trying to defend the devil. Facts proof Atlantis is right: an airport with a lot competition cannot grow when it's that bad as some people here pretend. If so, passengers -and surely frequent flyers- would remember their worst experience ever, and never use Brussels Airport again. After all, Brussels Airport is no "public transport facility", but a private business.

Same for Atlantis' remarks about the shops: Brussels Airports has a % on their sales. So it's in the interest of the Airport that shops are doing good business.
Atlantis' explanations are maybe honest and (partly) correct.
The result of this management and attitude towards (frequent) travellers is deceiving.

And Mr. Faust and c° are responsible for the choice of their subcontractors.
How poor to say they cannot do anyting about it.

management change at BRU becomes urgent.
With Calimero's there is no hope for improvement.

And this is a forum, where also PAX have access to; not only the "in-crowd".
So please accept othe person's idea's and opinions.

convair
Posts: 1944
Joined: 18 Nov 2011, 00:02

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by convair »

Passenger wrote: 22 Apr 2018, 11:04 Facts proof Atlantis is right: an airport with a lot competition cannot grow when it's that bad as some people here pretend.
BRU grows because
1. Air travel has been growing for years and continues to do so;
2. It has a large catchment area and, as said above, it enjoys a kind of monopoly.
Passenger wrote: 22 Apr 2018, 11:04 After all, Brussels Airport is no "public transport facility", but a private business.
That might be the problem.
Passenger wrote: 22 Apr 2018, 11:04 Same for Atlantis' remarks about the shops: Brussels Airports has a % on their sales. So it's in the interest of the Airport that shops are doing good business.
:lol: They certainly see to that without hesitation and, usually, to the detriment of their pax' (their CUSTOMERS') comfort.

What Atlantis calls BRU bashing are justified complaints by users. Not all of them are directed to BRU management itself; some (many maybe) of them concern various authorities and subcontractors, but all of them make the use of BRU unpleasant.
Instead of insulting their critics, BRU should be thankful to them as they help BRU turn to the "other ones concerned" and demand important and urgent changes from their part as well.

User avatar
lumumba
Posts: 2046
Joined: 04 Sep 2003, 00:00
Location: brussels Europe

Re: BRU infrastructure: future

Post by lumumba »

What Atlantis need to understand is that it's not bashing (most of the time)but a real concern about OUR airport.
Last edited by lumumba on 22 Apr 2018, 20:05, edited 1 time in total.
Hasta la victoria siempre.

Post Reply